Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Pro-Homosexual Denominations Lose Numbers
Magic City Morning Star ^ | Grant Swank

Posted on 07/09/2008 4:32:10 AM PDT by johnstown

The Episcopal Church has been at the forefront of baptizing active homosexual lifestyle as God-blessed.

Since 1960, that denomination has decreased in membership by 48%.

The United Methodist Church has been roiled by those adamant on establishing homosexual lifestyles as Christian legitimate. In the fight for one side or another that denomination has decreased in membership by 25%.

The Presbyterian Church (USA) has likewise been embroiled in the tussle. That denomination has decreased in membership by 44%.

The Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) has also been riddled with in-house fighting over homosexual lifestyles as anti-God or pro-God. That denomination's membership has decreased 74%.

The Evangelical Lutheran Church of America has permitted the fight to be more open, some in administration arguing homosexual lifestyles as okay with God. That denomination's membership has decreased by 31%.

The United Church of Christ (Congregational) has defended aggressively homosexual activity as totally legitimate in the definition of "Christian." In the last 40 years, that denomination has lost 40% of its original membership.

By contrast, denominations preaching the Bible as divine revelation, openly stating their love for homosexuals but their disdain for homosexual activity, have grown in membership and church attendance.

For instance, the Southern Baptist Convention has increased in membership by 76% according to the National Council of Churches statistics for 2007.

Read James L. Clark's "The Church Homosexual Problem" at http://www.postchronicle.com/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi?archive=75&num=153523


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: ecusa; elca; homosexual; homosexualagenda; pcusa; religiousleft; sbc; schism; ucc; umc
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-111 next last
To: STONEWALLS
Will the Christendom resist the global ambitions of Islam?

Again, the past may assist in determining the future. Some have described radical Islam as Communism with a religious veneer. While serious differences exist in the areas of metaphysics and materialism, both systems are determinist in their views of human events, triumphalist in their views of history, collectivist in their perceptions of social order, and totalitarian in their civil governments. (Nazism had all these characteristics, although other authoritarian post-World War I regimes in much of Europe, often labeled as fascist, lacked some or all of them.) In fact, radical Islam is more like Communism than it is like the old European regimes where the monarchy and the church were intertwined and their mutual roles in society were blurred.

As far back as the Unitarian movement in early 19th Century New England, the religious Left adhered to political and social goals similar to those of the Jacobin radicals in France and their successors in the European revolutions of 1848. The Social Gospel arose as a major movement around the turn of the last century and was centered around theological liberals in the mainline denominations, such as Walter Rauschenbusch, J. Bromley Oxnam, and Pearl Buck.

The mainline denominations were clearly anti-anti-Communist during the Cold War era, and sometimes even pro-Communist. Right wing commentators in the post-World War II era showed links between prominent Protestant liberals and Communist front groups and sometimes even the Communist Party itself. While some of the accusations were sensationalistic and were criticized by J. Edgar Hoover as harmful to legitimate anti-Communism, there is no doubt that the mainline denominations opposed aggressive actions to oppose Communism overseas and supported the leftist agenda domestically.

In contrast, evangelical Protestants were staunchly anti-Communist. Examples would include Carl McIntyre, Francis Schaffer, and Fredrick Schwartz. While many fundamentalists avoided delving directly into the political arena until the late 1970s (e.g., Jerry Falwell), they, along with evangelicals, were certainly critical of the cultural Marxism and moral degeneracy represented in the sexual revolution and the beatnik/hippie movements. Evangelical and fundamentalist voters, aroused out of a half century of political slumber by the effects of rising cultural degeneracy, provided Ronald Reagan and a resurgent conservative movement with the support needed for the demise of the Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact.

In the conflict with radical Islam, it is worthy to note that some of the same figures, such as Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell, who had been staunch anti-Communists in the Cold War era, became strong supporters of the war against Islamofascism. In the meantime, the mainline churches, especially the Presbyterian Church, USA, have attempted to divest themselves of investments in Israel, radical Islam's enemy. The liberals in the apostate church are once again aligning with secular liberals in opposition to vigorous attempts to defeat those who would overturn the Western nations.

Same song, second verse.

81 posted on 07/09/2008 10:25:32 AM PDT by Wallace T.
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: johnstown

Feel-good garbage leaves you hollow inside. Most people see that and that is why they are losing members.


