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Al-Qaeda faces rebellion from the ranks
The Times Online ^ | July 23, 2007 | Deborah Haynes in Doura

Posted on 07/22/2007 9:33:14 PM PDT by NordP

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To: johnny7
EXCELLENT points. Iraqis will say pull out once, shame on you--pull out twice, shame on me and they will never be on our side again.

***to deal with them is to give away what so many have died to secure!***

...And they will have had those that died, die in vain--for their own perceived political gains. SHAMEFUL.

41 posted on 07/23/2007 6:03:26 AM PDT by NordP (HUNTER: "The real question for Mexico--Why are your people crossing burning deserts to get away?")
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To: NordP
“It is only after al-Qaeda has become truly barbaric and done things like, to teach lessons to people, cut their face off with piano wire in front of their family and then murdered everybody except one child who told the tale afterwards . . . that people realise how much of a mess they are in,” Lieutenant James Danly, 31, who works on military intelligence in Doura, said.

You this kind of thing over and over throughout the Islamic world. The salfalist get a large amount of suppport when they're "over there", but it becomes a horse of the different color when they are in your neighborhood.

42 posted on 07/23/2007 6:04:06 AM PDT by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: NordP
Sounds like al-Q has overplayed their hands. Good. When the infidel occupiers are less despised and feared by them than their own leadership, the tide will turn.

We need to let peace break out in Iraq. Then pull back to our remote bases and let their government do its job with some training and equipment help from us. They need to get the oil flowing and create some prosperity so people will be loyal to their government and see a brighter future for their children.
43 posted on 07/23/2007 6:05:53 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Rudy: tough on terror, scared of Iowa)
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To: George W. Bush
Right. I wish we would have also pushed farming in Afghanistan instead of allowing drugs to reemerge. Drug $ is awfully powerful, but we would have been further ahead without it.

I think drug dealers and drug $ is behind much of our problem with having a backbone in Mexico, too....just a thought.

44 posted on 07/23/2007 6:10:11 AM PDT by NordP (HUNTER: "The real question for Mexico--Why are your people crossing burning deserts to get away?")
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To: NordP

“So sad that our MSM wouldn’t be for a winning outcome. I just don’t get it.”

They’re all Democrats. They think like Democrats. They want the Democrats to win, politically. That’s all you need to know about the “news media”.


45 posted on 07/23/2007 6:13:37 AM PDT by popdonnelly (Those rollaway beds are symbolic of how we are going to roll away the Democrats in 2008)
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To: NordP

Freedom and democracy can’t last long without prosperity. Afghanistan is a bigger challenge than Iraq because they have few natural resources or opportunity for industry. Yet, even the Afghans can do far better than the Taliban ever did. However, with Afghanistan, our European and Asian allies still have some interest in trying to help with the effort to stabilize and create a functional and peaceful democracy. And some major pipelines will be running through Afghanistan as well, creating some economic opportunity there.


46 posted on 07/23/2007 6:25:20 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Rudy: tough on terror, scared of Iowa)
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To: NordP

I believe that we have passed the tipping point. The ‘Rats are now desperate to get the US out of Iraq before we win.


47 posted on 07/23/2007 6:27:30 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

The Rats are now desperate to get the US out of Iraq before we win.

It does appear to be the case. The democrats (thanks the moonbats in their base) are totally invested in defeat. They see it as a way to win the next election.


48 posted on 07/23/2007 6:41:26 AM PDT by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: popdonnelly
I actually get it, I just don't like it.

Dems + MSM = traitors

49 posted on 07/23/2007 6:41:31 AM PDT by NordP (HUNTER: "The real question for Mexico--Why are your people crossing burning deserts to get away?")
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To: davidosborne

AWESOME! YOUR letter needs to be made into leaflets and distributed in air drops all over the M.E.

BTTT!


50 posted on 07/23/2007 7:03:59 AM PDT by Eagle of Liberty (The United States of America is the only country strong enough to go it alone.)
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To: davidosborne

Very powerful and very truthful letter. God bless you for your service and God bless all our brave troops.


51 posted on 07/23/2007 7:36:36 AM PDT by jveritas (God bless our brave troops and President Bush.)
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To: davidosborne

good post!


52 posted on 07/23/2007 7:37:24 AM PDT by Edgerunner (If you won't let the military fight your battles, you will have to. Keep your powder dry...)
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To: NordP

This was reported on the regular ABC news on radio on my way into work. I could not believe I was hearing it from that source.


53 posted on 07/23/2007 7:38:48 AM PDT by westmichman (They cried "Peace, peace," but there is no peace.)
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To: davidosborne

Great Letter Mr Osborne, you will see victory very shortly.

Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters


54 posted on 07/23/2007 7:40:27 AM PDT by bray (Member of the FR President Bush underground)
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To: pissant
The brit papers will cover it but the US MSM will be silent.

Won't make it through the template.

55 posted on 07/23/2007 8:46:43 AM PDT by Mad_Tom_Rackham (Elections have consequences.)
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To: westmichman
Wow!!! I guess ....
56 posted on 07/23/2007 9:27:11 AM PDT by NordP (HUNTER: "The real question for Mexico--Why are your people crossing burning deserts to get away?")
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To: NordP
Good news. I'm sure a few envelopes stuffed with cash work wonders among the disillusioned in any environment.

