Posted on 10/21/2007 11:38:01 PM PDT by My Favorite Headache
I am going to post just a small review of my night with 23 Republicans at the Fox News Orlando Republican Presidential Debate.
Luntz was angry early on before camera's went live when he polled the group to make sure everyone there was undecided. A 21 yr old guy raised his hand and said he was supporting Ron Paul. Luntz absolutely lost it on this kid and said "Why in the hell did you not put that on your questionaire that was e-mailed to you? Why does it not shock me that a Ron Paul supporter would pull this kind of crap?"
"If someone else shows up you are being replaced and out of here...this room is for undecided."
I was originally placed in the second row towards the end of the row next to a man named Fred Hawkins Jr. who is running for Osceola County Commissioner. Luntz asked us a bunch of questions with a camera crew and producers in tow behind him and I was the first to answer. I was the first person to use the word "socialism" and it spread like wild fire.
I said the concept of America voting a socialist like Hillary Clinton as President should be motivation enough for Republicans to get their act together. I reminded Luntz of the Hillary quote saying "This is the same woman who is quoted by the San Francisco Chronicle saying "We will have to take things away for the common good." Luntz had this smirk on his face and he knew I handed him gold.
After 3 segments it was time to go live. By the time you saw what you did at home we had already gone through 3 rounds of questions and I was lighting up the joint with what I call the biggest crisis this campaign.
What do any of these men who are running for President plan on doing to combat the extreme hatred of anyone who is a Republican by the mainstream media and how bad the liberal blogs, Soros, and just about everyone who has some sort of journalistic power slimes Republicans on a daily basis. Who is going to have the spine to stand up to it and how do they plan on doing it when the Bush Administration has been knocked out time and time again with no fight.
WHO IS GOING TO PREVENT THE PERCEPTION THAT REPUBLICANS ARE NOT WAR MONGERING NAZI'S WHO ARE OUT FOR OIL COMPANIES AND THE RICH?
Luntz definitely told us through his polling and research that as of today Hillary Clinton will win in a landslide. He was putting all of his money on her. I said you are going to go broke. He said Republicans are too disorganized and the focus group proved that.
I said not it does not. I said if you want to see motivation and organization? Put Hillary Clinton against any Republican and you will see Republicans vote like you have never seen before, the alternative is too grave. Whether we can stand it or not Republicans will do everything in their power to elect anyone else but Clinton.
You saw my exchange later on saying we have long memories and do not want to live through that hell again.
The Ron Paul comment I made was simple and sweet and every single person except the Ron Paul supporter all said "perfect" with regards to that remark.
Luntz walks over and says "you are good...you are going down to the front row...keep talking."
We taped about 70 mins worth of discussion. More clips will be aired at 6:20 AM on Fox and Friends First and then 8:20 AM on Fox and Friends. Then more clips from the debate will be aired on tomorrow's Hannity and Colmes as well from 9-10.
I am sure this is when you will see how hardcore it got in there.
I called out the room at the end of it all..when I saw how many people put their hands up that Rudy was the only one who could beat Hillary I said "I am really saddened to see how many people think he is their answer. That is very telling that the fire that was there earlier tonight for all of us agreeing that we want a true Conservative is gone already and that makes me sick as a true Conservative."
To me the top winners tonight were Romney, Huckabee, Thompson, and blech...I hate to say this but Rudy. His night was not that bad but he certainly is not my top choice for President.
I called for a thining of the herd. Paul, Tancredo, and Hunter need to go. They virtually played zero in the room. It was sad because I really like Tom and Duncan and said that if a Republican wins the White House in 2008 they should all be given cabinet posts ASAP.
Except Paul...which who by the end of the night lost his one supporter...the 21 yr old guy who didn't raise his hand when asked if anyone supported him.
Finally...Luntz. A nice guy but can be insulting. When he compared a moderate conservative to a major serious conservative he wanted a show of hands...then he added "When I say major serious conservative I mean you can hear the German Nazi marching bands and get excited", I then said to him "There it is..exactly what I was talking about." Luntz said "Relax I was only joking." I said "I know you were and it is that kind of talk that I am absolutely disgusted by and sick of...sick of it Frank...enough is enough with the nazi conservative comparisons people have got to speak up for conservatives...true conservatives."
That in a short capsule is it. Met some really nice people and we had a discussion at the end of everything and went our own ways.
I thank Luntz for letting me say whatever I wanted to on camera and speak up for Conservatives and letting me call Ron Paul out on global television.
It’s likely that a goodly number of “the best and brightest” have closets they’d prefer to keep closed.
There are a number of candidates currently running that I wish had kept their closet doors closed!
LOLOL. Actually, you didn't get any of them.
But if Gore or Kerry had been elected you would have.
“You’re one of my top 5 favorite posters I’ve ever read on Free Republic.”
Thanks.
“Your arguments are usually compelling and insightful...but you’re dead wrong here,...”
I might be.
Or maybe you are.
I don’t know about you, but my crystal ball’s in the shop for repairs. I have no special skill or grace to predict the future infallibly.
But I make do with what I’ve got.
Which brings me to the opposite conclusions that you draw.
I think that Mrs. Clinton is likely a bit more liberal than Mr. Giuliani, but I think that a Giuliani administration will likely produce more harm to the United States in the next four or eight years than a Clinton administration.
I’ve expressed my reasons why. You disagree with them. That’s fine. I disagree with your reasons.
It’s possible that Mrs. Clinton will do more damage than Mr. Giuliani in the next four or eight years. It’s a tough call either way, at least in my mind. But what I believe much more firmly is that Mr. Giuliani will cause much more damage to the United States in the long run than Mrs. Clinton will, because he will destroy the Republican Party as a vehicle for conservatism.
But you disagree. Which is why you’re willing to vote for Mr. Giuliani, in spite of the fact that he’s a baby murderer, a gun grabber (literally), a homosexual agenda pusher, and is squishy on illegal immigration (and thus, on the war) and taxes.
I don’t know why you wouldn’t vote for Mr. Giuliani in the general election, given what you believe.
But given what I believe, I don’t know why I’d vote for him.
Ultimately, though, this kind of crap:
“I wasn’t trying to devastate you. It isn’t possible to devastate anyone willing to enable another Clinton presidency.”
“I hope you like the new psychiatrist Hillary chooses for you.”
“sitetest, your recent postings are so far beneath you...”
“...and you should be ashamed.”
is not especially effective at persuading me of the correctness of your (heretofore missing) arguments.
Or even crap like this:
“You know that with a Clinton presidency we get the maximum number of abortions possible...”
I don’t know that at all. In fact, I think it’s likely that a Giuliani administration would lead to more abortions over the next four or eight years, and I’m pretty sure that it would lead to tens of millions more in the years thereafter.
Thus, I could just as easily condemn you for the blood of millions of unborn that will be on your hands if Mr. Giuliani should be president, because tens of millions more unborn babies will be murdered as a result, since the Republican Party will drop any attempts at undoing abortion on demand for decades and decades to come.
But I don’t condemn you for that. Why? Because I don’t think you accept my premise, that electing Mr. Giuliani will lead to the Republican Party dropping any effort to undo abortion on demand. I don't think you believe the premise that Mr. Giuliani will likely have more freedom of action to do more pro-death things than would Mrs. Clinton. I believe these premises strongly. But you don’t.
Thus, it would be wrong for me to frame the issue as if you intend to murder millions of additional unborn babies, or that you even believe that that’s what your actions will lead to. Because that isn’t your intention or your belief. Even though I think that’s what would happen if Mr. Giuliani became president.
No matter how insightful a poster you may think I am, we’ve come to different conclusions on this issue. The bottom line is that neither of us knows the future. Each of us is trying to reason out what we think the future might be like under this or that scenario. We come to different places. I think that our differences are honest ones. I impute nothing malevolent, stupid, or insane to you; I’d appreciate the same in return.
sitetest
I think you've reached your conclusions honestly. I'm actually shocked to find myself disagreeing with you so strongly. My Best to you.
“My apologies.”
No problem.
“I think you’ve reached your conclusions honestly.”
Thanks.
“I’m actually shocked to find myself disagreeing with you so strongly.”
It happens. I’m happy to go over point-by-point why I think what I think, as long as we don’t make it personal.
“My Best to you.”
You, too.
sitetest
So "conservative principles" include overseas military adventurism, but only when a Republican is president, right?
Anyone remember the FR-organized anti-war marches re: Kosovo? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?
 |
|
mvpel
Since Apr 14, 2000
|
Sauce that, my friend.
Surely we can agree on conservative principles like firearms freedom, individual liberty, limited government, lower taxes, due process for the unborn, and so on, without savaging each other, right?
One need only look at the recent gun control bills, including a totally unworkable ammunition microstamping mandate, which were signed into law by California GOP standard-bearer Arnold Schwarzenegger, deemed more "electable" by the majority of recall election voters than a true conservative like Tom McClintock.
The California GOP has been declining for a long time, and it may well be engaged in a few post-mortem twitches at this point.
So, I’m suppose to operate under whatever your principles are, but to hell with mine? By the way, just in case you missed it, Kosovo did not attack the United States of America. Nor did we have a war against them in order to remove invaders from a neighboring country, and then have 12 years of non-compliance.
Your attempts to equate these two events - one conducted to divert attention away from what Billy Jeff was doing behind everyone’s back (not just in the Oval Office, but also with more important issues like giving away nuclear secrets to China and Korea) and another being waged against enemies who have declared war against us, falls well short of rational.
Oh, forgive me. I didn’t see your later post until after I sent that comment to you. Now that I see you are a Run Paul Run supporter I understand your irrationality.
Soldier,
As a french observer i am wondering if some fake “conservatives” standing on an extreme position or guys like Ron Paul who wants to look as a “moderate”,i mean a “pacifist”, are demonrat trolls trying to divide republicans...
So you are content to have our brave and patriotic soldiers be simply the tools of the corrupt and thug-infested United Nations - which has nations like China, Cuba, and Sudan on its "Human Rights" council - to our nation's soldiers stand between a brutal tyrant and a corrupt monarch, then force them to leave the brutal tyrant in power after devastating his army because the United Nations would disapprove if they took out the trash in 1991, thereby setting up our brave soldiers for 12 years as targets for anti-aircraft batteries in no-fly zones, and setting up the dissenters who - were counting on our courageous soldiers to back them up - for unabated persecution and slaughter by the tyrant?
Are you content to to have our proud soldiers punished like Michael New should they refuse to don the United Nations flag and the United Nations blue beret and serve under the command of a foreigner?
Is that a "conservative" position in your view?
Is that a "rational" position in your view?
Try to see past your blind hatred of Ron Paul and consider these questions directly, without reverting to schoolyard name-calling or McCain-style tub-thumping.
In short, SoldierDad, I want your son or daughter to fight for our nation and our nation’s interests, not for the interests of the United Nations.
Run Paul Run is a fruitloop. I don’t have a “blind hatred” for this man. Just a desire to have qualified candidates running for the most important office in the world. Oh, and in case you didn’t pay attention (and you didn’t) there was plenty of evidence of Iraq’s collusion with terrorists after 9/11 to justify going in and taking out that SOB. Please do not place words or thoughts from your sick mind into my mouth anymore. Nowhere will you find any posts from me where I support giving the U.N. the authority to have control over our troops. Your words and thoughts leave a distictly poor taste in my mouth. I said at the time of the ‘91 war to remove Saddam from Kuwait that we needed to take him from power instead of leaving that wound to fester. That was and remains my position. You can make out any accusations against me you desire, but you will lose for you do not have any clue on what I stand for. You’re little pin-headed candidate will lose his bid for the GOP nomination, and then take all of the campaign money he’s bilked from his supporters to make a turd party run so that Hitlery wins the presidency. Is that what you want, pin-head supporter?
I do not wonder, I strongly suspect. This is an attempt to divide the GOP electorate so that Hitlery will be elected to the Presidency.
Does anyone know where I can check out the full video of the Orlando debate? I missed it when it aired, and I’d love to check out the full thing, rather then bits and pieces on youtube.
Perfectly said, Carry Okie! Funny how turned around this has become.
Not funny how we have allowed the left to get away with it.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.