82 posted on 07/09/2008 11:11:58 AM PDT by vpintheak (Like a muddied spring or a polluted well is a righteous man who gives way to the wicked. Prov. 25:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur
liberal denominations are exactly the example. They do not follow teachings of the Bible. I don't know what Church you go to that has liberal policies regarding divorce, re-marriage, or even premarital sex for that matter. Conservatives have no problem with Church policies that do not condone those things. Only liberals do. Church or not. I know of many examples, as most of us do, where Churches have not approved of someones behavior, it does not mean they aren't loved. If a person isn't loved by Jesus, why would he care one way or the other? Like Him, we do not withdraw Love, only approval, when a loved one is doing wrong. We are not SUPPOSE to agree that it is not a sin! The two, love and approval, are not intertwined! Very simple.
83 posted on 07/09/2008 12:09:03 PM PDT by gidget7 (Duncan Hunter-Valley Forge Republican!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: gidget7
I don't know what Church you go to that has liberal policies regarding divorce, re-marriage, or even premarital sex for that matter.

I'm speaking of Baptists. I'm not a member of that particular denomination. And I imagine they'd have a problem with you calling their policies 'liberal'.

84 posted on 07/09/2008 12:17:27 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 83 | View Replies]

To: Wallace T.

” The liberals in the apostate church are once again aligning with secular liberals in opposition to vigorous attempts to defeat those who would overturn the Western nations.”
....they are and they scare me....in PCUSA a recurring theme is “Peace and Justice”....over 30 years ago I went to a Presbytery meeting where the headliner was a Pacifist...I said “what’s your solution to a man like Pol Pot?”....he says “Cambodians should refuse to take up arms and follow him”....I just shook my head and walked away from the guy.


85 posted on 07/09/2008 12:22:23 PM PDT by STONEWALLS
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur
Perhaps so, but certainly none I have ever attended. If anything they are more strict.
86 posted on 07/09/2008 12:27:11 PM PDT by gidget7 (Duncan Hunter-Valley Forge Republican!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 84 | View Replies]

To: gidget7
Perhaps so, but certainly none I have ever attended. If anything they are more strict.

How did your Baptist congregation deal with divorce and remarriage?

87 posted on 07/09/2008 12:34:15 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur
Re-marriage is not allowed except in instances dictated in the Bible, or there is a wronged party whose spouse divorced them even though they tried to stop it. As we know, in todays world, anyone who wants one gets it, there is no stopping it. That changed some things. But, divorced people, much like many churches are not denied the opportunity to repent or even to come to Church. They are simply denied membership, and the Church will not re-marry them.

If a person is committing adultery, I have seen cases where the Pastor intervenes and talks with them, councils them. If they chose to repent at the point, they can. Otherwise they can chose to leave the Church or keep going, but if they have a membership, it is revoked.

Heck, some of them do not even allow short skirts, or blouses or tops without sleeves. But that is their right.

88 posted on 07/09/2008 12:41:38 PM PDT by gidget7 (Duncan Hunter-Valley Forge Republican!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 87 | View Replies]

To: Dr. Sivana

OH, the Episcopal Church does care in Virginia! Several older Virginia Episcopal parishes voted to split from the national church (ECUSA) and its VA diocese based in Richmond. Among them are two of the oldest, largest and wealthiest parishes in the state if not the country. They joined an Anglican church based in Africa.

The ECUSA sued over the very valuable property of the departing congregations, and lost. After appeal, the original court opinion was upheld. It will likely end up in more courts with more appeals.

Throughout the discussions and suits, there has been much argued by the ECUSA and its Richmond diocese about the properties, but precious little about the souls of the congregants.

I belive the law by which the departing congregations maintain their property may be unique to VA and not apply elsewhere. But at least for now it’s been upheld as constitutional in the Old Dominion.


89 posted on 07/09/2008 12:43:21 PM PDT by EDINVA (Proud American for 23,062 days.... and counting!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: gidget7
Re-marriage is not allowed except in instances dictated in the Bible, or there is a wronged party whose spouse divorced them even though they tried to stop it.

The Bible is clear on the subject; marriage is a holy union and divorce and remarriage is adultery against the former spouse. Yet Baptists look on divorce as the sin, not the remarriage, and believe that asking forgiveness for the failed marriage is enough to allow remarriage. That goes against what Jesus said in Matthew and Mark. Rewriting scripture like that makes it look like some sin is OK and some is not.

90 posted on 07/09/2008 12:57:45 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 88 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur

No sin is ok. But they are not barriers to coming to Christ to repent either. Nor are abominations.


91 posted on 07/09/2008 1:34:50 PM PDT by gidget7 (Duncan Hunter-Valley Forge Republican!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: EDINVA
OH, the Episcopal Church does care in Virginia! Several older Virginia Episcopal parishes voted to split from the national church (ECUSA)[. . . ]

I belive the law by which the departing congregations maintain their property may be unique to VA and not apply elsewhere. But at least for now it’s been upheld as constitutional in the Old Dominion.


