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NOW let's compare "apples to apples" [Obama birth certificate controvery, part 2]
Townhall ^ | 6/22/08 | Polarik

Posted on 06/23/2008 3:45:52 PM PDT by freespirited

 

NOW let's compare "apples to apples"

Or, since this involves Hawaii, "pineapples to pineapples:"

With many thanks to Bloggers TexasDarlin, Freeper, and Shainzona, I am posting a copy of Hawaiian-born, Patricia Decosta's certified "Certification of Live Birth," which is what this Certification should look like. If you go back to the points I raised in my original post, specifically about the differences in typeface, letter artifacts, and the border, these points are further reinforced from comparing Decosta's certified document with Obama's uncertified one.

Once again, here is Obama's uncertified (and suspect) "Certification of Live Birth":

Photobucket


And, now, Ms. Decosta's certified (and not suspect) "Certification of Live Birth:"


Photobucket


For comparison purposes, I created a cropped image of each that are approximately the same dimensions in terms of image height and text height. Additionally, each image -- one for Obama's and one for Decosta's -- has approximately the same amount of JPG compression.

Before comparing these and deconstructing them, I draw your attention to the previous images showing the entire certificates. Both have the same "tag line" indicating the form number and revision, OHSM 1.1 (Rev. 11/01) LASER, and the "prima facie evidence" statement.

Given that both have that same tag line, one can assume, for the moment, that this tag line does appear on valid COB's produced by the Office of Health Status Monitoring during the time that Rev. 11/01 was being used.

However, the thing that should jump out at you, besides the visual differences in the typefaces, are the obvious, visual differences in the borders.

But, first, let me reiterate what is my main contention about the images posted on the Daily Kos and Fight The Smears websites.

I maintain that a copy of a real, Hawaiian Certification of Live Birth was graphically modified to resemble what Obama's "Certification of Live Birth" might look like, IF, and only IF, it were a genuine reproduction of a genuine document.

Thus, the crux of my argument is as follows:

Because the image of Obama's copy has so many distinct, visual differences from the image of a copy certified as accurate, like Ms. Decosta's, and that these visual differences represent what could only result from a deliberate, graphical modification of an existing image, that the image itself, and the paper copy it purports to represent, casts doubt on the validity of the claims made for them.

These claims are
that Barack Obama's "Certification of Live Birth" does exists somewhere, and that the JPG images posted on the Daily Kos and Fight The Smears websites are genuine reproductions of it.

As I highlighted in my first post, the evidence says otherwise. Here are close-up views of both the Obama and Decosta images:


Photobucket


Photobucket

The typeface on the Decosta image is much darker and thicker, and has less kerning (spacing between the letters), than the Obama image. Moreover, the color of the green paper comes through almost all of the letters regardless of magnification or image compression.

By comparison, you will not see the grey and white pixels found between the letters on the Obama image.

When you enlarge the letters in the Decosta image, they all tend to remain solid, especially letters like "I, L, B, E, H," that continue to look the same no matter how large you make them. Conversely, when you enlarge the letters in the Obama image, they start to fall apart -- that is, they start losing pixels. This is exactly what happens to bitmapped text created by a graphics program.

OK, now let's compare the borders of both images.

In the Obama image -- or, should I say, "images," because the edges of the vertical borders in the Kos image overlap the horizontal ones, whereas the Smears image has them lining up -- the pattern is different from the Decosta image.


Photobucket

Photobucket


The borders in the Obama image might be extremely faint versions of the Decosta image, but then why is so much image information missing, if not because it was a bad reproduction to begin with.

Other bloggers have already noted the reversed, embossed seals and signature imprints that appear on the Decosta image but which are totally absent on the Obama image. The conclusion from this would be that the Obama image never had them, for if they did, wouldn't they be prominently shown as verification?

We still have more questions than answers


TOPICS: Politics/Elections; US: Hawaii
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; certifigate; elections; obama; obamatruthfile
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To: Cheburashka
"The use of fake documents by the Obama campaign should send up all kinds of red flags. He wouldn't have this out there if the alternative were harmless."

That's the first intelligent comment on this thread. If it were genuine, the certificate number would not be blanked out. There are only two possibilities here:
1. Its an erased and re printed certificate from another individual. or,
2. Its a blank that was furnished by one of the Obama flaks in the county clerk's office, that would not have a number in any field.

Either way, he's not a citizen, by neither birth, nor by application for citizenship, and thus is not elligible to hold public office. Any Senate vote where his vote was the deciding edge is therefore invalid.

101 posted on 06/23/2008 7:18:48 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: freespirited

What’s the difference between “date filed by state registrar” and “date accepted by state registrar”?


102 posted on 06/23/2008 7:28:34 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: editor-surveyor

FWIW, Hawaii is well known as a black market for fake government forms and documents. Remember, it wasn’t a state until 1959. If a local family member worked in a basic industry with sufficient dedication to want to have a middle management job, procuring grandfathered professional certifications by that black market was rather common. Likewise, if one wanted a birth certificate to receive Hawaiian benefits provided the person was local friend, their procurement was simple.

(If anything, fake documents probably had all the i’s dotted and t’s crossed, because they frequently were procured amongst black marketers who actually issued the forms normally, so they made sure they were either indubitable, so they wouldn’t be traced back to them, or they would be so canned, the seller would be excused from any MO because they wouldn;t fill them out so flippantly.)


103 posted on 06/23/2008 7:29:07 PM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: varon
"So, what is the dispute that is being resolved here?"

That he was not born in Hawaii, and thus not a citizen.

104 posted on 06/23/2008 7:31:16 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: Crystal Cove
"Does his being illegitimate somehow affect his citizenship?"

No, but his not having been born in the U.S. does. (Kenya)

105 posted on 06/23/2008 7:40:12 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: Political Junkie Too
"They were requested sometime after 2005."

After 1986.

106 posted on 06/23/2008 7:42:08 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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Comment #107 Removed by Moderator

To: aruanan
What’s the difference between “date filed by state registrar” and “date accepted by state registrar”?

I take it that it's a different way to say the same thing. The baby is born, but the forms don't get to the state registrar until a few days later, depending on if there was a weekend or holiday involved, or if the clerk was out of the office a few days--which makes the number of days between the birth and the filing of the birth certificate with the state registrar different on each birth certificate.

The thing that so many are confused about is that these are Certificates of Birth, NOT the actual birth certificate. Many if not most people lose their original birth certificate (or their parents do, let's face it, they're a tiny baby when the thing is issued and have no control over its location and care), or it crumbles to dust after many years, so they send off for a certificate, which is not the same thing as the original birth certificate. Just considering it in an economical sense, there would be boxes and boxes of dusty birth certificates stacked in the basement (I don't' think they have basements in Hawaii but you get my drift) and someone would have to go down there and hunt through tens of thousands of pieces of paper to satisfy each and every request for a copy of a birth certificate. To simplify matters, the state just issues a certificate of live birth which is proof that the child was born where and when, etc.

108 posted on 06/23/2008 7:46:37 PM PDT by Auntie Mame (Fear not tomorrow. God is already there.)
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To: Political Junkie Too; SVW
"Maybe not proof that it is a fake, but there is definitely proof that it has been altered. See that big black box where the certificate number should be? That is an alteration of a certified document (leaving out absence of certification embossment or signature), making the document useless as proof of anything by language on the document itself."

Since 1986 federal law requires an embossed seal on a "fraud proof" form for proof of citizenship. Older birth certificates, even though real, and valid, are not useable for this purpose.

109 posted on 06/23/2008 7:55:32 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: ArmyTeach
"A propos of nothing, my birth certificate from Honolulu, Hawaii c. 1945 is a white lettering on black background mimeograph. Entirely different."

If you need to prove your citizenship, you will have to get a new copy on the current type of form, and it will look like the ones shown here.

110 posted on 06/23/2008 8:00:00 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: Bubbette

I agree. 30 years is too great a separation to use for comparison.


111 posted on 06/23/2008 8:04:59 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: freespirited
I remember another little boy that had issues with his birth certificate.

If only Barack's first name was "Damien." (sorry, not trying to derail the thread, just felt like it maybe needed a little levity). I actually like the speculation of him being adopted by his mother, thus the possible chicanery 47 years later with his "birth certificate." If that angle ever gets legs, we need to send out some enterprising FReepers to get a cig butt that Obama has discarded (or a crack pipe he threw away) and send someone to find his grandma, and maybe steal some hair from her, then have a DNA test done to prove that his mother was his real mom. I bet they find jackal DNA in him.

112 posted on 06/23/2008 8:06:05 PM PDT by smedley64 (Dems go all-in every 4 years with a 7-2 offsuit marxist, hoping to hit the flop big just one time.)
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To: The Tin Foil Hat

Troll, or just a little slow on the uptake?


113 posted on 06/23/2008 8:17:25 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: Auntie Mame
" Just considering it in an economical sense, there would be boxes and boxes of dusty birth certificates stacked in the basement"

By law, the original hospital birth certificate has to be kept, and stored. In addition, there are numerous microfilm copies of them, at the hospital, at the county clerk's office, and sometimes at title co. plants.

The information from the hospital certificate is transfered to an official certificate, which is also kept, and microfilmed, but is only accessable by county clerk employees. Finally, now there is also a computer version created by filling the record fields of a file on a hard disk. That is what is being viewed here.

114 posted on 06/23/2008 8:34:03 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: smedley64
"I bet they find jackal DNA in him."

This will be better used after the convention, leaving the communist party without a candidate.

115 posted on 06/23/2008 8:41:13 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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To: Polarik

“Please see my latest blog post (polarik.townhall.com) to read what I learned from the Hawaii Department of Health today. “

I took the time to copy and past the info you provided.
I’m on your side. But...

As the information you have obtained is very interesting, why don’t you do everyone on FR a favor and just post it here, “outright”?

- John


116 posted on 06/23/2008 8:50:12 PM PDT by Fishrrman
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To: editor-surveyor
This will be better used after the convention, leaving the communist party without a candidate.

waiting in the wings...

ready for his close-up

117 posted on 06/23/2008 8:55:37 PM PDT by lainie ("You don't have a soul. You are a soul. You have a body." - C.S. Lewis)
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To: lainie

Id say based on that picture Al Gore is suffering from global warming


118 posted on 06/23/2008 9:03:49 PM PDT by woofie
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To: Right Cal Gal
Personally? I think his birth certificate states his mom was single and that’s why he doesn’t want anyone to see it.

I'm with you. However, I think the revelation would be via an unchecked box on the cert next to the word "legitimate." Throughout the birth certificate debate this has been my hunch as to the reason his campaign will not release the original. If, as we suspect he is an illegitimate child, he fears public reaction.

119 posted on 06/23/2008 9:09:37 PM PDT by freespirited (A Democrat is a person who lives in fear that someone, somewhere is proud to be an American.)
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To: jveritas
Do you really believe that Obama is not a natural born US citizen?

No, I believe he was born in the U.S. Mainly because he would ruin his career were he caught lying about his birthplace. It's simply contrary to his self-interest, which we know is what guides his every move.

I have no idea why his campaign might present a forged certification over a true one. If you want to know why I think it is hiding the original certificate, read my reply immediately above.

120 posted on 06/23/2008 9:13:27 PM PDT by freespirited (A Democrat is a person who lives in fear that someone, somewhere is proud to be an American.)
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