I'm guessing that the reality of Taliban style Islamicism is not that appealing even to many Jihadis when they are on the receiving end of it.

57 posted on 07/23/2007 12:20:39 PM PDT by Mad_as_heck (The MSM - America's (domestic) public enemy #1.)
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To: NordP

Afghanistan is the prime place to push for a corn crop.


58 posted on 07/23/2007 8:04:58 PM PDT by BobS
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To: davidosborne
we DO intend to eradicate folks who KILL INNOCENT people or seek to CONTROL people by the use of force or the threat of force and are therefore ENEMIES OF FREEDOM and ENEMIES of ALL PEACEFUL SOCIETIES around the world!

You have just defined islam. Islam kills innocent people, especially if they are infidels who do not wish to be subjugated. Islam seeks “to CONTROL people by the use of force or the threat of force and are therefore ENEMIES OF FREEDOM and ENEMIES of ALL PEACEFUL SOCIETIES around the world”!

Have you noticed how many thousands of uniformed troops are out their with our Americans from Egypt, or Jordan or Saudi Arabia doing bullet magnet and IED Hunting? Where are the 10 or 20 thousand uniformed troops from islamic countries outside Iraq? Heck not even enough of the Iraqis are geared up.

If the “good” moslems where good, there would be 500,000 troops from the “good” moslem countries patrolling the streets and the borders. There are not even 50,000, not even 5,000 moslem uniformed combat troops.

Why?

While we waste time and money and American Blood, the Iranians are attaining nukes.

You and our troops are bravely fighting but the final outcome at best will be another islamic country that is oil rich and considers US infidels.

Split it up and Split. If or when we have to come back, come back with ICBMs.... before they get theirs.

Remember that the Iraqis have designed a constitution that mandates "NO LAW SHALL CONTRADICT ISLAM". .....No American troops should be dying to defend that.

59 posted on 07/24/2007 4:27:11 PM PDT by TomasUSMC ( FIGHT LIKE WW2, FINISH LIKE WW2. FIGHT LIKE NAM, FINISH LIKE NAM)
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To: davidosborne

Dear David,
Allow me to begin that, as a 4 year Vietnam era USAF vet, I respect and honor your service and that of your brothers-in-arms in Iraq.

(Here it comes, right?)

I learned over the week-end that the Iraqi Parliament — apparently taking their cue from the French — is going into recess for the entire month of August! The reason? Even with their air-conditioned digs, it’s just too hot in Baghdad to continue in session!!

If you can, help me understand this.

1. They face a daunting multitude of very serious problems trying to unify a nation of numerous tribes and muslim sects — and they’re taking a month off?

2. American and coalition boys and girls — many of whom have had their multiple tours extended — will be spending August humping through the sand there wearing body armor and full battle rattle in 130 degree heat while other people hurl grenades, launch RPGs and 7.62 bullets their way and set IEDs under their Hummers — and the Iraqi Parliament is taking August OFF?

This smacks of Gulf War 1 where we saw images of fighting age Kuwaiti lads basking along the shores of the Riviera holding drinks with the little umbrellas in them while clutching water-cooled credit cards belonging to their oil-rich fathers who had sent them there to keep them from being hurt — as American boys and girls drove the Iraqis from the country THEY should have remained behind to defend.

What’s wrong with these pictures is they BOTH portray folks perhaps one generation removed from their wandering bedouin tribal forefathers, forefathers whose notion of nationhood and sense of place was essentially limited to the few acres of squalid sand and scrub on which they were encamped at the time.

David, let’s say we DO kill most of the really bad people who wish us death and to take over in Iraq to use it as a base for further assaults against the US, given that the current governing body doesn’t even think it’s important to hang in and get their internal problems dealt with — while they are being protected by American troops —how long can one really hope they will persevere once we are largely out of there and the bad guys start blowing them away one at a time in their beds?

I sure as hell don’t have all the answers. But I do know the question:

If THEY won’t do EVERYTHING — and I mean EVERYTHING — humanly possible, what the hell are WE doing there??

And if they will not do that, we will either leave at some point — or NEVER leave. I suggest we leave sooner rather than later and, if Iraq DOES become the terrorist enclave some fear it will and they DO come at us again — ! Can you say Hiroshima and Nagasaki? As I think I remarked before, it sure as hell worked for the Japanese.

And if they can’t get along with one another, perhaps it’s time to revisit the proposal to partition the place back close to the lines the Brits erased after the fall of the Ottoman Empire and let the largely otherwise useless United Nations — with only MINIMAL participation by the US — police those borders and earn those billions the United States has pissed down their little rathole.

I know — I know, There are MANY decent Iraqis and muslims. And Jeffery Dahmer had wonderful, caring grandparents and Son of Sam was raised by some nice parents who loved him, etc., etc.

Regards and be safe over there.


60 posted on 07/25/2007 11:01:21 AM PDT by Dick Bachert ("The urge to save humanity is often a false front for the urge to rule." Mencken)
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