| This thread has been locked, it will not receive new replies. |
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Locked on 02/18/2008 10:17:33 AM PST by Religion Moderator, reason:
Childish behavior |
Posted on 02/16/2008 3:30:21 PM PST by xcamel
One solution to the nation's long-term fiscal problems that has gained support in recent years is the idea of replacing all federal taxes with a 23 percent national retail sales tax called the FairTax. Unfortunately, the administrative problems inherent in this proposal make it impossible to take seriously, says Bruce Bartlett, former deputy assistant secretary for economic policy at the U.S. Treasury Department.
For example, under a FairTax scheme: A worker now netting $800 per week would immediately get a $200 raise and start taking home the full $1,000 gross wage that he is paid; instead of paying income and payroll taxes, workers would pay their taxes when they buy things.
The FairTax would impose a 23 percent tax on all goods and services (this is not really correct, but for now we'll accept it at face value for analytical purposes).
Whether he is better off or not depends on what his effective tax rate is: Assuming he spends all his income and no more than that, he will be no worse off if he now pays 23 percent of his income in taxes. That is, his effective tax rate is 23 percent; in this case, the FairTax is a wash, the worker is no better off or worse off in terms of taxes than he is now.
But what if the worker is now paying less than 23 percent of his income in federal taxes? In this case, he is clearly worse off, says Bartlett: The prices of the things he buys will rise by more than his income rises from the elimination of income and payroll taxes. Conversely, if one is wealthy and in a tax bracket above 23 percent, that person would be much better off. His income and payroll taxes would fall by much more than the prices of goods and services he consumes would rise.
Source: Bruce Bartlett, "Why the FairTax Won't Work," Tax Notes, December 24, 2007.
For text:
Our beloved expert has just made a damned arrogant pest of himself, AGAIN, folks.
Because people who have no concept of the difference between markup and margin think they can dictate tax policy.
The Rats are for a heavy tax on INCOME.
A flat tax is still an INCOME tax and only the top earners will pay which means that the 'flat' rate will be 30 to 50%. Possibly more if Hill or Barry are elected.
Also, the INCOME tax, regardless of how it is distributed, is involuntary, collected at gunpoint with all the current trappings of the lovely IRS; wage garnishment, frozen bank accounts, property seizure, imprisonment.
So, like the 'demnon-rat' (sic), you are an INCOME tax advocate.
Now take your lame “thought police” and strawman arguments back over to the DU where they belong.
Talk about lame..................
Hasn't it occured to you that most of it is none of their damned business -- or shouldn't be? Such as, how much my income is, how many members are in my family, how much money I give away or to whom. what my address is, what my telephone number is, am I retired or for whom I work, and on and on, ad infinitum?
On topic: Do you favor maintaining the income tax and the IRS as they currently exist?
The ‘fair tax’ rate will be 30 to 50%. Possibly more if Hill or Barry are elected.
‘for the children’ - so what’s the difference?
Lying again, eh?
Be gone, troll.
| Congressman Broun Cosponsors “FairTax Act of 2007"(73rd Fair Tax Cosponsor) |
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lol. Did not take long did it?
Do you really believe the prebate is marxist?
Where do you see in the bill that withholding will be returned to the employee?
As explained in The FairTax Book, there are taxes embedded in everything we buy. Every entity which provides a product or service in the design, production, marketing, distribution and sale of every consumer good or service will incur some tax liability as they perform their particular function. This tax liability will be incorporated into whatever these individuals or business entitles charge for their services, and will all passed through to become a part of the final cost of the product or service...
We write in The FairTax Book that the competitive pressures of the marketplace will force prices down when embedded taxes disappear from the cost of retail goods and services, and we cite 22% as the average amount of those embedded taxes. Does this 22% include the income and payroll taxes that are paid by employees? Yes, it does. So ... what does this mean to your paycheck after the FairTax becomes law?
But not to worry...
When the FairTax is implemented, and when business and personal income and payroll taxes disappear, your employer is going to have to make a decision. He will either take some or the entire amount he had been withholding for federal income and payroll taxes and add it to your weekly check, or he will readjust your pay figures so that your entire paycheck will be equal to what you used to call "take home pay" before the FairTax. The employer may also decide to do a little of both. Either way, you can see that the amount of money you actually receive as pay – the amount you can put into your bank account – will not decrease, and may actually increase.
http://boortz.com/nuze/200509/09152005.html
So in the FairTax world, a 100% of you check is take home pay, however your take home may remain what it is now, with taxes withheld, or could increase at the discretion of your employer. If take home pay increases under the FairTax, then your employer has less room to lower prices and be competitive.
