Automakers gearing up for electric cars

The Fort Worth Star-Telegram ^ | December 5, 2008 | Renee Schoof

[2ndDivisionVet]

Now that automakers are all busy gearing up to make electric vehicles, consumers should be getting a choice of roomy, speedy, gasoline-free models that charge up at a standard 110-volt socket.

So when will those cars roll out of factories so plentifully that prices drop to what ordinary people can afford?

That was the question at the Electric Drive Transportation Association conference and exhibition in Washington this week, and on Capitol Hill as well, as the Big Three automakers made a pitch for aid. The recession, the credit crunch and the dominance of oil-driven transportation will make it difficult.

However, automakers see the future — more gas price spikes, diminishing oil resources, the need to cut carbon dioxide to prevent climate catastrophe. They also see an incoming president, Barack Obama, who as a senator co-sponsored a plan to give tax credits for electric vehicles and now calls for 1 million plug-in, hybrid, made-in-America cars that get up to 150 miles per gallon.

As part of their pitch to Congress, Ford, Chrysler and General Motors promised to push ahead with electric vehicles, even though they’re money-losers now. Ford this week, for the first time, announced details of what it has in the works for electric-drive vehicles, including a battery-electric van slated for commercial fleet use in 2010 and a battery-electric sedan in 2011.

Japan is going electric, too. Mitsubishi, for example, plans to launch its small iMiEV electric car next summer and test it in California, Europe and in New Zealand. Nissan plans a Real Car with a 100-mile range that it promises will meet all highway safety tests and offer all the hot gizmos such as GPS and heated seats.

[Sacajaweau]

We had so little plastic stuff when we were kids. Garbage was incinerated back then. Most of it could have been used for fertilizer.

When plastics came along, it caused fires at the incineration plants.

It's one of the reasons I still believe in septic systems...nature's way!!

[Aquinasfan]

Gas is going to head back up to $70 to $75 and stabilise around there. Now it’s just gyrating badly after the over-buying that nearly brought it to $150. It may spin up and down a bit more after this, but it will stick to $70 in the long run.

Probably, but who knows for sure? Do you want Chris Dodd and Al Gore making that call, or the people in the business?

Also, world-wide spending power is down so a car that saves fuel is always a good thing. I add in the caveat — each thing has it’s purpose, nothing but a heavy duty SUV will do for off-roading or farming duty. But for city driving for 1 person, no way does it make any sense.,

True. But there hasn't been any significant demand for small cars until this year. Moreover, the SUV phenomenon was driven both by consumer demand and government regulations that established different fuel economy standards for cars and "trucks."

The solution to the auto crisis is to let the car companies go into Chapter 11 and reorganize, minus the crazy union contracts. Toyota and other car companies manufacturing cars here in the US are doing fine.

[Cronos]

Oil will stick to that value in the future as there is increased demand from countries bringing themselves out of poverty. Plus there is a need to conserve oil so that future generations can have plastic goods, drive fast cars or go off-road.

Business works with shocks -- after the 70s oil shock, all the gas guzzler disappeared, YET, you got more powerful, more efficient cars. Vehicle manufacturers are learning that you can do more with less. Even factories that go green realise that they are making substantial savings. Silly, knee-jerk environmentalism isn't right, but thought-through actions end up saving $$, creating better products and giving a better environment for everyone

You're right about the government regulation leading to a demand for SUVs. And you're also right that small car demand is now up because the consumer decided that is what they want.

Your point about chapter 11 is also spot on accurate

[irishjuggler]

It’s only supposed to get 26mpg. Spend a lot of time idling in traffic?

I do spend a fair amount of time idling at stoplights, but the 2006 sticker promised 30 city / 40 highway. Don't take my word for it. See:

With the optional five-speed automatic transmission, the Civic is rated at 30 mpg city and 40 mpg highway by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).
http://www.automedia.com/2006_Honda_Civic_Sedan/rts20051101hc/1

I know that in a traffic-clogged city, my numbers might end up being a bit lower, but they shouldn't be THAT much lower. My old GM vehicle promised 23 city / 32 highway, and I used to average around 24 mpg, so I expected to do at least that well with the supposedly more fuel efficient Civic. Instead, I'm doing a bit worse. No wonder Honda had to reduce their estimate to the 26 figure that you cite.

[jveritas]

You could have bought a used Cadillac CTS 2005 model with 30,000 miles for $ 15,000 which is the same price as your Honda Civic.

[norraad]

The advantage of a gas engine is that it can be converted to propane, obstensively, raising to pressure at the injector until it comes out as near to a gas as possible, instead of the plantsprayer type dribble we've had for decades, would almost double MPG and no byproducts to boot (no pollution, wouldn't even need catalytic converters burning wasted fuel under your a$$).

This would be much easier than the propane convertion, which I love btw, but so few will do it.

For the longest time cafe MPG was stealthily determined by big oil to help balance product displacement, heating oil, gasoline, jet fuel, asphalt, lube oil, etc., you can't compress a liquid, it all has to go somewhere in the correct predetermined ratios.

A more sub-rosa cooperative bunch of cowboys can not be found on God's oily erf.

Now with the extensive product derivative market , plastics , etc. , it's more flexible, but old habits die hard.

Prolly when the Volt dies it's scheduled predetermined death it will be "the next big thing"!

[AuntB]

“Automakers gearing up for electric cars”

Since they have so much influence in congress, maybe they can stop the tearing out of hydro electric dams all over the west by the enviro freaks...you know to supply those electric cars!

[Citizen Blade]

Because it doesn't make sense to have an electric harvester or a farm tractor. Do you really equate your city driven car with those vehicles?

There is no one-size fits all solution for our energy issues. Reducing our dependency on foreign oil (so we can stop indirectly financing terrorism) will involve electric cars, nuclear power, wind and solar energy, more drilling at home, more public transit etc.

Reading threads like this can be disheartening. People seem to be unwilling to accept the fact that we will need to change our approach to energy consumption in the coming years.

[penowa]

"With gas heading to $1.25/gallon, now is the perfect time to flood the market with electric cars.

There's nothing quite like a nationalized auto industry."

Shouldn't be long until the gov't tells farmers the dates of the "national planting and harvest days."

[Cronos]

You hit the nail on the head -- there is no one size fits all. There is nothing wrong with an SUV per se -- IF IT IS USED FOR WHAT IT'S MEANT FOR, namely an off-road vehicle. Ditto for harvesters or tractors: both are gas guzzlers, but they need to be.

we need to change our consumption to more need basis -- if you're a construction man and use your truck daily to haul goods, great, that's the perfect use. If you're a city slicker and only go from point A to B in a city, you really ought to have the good sense to take something else.

if you DON'T have the good sense, then you invite government legislation which will punish the good and the bad. It's just like the Investment Banks -- no legislation, but it got abused. The better banks like Goldman didn't abuse leverage and they survive, but they got hit by the same legislation and became a regular bank like everyone else.

[penowa]

"How is the electric grid going to support all these cars being plugged into the grid without Nuclear (green weenies) and without coal fired plants (global warmists)?"

You don't really believe most people will be able to afford a car, air conditioning or the electricity to run them in the near future, do you? You'll be lucky if the gov't grants you a license to have a bike and allows you to pedal more than a couple of miles from your cave!

[penowa]

"The better banks like Goldman didn't abuse leverage and they survive..."

ROFLOL! You're kidding, right?

[Cronos]

note my words — they didn’t abuse it — check out their leverage ratios in comparison to Bear Stearns or Lehman brothers

[COBOL2Java]

Slot cars were great. Does anybody do that anymore?

Click on the graphic

[irishjuggler]

I’m not big on used cars.

[johniegrad]

Thanks.

[penowa]

Do you think that Bear or Lehman just might be in better shape had they been in charge of doling out the 750 billion?

[Darkwolf377]

You can have those things, but only after you’ve helped give the same to several unemployed undocumented workers, you selfish *&^%#(! /;)

[Cronos]

I was talking about the relative leverage ratios of the various investment banks — Lehmans was in a horrendous leverage ratio, much higher multiples than Goldman.