I didn't mean the individual congregations don't care, I mean the leadership that ignores the appeals of its members doesn't care (without any real everlasting principle, just their agenda). I went to college in Virginia in the late '80s, and remember "traditional" Episcopal offshoots even then (somewhere between Front Royal and Falls Church, I think).

Since Virginia was Anglican as the official state religion before there was a U S of A, that might account for the special status, yes?
92 posted on 07/09/2008 2:17:42 PM PDT by Dr. Sivana (There is no salvation in politics)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: Dr. Sivana

The point of my post was that the leadership of ECUSA very much cares about the PROPERTY of the congregations, if not theiur members or their souls. There was an official ‘separation’ from ECUSA in 2006 at 7 parishes in NOVA, including Truro in Fairfax City and Falls Church in (ta da) Falls Church. Both are huge congregations and very wealthy, not to mention very very active.

Actually, the VA law on which the parishes relied to keep their property following the “separation’ was adopted during the Civil War. I have the legal legal opinions that I could FReepmail if you’re interested. Dry stuff but still fascinating to some of us.


93 posted on 07/09/2008 6:02:56 PM PDT by EDINVA (Proud American for 23,062 days.... and counting!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur
The issue is not whether homos are welcomed or not. The issue is not whether homosexuality is a worse sin than other sins or not.

Should I have written in Dick and Jane fashion to make a point to you? I said, the point was not whether it is a worse sin. On its face, it is not. The problem is the insistence that it is not a sin. Congratulations for weakest response of the day. You tried to make my post mean the opposite of what it was.

94 posted on 07/09/2008 6:48:19 PM PDT by Sans-Culotte
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Non-Sequitur
Rewriting scripture like that makes it look like some sin is OK and some is not.

No, the point Jesus made about divorce is that people who thought themselves sinless really were not sinless. Again, no sin is OK. Jesus said just thinking about sinning is as bad as actually committing the sin in the flesh. The problem with homosexuals, or people such as you who champion them, is that they claim it is not a sin.

95 posted on 07/09/2008 6:52:32 PM PDT by Sans-Culotte
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: johnstown
The homosexual churches are in decline, but they are also very vocal and they are the ones most consulted and most featured in the media. Therefore, even though they are facing a precipitous decline, they are also going to be kept going for a long time (someone here mentioned the bequests in wills, etc, and that will keep them kicking for a while).

I imagine they would be loud and proud about the gay thing even if there were only two or three of them left. So we can be sure that even though they are declining, they are not going away.

96 posted on 07/09/2008 7:05:46 PM PDT by Boagenes (I'm your huckleberry, that's just my game.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: driftdiver
You have hit nearly the exact same points that I have shared with people in my church about the situation with churches in decline (the mainline denominations) today. It boils down to four points (nearly identical to what you said):

A lot of this is also coming out of the seminaries where this liberalism is taking hold. You have pastors coming out of seminary that are activists, not ministers of God.

97 posted on 07/09/2008 7:13:52 PM PDT by Boagenes (I'm your huckleberry, that's just my game.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Sans-Culotte
Thank you! I am constantly having this same argument with Christian friends, and with family, and I have to keep reiterating the same point. It is not a question of whether homosexuality is a worse sin than any other (and I say this till I feel blue in the face). It is a question of people saying homosexuality is not a sin when the Bible says it is!

I feel better now.

98 posted on 07/09/2008 7:21:09 PM PDT by Boagenes (I'm your huckleberry, that's just my game.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 94 | View Replies]

To: wideawake
I don't think the ECUSA, UMC, PCUSA, DOC, ELCA or UCC have been teaching these doctrines since 1962.

1965 is a common start date for the PCUSA numbers (peak membership for the component bodies, plus onset of discussion on the liberal 'Confession of 1967' when the liberals first began to take open control in the northern Church. 1965 numbers were 4,254,597; 1983 (merger) numbers were 3,121,338; 2007 numbers were 2,209,546.

Last year's losses were 57,572.

No matter how someone spins it, no one can make those numbers look good.

99 posted on 07/09/2008 8:25:04 PM PDT by PAR35
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: STONEWALLS; Wallace T.
.Presbytery not only owns the church but also the minister’s retirement fund and shares of stock that were given.

Generally, no, and absolutely, no.

.

For pension issues, start here (pdf):
http://www.layman.org/layman/Resources/pension-brochure.pdf

As for property, if you want the long answer, start here:
http://www.layman.org/layman/Resources/guide-to-church-prop-ad.htm

Or, if you don't want to spring for the book, here: http://www.layman.org/layman/Resources/lawsuits-court-filings.htm

100 posted on 07/09/2008 8:39:13 PM PDT by PAR35
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-111 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson