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1 posted on 11/22/2008 4:01:21 PM PST by dano1
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To: dano1

That means that Obama will have to come down off his campaign rhetoric and do what’s right. Thomas Jefferson did.


2 posted on 11/22/2008 4:04:06 PM PST by Perdogg (01-20-2013 Obama's last day)
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To: dano1

3 posted on 11/22/2008 4:04:38 PM PST by BenLurkin
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To: dano1

Hmmm...I don’t like this tone from Ben Stein...he is usually fairly well balanced, I think...

Yikes...


7 posted on 11/22/2008 4:07:03 PM PST by jessduntno (Barack - Kenyan for "High Wind, Big Thunder, No Rain")
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To: dano1

This is just plain stupid. Never ending. Please. Even the depression had an ending. This will be over in two to three years.


9 posted on 11/22/2008 4:07:25 PM PST by napscoordinator
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To: dano1

These things are cyclical. Always have been. Instead of lamentations of the winter of our discontent, they should thoughtfully analyze how we got into this shape and how to get out of it. Newspapers used to do journalism a long long time ago.


11 posted on 11/22/2008 4:07:48 PM PST by BipolarBob (Even the earth is bipolar.)
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To: dano1

Every time I see Ben Stein on tv, radio or in print, he seems to be getting more and more, Morose to downright depressed.

I dunno!!


12 posted on 11/22/2008 4:08:02 PM PST by gwilhelm56 (HITLER offered Hope and Change!!)
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To: dano1
But this does not look like a typical recession.

With your employers stock price slide of 65%+ in the last year I can see why you think that.

13 posted on 11/22/2008 4:08:55 PM PST by Balding_Eagle (If America falls, darkness will cover the face of the earth for a thousand years.)
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To: dano1

I’d like to read this article but Bugmenot is doing nothing for me this time. Wonder what’s wrong.


15 posted on 11/22/2008 4:09:30 PM PST by ottbmare
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To: dano1
The real cause behind the financial and economic problems are the onerous, manipulative regulations enacted by (generally) Democrats in Congress. Such regulations have been piled one on top of another for several decades. They have now reached the breaking point. The straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak.

All the bailouts in the world aren't going to return the economy (neither global nor local) to what it once was, unless the anti-capitalistic regulations are removed.

You may have noticed, that not only has there been no move to undo the CRA, CAFE, nor any of the other cute acronyms, but the Dems in Congress continue to deny any responsibility for the economy's collapse.

Things COULD get better. But the future doesn't look very rosy at the moment.

17 posted on 11/22/2008 4:09:55 PM PST by ChicagahAl (So your bumper sticker says: "Don't blame me, I didn't vote!"? Duh!)
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To: dano1; TigerLikesRooster; rabscuttle385
"If recession should threaten serious consequences for business (as is not indicated at present) there is little doubt that the Federal Reserve System would take steps to ease the money market, and so check the movement."

~~Harvard Economic Society, October 19, 1929

"Business will turn for the better this month or next, recovering vigorously in the third quarter and end the year substantially above normal."

~~Harvard Economic Society, May 17, 1930

"There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as a result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved."

-~~Ludwig Von Mises

“Several brokerage houses tumbled; blue-sky investment companies formed during the happy bull market days went to smash, disclosing miserable tales of rascality; over a thousand banks caved in during 1930, as a result of marking down both of real estate and of securities; and in December occurred the largest bank failure in American financial history, the fall of the ill-named Bank of the United States in New York.”

~~"Only Yesterday: An Informal History of the 1920’s" by Fredrick Lewis Allen

21 posted on 11/22/2008 4:17:03 PM PST by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: dano1

Everybody has enough cars TV’s Ipods to last the decade . Not much you can do about that ;-)) Build a better car TV or Ipod ??


22 posted on 11/22/2008 4:17:12 PM PST by Deetes (God Bless the Troops)
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To: dano1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw&eurl=http://caps.fool.com/blogs/viewpost.aspx?bpid=109293&t=01007146184382914537

Ben Stein is a tool, Peter Schiff owns him, and others in this video is from 2006/2007, notice the crap Stein spews in response, I loooove where he says Merrill Lynch is a bargain and AND ASTONISHING WELL RUN COMPANY, look at the prices the people were saying WERE BARGAINS for the financials


23 posted on 11/22/2008 4:17:44 PM PST by oioiman (The Federal Reserve has officially been listed as the USA's cause of death.....)
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To: dano1

I just lost all respect for Ben Stein.


28 posted on 11/22/2008 4:20:35 PM PST by Emperor Palpatine ("I love democracy. I love Free Republic")
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To: dano1
But the Depression taught us that if there is enough fear in the economy, lenders will not lend and economic activity will continue indefinitely at a level consistent with serious recession or even depression.

