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Coping With the Caveman in the Crib
NY Times ^ | February 5, 2008 | TARA PARKER-POPE

Posted on 02/06/2008 8:15:09 PM PST by neverdem

If there is such a person as a “baby whisperer,” it is the pediatrician Dr. Harvey Karp, whose uncanny ability to quiet crying babies became the best-selling book “The Happiest Baby on the Block.”

Dr. Karp’s method, endorsed by child advocates and demonstrated in television appearances and a DVD version of his book, shows fussy babies who are quickly, almost eerily soothed by a combination of tight swaddling, loud shushing and swinging, which he says mimics the sensations of the womb.

Now Dr. Karp, assistant professor of pediatrics at the University of California, Los Angeles, has turned his attention to the toddler years...

--snip--

For instance, a toddler throwing a tantrum over a cookie might wail, “I want it. I want it. I want cookie now.”

Often, a parent will adopt a soothing tone saying, “No, honey, you have to wait until after dinner for a cookie.”

Such a response will, almost certainly, make matters worse. “It’s loving, logical and reasonable,” notes Dr. Karp. “And it’s infuriating to a toddler. Now they have to say it over harder and louder to get you to understand.”

Dr. Karp adopts a soothing, childlike voice to demonstrate how to respond to the toddler’s cookie demands.

“You want. You want. You want cookie. You say, ‘Cookie, now. Cookie now.’ ”

It’s hard to imagine an adult talking like this in a public place. But Dr. Karp notes that this same form of “active listening” is a method adults use all the time. The goal is not simply to repeat words but to make it clear that you hear someone’s complaint. “If you were upset and fuming mad, I might say, ‘I know. I know. I know. I get it. I’m really really sorry. I’m sorry.’ That sounds like gibberish out of context,” he says.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: children; health; medicine; toddlers
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To: Right Angler
I have a fairly effective method for our children.

"There are five lights..."

21 posted on 02/07/2008 2:54:09 AM PST by Caipirabob (Communists... Socialists... Democrats...Traitors... Who can tell the difference?)
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To: neverdem
Dr. Karp’s method, endorsed by child advocates and demonstrated in television appearances and a DVD version of his book, shows fussy babies who are quickly, almost eerily soothed by a combination of tight swaddling, loud shushing and swinging, which he says mimics the sensations of the womb.

This is nothing new. Babies have been swaddled for thousands of years. And in most cultures, babies are almost constantly carried.

22 posted on 02/07/2008 5:33:12 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: The Spirit Of Allegiance

My son was a very early talker; complete sentences when he was 18 months. He started talking at about a year and mimicked EVERYTHING his slightly older sister (by 18 months) said, who was really just taking off on the talking thing herself, and I think that’s what helped.

I was astounded at the thought processes and reasoning ability an 18 month old was capable of. You could carry on conversations with him. He knew the sound of every vehicle with a motor and generally what it was.

So many times when toddlers act up, people try the soothing talk and reasoning with them and the kids just bury their heads and pull the shy act, like they don’t understand. Their only problem is expressing themselves verbally, it’s not usually comprehension.

Well, when I work nursery in church and some kid pulls that, I look them in the eye and tell them that I know they can understand me and they’d better stop it now because their act isn’t going to work with me. I’ve actually gotten dirty looks from these kids. And they do go off and find something else to do. This is especially true once they hit two.


23 posted on 02/07/2008 5:44:49 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Fiddlstix

Watched the video from this guy, tried out the techniques. They work.

It’s also funny, now, that the cave(wo)man has turned three and has some sense of shame as well as budding logic skills,

to demand that she throw a “better” tantrum.

“Oh, come on, you can do better than that! Kick your feet more! Pound the floor with your hands!”

She gets embarrassed and stops, most of the time.


24 posted on 02/07/2008 5:49:14 AM PST by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: aruanan

And if they never get out of this mindset, they become what is known as “the Democrat base”.


25 posted on 02/07/2008 5:50:15 AM PST by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: PUGACHEV
annoyance and frustration over the fact that they could not express themselves well enough to be understood.

This was mostly alleviated by teaching them baby sign language.

They love, not only being able to tell you that they want milk, are hungry, are all done, etc, but they also love telling you about the kitty/doggie/fishie/birdie they see, the book that they'd like you to read, or the cars they see driving by.

26 posted on 02/07/2008 5:52:38 AM PST by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: metmom
I’ve actually gotten dirty looks from these kids.

Some friends have some "spirited" little 3 yr old boys. They are of the "don't break their spirit" parenting model.

The parents do get embarrassed when they won't behave or obey. But if I'm there, I'll pick the little "free spirits" up, set them in front of their parent, and say firmly "obey your mom/dad". Yeah, they glare at me, so they FULLY understand what's going on.

27 posted on 02/07/2008 5:56:08 AM PST by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: MrB

I hate that.

Teaching them to control themselves is NOT going to break their spirit. If those kids don’t learn some self-control as kids, the parents will have NO control over them once they hit puberty.

When my youngest was two and refused to pick up her toys, I took her, placed her feet on my feet, held her hands, “walked” her over to her toy, bend her over, placed her hands on the toy, walked her over to the toy box, and pried her fingers apart to make her drop the toy in the toy box.

She screamed bloody murder the whole time; you’d think I was cutting her arm off. But she learned. She did finally put her toys away herself, and she learned that she HAD to obey me. I wanted it in her head that I could MAKE her so that when she was really too old for me to *make* her do it physically, I could still make her through authority.

And, boy, let me tell you, has that girl got spirit. Pity the guy that tries anything inappropriate with her.