The problem with the article is that it is a factually inaccurate hit piece. Posting your FairTax FUD on FR is one thing but writing a paper that is intentionally inaccurate is unethical.
Shoot the messenger again? How about the Presidents tax panel? Done cutting that one down yet?
You should take your 'thought-nazi' and strawman arguments back over to DU where they belong.
BTW, if the FairTax has 'zero chance' that congress would ever enact it, why do you anti-FairTaxers expend so much energy fighting it?
| Don't ask CHIEF negotiator or Ancient Geezer any economic or finance questions. ... Under the FairTax, government spending is taxed. Below is why: ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a38b64a196a51.htm - 56k - |
| The plan proposed by Americans for Fair Taxation - the FairTax - will eliminate the hidden ... 1 Posted on 08/31/2001 15:45:49 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b90139d13cf.htm - 44k - |
| National Retail Sales Tax...http://www.fairtax.org/. :-? Peace(pipe). 2 Posted on 05/26/2000 23:04:16 PDT by CHIEF negotiator [ Reply | Private Reply | To 1 ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a392f5f130c2b.htm - 79k - |
| To: Chief Negotiator. How would the Fair Tax handle this one? Since she didn't purchase the home there wouldn't be a sales tax would there? ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37f51ed07f2d.htm - 25k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Thanks for alerting me to this thread. Arizona Chapter is having a meeting this afternoon - The Fair Tax will certainly be a topic of ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37d34b646818.htm - 414k - |
| In addition, the FairTax will lower compliance costs by more than 90% and the removal of these .... 1 Posted on 07/10/2000 08:00:34 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3969e5125e61.htm - 72k - |
| CHIEF negotiator," please mash here to make a contribution. In the comments section, ... CHIEF was a big FairTax.org advocate. Everyone get behind it! ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3bbe3b8f2932.htm - 37k - |
| Lindr then went thru the basics of HB 2525, The FairTax: .... 7 Posted on 12/14/1999 07:49:23 PST by CHIEF negotiator (Visualize Whirled Peas!) ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a385659ca3339.htm - 68k - |
| The CHIEF is the one that got me interested in the FairTax. .... CHIEF Negotiator is an eagle soaring above the chickens of this world and in the loving ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3bbe15685cf8.htm - 40k - |
| Business to business sales is not taxed under the FairTax. Moreover, since all producers of .... 22 Posted on 07/29/2001 22:01:49 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b5fd2614419.htm - 102k - |
| When it comes to "Fair Tax," instead of reading all the propaganda about the "Fair Tax," let's .... 18 Posted on 02/18/2001 08:56:58 PST by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a7f4d5269c8.htm - 52k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Hey CHIEF, I need some info. What does it mean that state sales tax must conform to the Fair Tax, and how does that affect the future ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37f4d2f9083a.htm - 155k - |
| Please join me in praying for CHIEF negotiator and his family. .... Of the two NRST bills before Congress, the FairTax NRST is my preference. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3bbca7a56324.htm - 41k - |
| To: Tax Man Chief Negotiator Bigun Pig Dog Ancient Geezer ... The FairTax plan won't deprive the government of needed funds, or citizens of needed programs. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a39eca0906518.htm - 33k - |
| The FairTax Bill has been Reintroduced in the House. 11 Posted on 07/18/2001 11:58:37 PDT by CHIEF negotiator [ Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | Top | Last ] ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b55a8cc7ac2.htm - 55k - |
| 1 Posted on 09/28/1999 14:39:22 PDT by CHIEF negotiator (Visualize Whirled Peas! ... The FairTaxSM is a national retail sales tax on new goods and services ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37f1358a748a.htm - 137k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. A megabump to you chief. Thanks for all your hard work. I support the Fair Tax and will write my liberal congress-slime recommending ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37cfec973f29.htm - 145k - |
| Posted on 09/15/1999 17:55:56 PDT by CHIEF negotiator. Aristotelian started a thread: The Fair Tax: Do the Numbers Add Up? He claimed that, through his ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37e0401c590c.htm - 134k - |
| 14 Posted on 05/01/2001 12:49:30 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ..... to a letter I sent to him calling on his support for The Fair Tax bill, my congressman, ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3aef09756a4a.htm - 96k - |