This was John Maynard Keynes’s great contribution to economic understanding, and it’s a big one.

The money quote. Keynes's solution was tried by FDR. It did not work. World war did. Scary.

30 posted on 11/22/2008 4:21:08 PM PST by Jacquerie (Islam - A barbaric political system in religious drag.)
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To: dano1
So many sectors are experiencing chaos and uncertainty.. plus, no matter what, we have to institute national health insurance, that's a given. The only thing that makes sense is central planning and collaboration with the global community.

39 posted on 11/22/2008 4:29:17 PM PST by I see my hands (_8(|)
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To: dano1
In this situation, where fear rules, we must turn to the federal government for relief.
IMHO, this is what got us into this mess.

We cannot nickel-and-dime our way out of this.
The nasty problem is that we can't dollar our way out either. Years of credit have created a black hole that will devour every bit of "wealth" the govt prints.

Saving the automakers is a step out of the darkness. Or, I might say, allowing them to die is a step toward a terrifying dusk.
I think he's got it backwards. Bailing out Detroit without savage give-backs will ensure that that darkness rivals that of the Biblical "valley of the shadow of . . ."

45 posted on 11/22/2008 4:31:29 PM PST by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: dano1
"A typical recession is brought on by Federal Reserve tightening in the face of excessive demand and rising prices. The economy still functions normally, but purposeful credit tightening slows activity. When the Fed loosens up and money starts flowing, demand increases and growth returns."

For starters, the difference is that this is a global recession, not an internal one, and people are in debt up to their ears, not flush with cash or have room to borrow more. It's a train wreck that stretches around the world.

56 posted on 11/22/2008 4:42:02 PM PST by Nathan Zachary
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To: dano1
What if a Slowdown Is a Never-Ending Story?

"Now don't you worry, Mrs. Simpson. This is the most blatant case of false advertising I've seen since my class-action lawsuit against 'The Neverending Story.'"

57 posted on 11/22/2008 4:42:22 PM PST by Future Snake Eater ("Get out of the boat and walk on the water with us!”--Sen. Joe Biden)
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To: dano1
A truly serious stimulus package is very much in order. It has to be big enough and last long enough that Americans do not just sock it away under the mattress. We cannot nickel-and-dime our way out of this. The inflation threat is small in an economy in full credit-collapse mode. There is virtually no dose of stimulus that is too much in an economy as shellshocked as today’s.

I don't agree with all Ben said in this article (particularly in the case of the Big 3 automakers), but I do agree with his general premise that there is enough fear in the market, worldwide, to lead to a very, very long and deep depression.

One maxim I think is true is that you cannot stimulate confidence. IOW, once a certain level of shock and fear is internalized, almost any amount of direct stimulus the government can accomplish is *felt* as nickle-and-diming.

To have gas prices drop to $1.50, or to get a check for $2,000 from the gubmint, just isn't going to take away the shock of seeing one's 401(k) lose 30, 40 or 50% of its value in a matter of weeks---and knowing darn well that it could take DECADES to get that back, if ever.

Moreover, this maybe-depression is very different from anything in the past because it encompasses very large moral hazards. At every turn of government intervention, there is the problem that the "fix" is rewarding the gamblers and deadbeats and those who played by the rules are getting slapped in the face.

If the "fix" undermines the market morality (e.g., that those who play by the rules generally win) by providing windfalls to those who gambled or punted, there will come a time when good and decent people will have no choice but to conclude that doing the "right thing" is no longer doing the "wise or financially survivable thing."

If that point is reached, we have a fundamental change that will be forever.

All that said, one of the approaches that might work, and might be amenable to schemes that don't reward the deadbeats, is MASSIVE TAX RELIEF for those who play by the rules.

For example, instead of mortgage bailouts to deadbeats, how about doubling or tripling the mortgage interest deduction for those paying their mortgage and living in their home?

How about a credit for credit card interest for those who are current on their bill for the entire tax year? That would reward the people who don't default and encourage spending.

How about loan modification for those who are current---to make monthly payments easier without the lender losing a dime, e.g., reamortization over 40 years?

How about stop giving a hiring preference to those on welfare and let people who were supporting themselves compete fairly for what jobs there are in this economy?

How about increasing the deduction for dependents for people who actually pay income taxes?

These are some examples of ways the government could "spend" money and give it to the people who can, by their good choices, keep this country afloat.

59 posted on 11/22/2008 4:43:12 PM PST by fightinJAG (No choice but to boycott the Big 3 automakers, else we feed the Bailout Hole.)
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To: dano1
It'll end when the 55M who "voted against Obama" (not for McCain) march on D.C. and throw all the bums out of their offices and into the street for good.
60 posted on 11/22/2008 4:43:14 PM PST by DTogo (I haven't left the GOP, the GOP left me.)
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