28 posted on 02/07/2008 6:11:16 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom; Gabz; JustPiper; eeevil conservative; Tennessee Nana

I’m waiting to find and marry Miss Right so I’m not a dad yet but my limited experience with young kids is that they are indeed QUITE aware of their own selfishness at such an age. Just as you indicate.

And out here in CA one evil useful idiot in the Legislature is trying to ban parental spankings until age three!

Meanwhile, earlier today I heard on a talk show the tidbit tha the average toddler hears the word “No” 400 times a day. I’d say if the parents have to say no that much, they don’t have an environment that’s kid-friendly in the first place. How is a kid to become positive and willing to take risks if they hear NO 400X daily? Ungh.


29 posted on 02/07/2008 6:11:41 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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To: MrB

I like your tagline.


30 posted on 02/07/2008 6:12:30 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Cementjungle

Swaddling = Straitjacket...


31 posted on 02/07/2008 6:23:02 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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To: The Spirit Of Allegiance; Cementjungle

Swaddling = Straitjacket...

Oops....forgot the /SARCASM in my comment to #4


32 posted on 02/07/2008 6:24:38 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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To: Candor7
If you don't say "NO COOKIE" child has achieved control, and then child does not learn discipline, and child grows up to be a liberal socialist instead of a conservative.

I don't see where he is suggesting that you give the child the cookie. It sounds like he is more or less saying this will help the kid know you've heard what they said.

I don't necessarily agree the exact wording he is suggesting. I'd say, "I know you want a cookie now (short pause) but you can't have one until after dinner." Seemed to work for me.

33 posted on 02/07/2008 6:30:46 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: neverdem; grellis; xsmommy; tioga; WhyisaTexasgirlinPA; SoftballMominVA; Amelia; metmom; ...

MOM Ping!!!!!!!!!


34 posted on 02/07/2008 6:38:23 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: The Spirit Of Allegiance

LOL, They also USE *NO!!!* about 400 times a day.

Oft times, it’s not a matter of being in a kid friendly environment, like telling them no about touching fragile items. It’s often in relation to how they interact with other kids as far as grabbing their toys and hitting and pushing other kids.

Anything you don’t want broken should be put away. I know the old school of *teaching them to mind* and I don’t oppose that. They should learn to keep their little hands off stuff that’s not theirs. The problem is, accidents happen and better to be safe than have to deal with some valuable item getting broke because someone tripped or bumped into something. Everyone feels bad then and it’s not worth the regret.

One observation. I am a firm believer in kids learning to share, but often what I see going on is not sharing.

This situation occurred once. My son had just gone outside to play and got on the swingset. The snotty, bully girl next door comes over and says to him that he needs to get off the swing because he’s been on long enough and he needs to *share*.

Well, what’s really going on is the manipulative little brat has learned that if she went up to someone and demanded it, she’d get told no. If she turned the situation around and accused him of *not sharing*, all of a sudden, my son, who had done nothing wrong, was the bad guy. Now all the attention was on him for being *selfish* and she was the poor injured party. He was accused of something he didn’t even do and she had learned that it usually got her what she wanted. Once I figured this out, I put an end to it pretty quickly.

Now, I’ve seen this happen in church nursery a LOT. Some kid is quietly, happily playing by himself with a toy. Some kid who is bored comes along and grabs the toy from him. Naturally, the child protests. Almost without fail, some adult will come along and chastise the child who did nothing wrong for *not sharing* and the kid who took the toy is rewarded for his behavior by getting it. So in nursery, I tell the disruptors that they have a whole nursery full of toys to play with, they don’t NEED to have the one someone else is playing with instantly; they can have it when the other kid is done because they won’t keep it forever. They don’t have to have that toy right now, they’re just trying to cause trouble, so in the meantime, they need to find something else to do. The other thing I noticed, is that when some adult does give in and make the kids give up his toy, the other kid loses interest really fast. They never really wanted it in the first place.

In real life, I do not go up to someone and take what they have and say “You’ve had that car long enough. Give it to me, you need to share.”

So I started teaching my kids that if someone is doing something by themselves, they are not obligated to include anyone else. It’s a good thing to do but everyone needs some space and time to be by themselves.

It teaches sharing in a different way. It teaches that you respect others and let them have their space, just like you want to have your space. If you want to play, ask. If they say they’d rather not, move on.

This settled a LOT of the arguments my kids were having with each other because it seemed that the more I tried to teach them to share, the more manipulative and selfish they seemed to be getting. Once we established that policy, things went a lot more smoothly.


35 posted on 02/07/2008 6:40:02 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: The Spirit Of Allegiance

No, you save the straightjacket for when they’re teenagers.

//sarcasm// for the sarcasm challenged....


36 posted on 02/07/2008 6:42:31 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

If despite good parenting the teens STILL become Liberals, THEN the straitjackets, is what I meant!

;^)

As a teen, the parents have straitjacket control over the teen’s WALLET and must use that wisely....


37 posted on 02/07/2008 6:45:49 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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To: metmom

“I started teaching my kids that if someone is doing something by themselves, they are not obligated to include anyone else. It’s a good thing to do but everyone needs some space and time to be by themselves.”


Fabulous. If enough adults ‘got it’ we could undo the KELO ruling!


38 posted on 02/07/2008 6:48:37 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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To: Gabz

Interesting thread.


39 posted on 02/07/2008 7:36:03 AM PST by tioga (Beware: conservative with back to the wall. Proceed with extreme caution.)
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To: neverdem
I will say that I see this with my own toddler -- he will keep repeating his current observation or demand, until you repeat it back to him. It's a cognitive thing, I guess -- by hearing you repeat it, he knows you have listened and understood.
40 posted on 02/07/2008 7:39:49 AM PST by kevkrom (Voters say they want substance, but then they just vote for the guy with nice hair instead.)
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