| 14 Posted on 05/01/2001 12:49:30 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ..... to a letter I sent to him calling on his support for The Fair Tax bill, my congressman, ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3aef09756a4a.htm - 96k - |
| To: UrbanConservative,kevkrom,Impeach the Creep,WH42. just alertin' the Fair Tax FReepers. 9 Posted on 09/20/1999 06:20:20 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37e623d92000.htm?& - 184k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. CHIEF-I'm going to visit with Bob Barr tonight...he's coming to talk to a group here. Are you aware of his position on the FAIR TAX? ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37cbe6f84ba8.htm - 191k - |
| John Linder, R-Ga., introduced to Congress what they call the Fair Tax plan, which would abolish ... 1 Posted on 12/29/1999 20:50:07 PST by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a386ae47f5d1f.htm - 143k - |
| In addition, the FairTax will lower compliance costs by more than 90% and the ... Sounds great to me CHIEF negotiator. It was good to see that there are now ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a384813246053.htm - 100k - |
| HR2525 "The FairTax Act of 1999". 12 Posted on 05/11/2001 13:13:56 PDT by CHIEF negotiator [ Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | Top | Last ] ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3afc305e41db.htm - 95k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Bump for the Fair Tax. Keyes for President! ... The FairTax eliminates Corporate income tax and compliance costs. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3853a7b77e45.htm - 167k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Done...I think. S-CRAP-THE-DAM-CODE!!! First of all the entire code is NOT scrapped and more importantly the Fair Tax DOES NOT REPEAL ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37f7a0c456da.htm - 182k - |
| "Currently, AFT's 'Fair Tax' is the only tax proposal that satisfies all of that criteria." ... 1 Posted on 07/23/1999 07:50:14 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a379881262b1a.htm - 174k - |
| Skeptics of the Fair Tax have suggested that it might unconstitutionally infringe on state ..... 2 Posted on 07/16/2000 08:34:56 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3971d4b96c73.htm - 173k - |
| For the lurkers reading this thread, please call 1-800-FAIR-TAX and hear it from the horses mouth. 70 Posted on 07/25/2001 03:35:36 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b5e27db504f.htm - 228k - |
| In the case of the Fair Tax, one would want to make sure that the vast sums that have been ... 10 Posted on 11/04/2000 08:27:20 PST by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a0070054170.htm - 43k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. GRASSROOTS EXPLODE IN SUPPORT OF FAIRTAX. Oh my I hate to hear that. They were one of my favorite groups. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a38fb1bc43888.htm - 250k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. "the FairTax will provide every household in America with a rebate of sales tax paid on necessities." "FAMILY CONSUMPTION ALLOWANCE" ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a390b2e0b242a.htm - 94k - |
| I want to let everyone in on the details of last night's Fair Tax meeting .... 9 Posted on 08/25/1999 11:06:59 PDT by CHIEF negotiator (S-CRAP-THE-DAM-CODE) ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37c426c57528.htm - 248k - |
| Under the FairTax "used" [previously taxed] items are not taxed again. 54 Posted on 12/07/1999 19:06:29 PST by CHIEF negotiator (Visualize Whirled Peas!) ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a384d972c2782.htm - 181k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Fair tax is a Communist plan. Go to: www.unfts.com and see for yourself. So the US "Fair Tax" is only mimicry of the the true gov't. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a9ffa893104.htm - 126k - |
| To: Chief negotiator and Fair Tax Fans. Here's a little something for you to pick on... Pretty biased report, wouldn't you say? ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37c54943240e.htm - 168k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. fair tax bump! I'm with ya chief. 13 Posted on 03/22/2000 08:49:03 PST by Huck [ Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | Top | Last ] ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a38d8e79b561d.htm - 250k - |
| 1 Posted on 08/28/2001 10:17:38 PDT by CHIEF negotiator .... The Fair Tax will abolish payroll taxes, corporate income taxes and high compliance costs. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b8bd2325789.htm - 115k - |
| I lean toward the Fair Tax plan promoted by Taxman and Chief Negotiator here on FR. 29 Posted on 02/27/2001 12:11:43 PST by ftrader ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a9bfe0545c2.htm - 218k - |
| 5 Posted on 12/18/2000 09:01:41 PST by CHIEF negotiator ..... First, the FairTax is not a VAT. A VAT works very differently. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a3e2a307be3.htm - 120k - |
| 'cause you ain't signed up yet to be a FairTax FReeper Cyber-Warrior! :-). 4 Posted on 04/27/2000 14:02:47 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a39088f136f3c.htm - 136k - |
| 14 Posted on 03/31/2001 19:11:22 PST by CHIEF negotiator .... Business to business sales is not taxed under the FairTax. Moreover, since all producers of ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3ac686fd67b2.htm - 50k - |
| Paul O'Neill wants imput for Fair Tax legislation. 12 Posted on 01/29/2001 09:51:30 PST by CHIEF negotiator [ Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | Top | Last ] ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a7599635d96.htm - 64k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. Chief, thanks for the clarification about the procedures for repeal of the 16th Amendment. My recollection was that the Fair Tax Act ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b527c78335f.htm - 188k - |
| ... where there are no significant differences by party or class in the 'ideal,' fair tax." .... 6 Posted on 06/23/1999 09:25:58 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3770f5ef1cb9.htm - 47k - |
| "National Small Business United" Endorses The FairTax Plan. The "FairTax" will abolish corporate ... 5 Posted on 01/14/2000 15:37:32 PST by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3803b564013d.htm - 71k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. The only reason for the so-called fair tax, is that liberals need more of your and my money. A sales tax added to the income tax is ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a391d86012e90.htm - 227k - |
| But as I understand it, the Fair Tax funds Social Security. ... 23 Posted on 08/21/1999 09:27:38 PDT by CHIEF negotiator (S-CRAP-THE-DAM-CODE!!!) ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37bd8bf12c4d.htm - 101k - |
| He added that farmers would especially benefit from Fair Tax because of their large exports. .... 1 Posted on 07/21/1999 16:25:05 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a379656d111a2.htm - 191k - |
| There are folks on this message board who know the FairTax plan inside-out. Folks like: CHIEF negotiator, pigdog, ancient_geezer, Taxman... and many, ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b1d871047d3.htm - 145k - |
| Therefore I urge you to please support the FAIR TAX/National Retail Sales Tax. ... 1 Posted on 06/20/2001 14:01:44 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b310f385ea7.htm - 104k - |
| 4 Posted on 05/20/2001 07:41:24 PDT by CHIEF negotiator ..... All valid households will receive a rebate equivalent to the FairTax paid on essential goods ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b07d3ca1ef0.htm - 195k - |
| 1 Posted on 02/14/2001 19:42:58 PST by CHIEF negotiator .... In the fall of 1998, FReepers pigdog, Taxman and myself organized the FairTax FReeper Cyber ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a8b50420f77.htm - 118k - |
| ... of you tax Freepers out there, please, don't turn this thread into a NRST/Fair Tax thread. .... 4 Posted on 12/20/2000 09:02:45 PST by CHIEF negotiator ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a40e47f1ff5.htm - 59k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. The FairTax Is Revenue-Neutral. The FairTax plan won't deprive the government of needed funds, or citizens of needed programs. ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a1935f4677f.htm - 42k - |
| 3 Posted on 01/05/2000 18:24:36 PST by CHIEF negotiator .... Fair Tax purchase goods with a 30% tax charge on the price new products and services? ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3873f22e34a9.htm - 141k - |
| 13 Posted on 01/14/2000 09:34:52 PST by CHIEF negotiator .... Economic research to support the FairTax concept is funded through the National Tax Research ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a387f30b32643.htm - 72k - |
| To: CHIEF negotiator. "Since Lurkey demands that we use the tax exclusive rate when figuring the FairTax, we demand that he use the tax exclusive rate when ... www.freerepublic.com/forum/a38386dc05c4f.htm - 206k - |
Just like now -- that will not change, regardless of where the money comes from, previously taxed or not, the 23%/30percent (whatever) will be included in the selling price as before --NOT ADDED ON TO IT.
Can you try that again in English?
That's a good thing. We're paying it now. There will be more public awareness of exactly the toll this runaway government is placing on its citizens.
Man, I detest .pdf format.
Why is that?
I did not count, but my last two posts should have well over 100. There are a lot more. Between pigdog years and then chief negotiators years of pimping the fairtax, there are thousands. I barely scratched the surface with chief and haven't even gotten into pigdog.
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