They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious Bigotry, alive and well today

Saundra Duffy

[Netizen]

Frankly the biggest problem facing the church today is the ever-willingness of its defenders to spin, lie, distort, withhold the truth, etc. on any issue that comes up which might not make the church look good. Some members wearing rose-colored glasses don’t see how foolish this makes them look.

I agree. Reading about church leaders and others bearing false witness makes it hard to grant credibility. jmo

[zerosix]

Thanks for your post. I only pray that she come to Jesus and realize that she is NOT a Christian and that it is she and her family, they are raising their children Mormon, have excluded her own family for this Evil Cult, now referring to itself as Christian when they are anything but.

[Netizen]

Should the Mormons of today have to explain why they hold a man, who most likely was involved in ordering the MMM and who spent years denying it and covering it up, in such high regard?

You know what else I find odd?

1870-71 About this time, Young meets with Lee, Haight, Dame, and others involved in the massacre. Historians suggest that Young singles out Lee to take the blame, confident in the belief that Lee will do as he is told at any trial. Lee is excommunicated.

July 23, 1875
The trial of John Lee opens in the courtroom of Judge Jacob Boreman. Payment for Lee's defense is arranged by Brigham Young. The prosecution's star witness is Philip Klingensmith.

Now, why in the world would Young arrange for paying for the defense of a man he had already excommunicated???

[greyfoxx39]

Except that I am completely surprise to hear sevenbak say the Relief Society (women’s organization) attends priesthood meetings.

This simply would not have been allowed to take place in any Ward that I was part of.

From what I have seen, contrary to the comments a little earlier about the consistency of the LDS church, there are quite a few things that have changed since I was a member.

As a matter of fact, what I have gathered in reading on other sites, the rules are enforced more harshly in some areas that they were in my area 40 years ago especially the ban against coffee, tea and wine. I won't go into specifics here.

[Netizen]

Your post raises a lot of godd questions. It reeks of buying one’s way into Heaven and brings to mind the over turning of the tables of the moneychangers.

[greyfoxx39]

Check at Yahoo.

[DelphiUser]

I said:Since there are “No pictures” and no refreshments, and not talking in the sealing room, just don’t go, go to the reception, that’s where all the fun is anyway. Nobody is forcing anybody.

You said:DU, read that paragraph again to yourself. Seems a little callous and unfeeling to me. "Just don't go" isn't gonna cut it with loving parents that have looked forward for years to seeing their child married. And you accuse parents of just wanting to be there so they can chat and take pictures? Cold. "Nobody is forcing anybody!" Lovely.

The reception is the thing not to miss if you are a Mormon and want to be remembered at a wedding, the Sealing room is quite, reverent and the sealer and those being sealed (briefly) are the only ones who speak. Mom and Dad will not be sitting with the bride or groom, Dad does not even get to give the bride away. The sealing ceremony is beautiful, but to someone who does not believe, I can only assume it will be long and boring ceremony.

As for my attitudes about marriage, and what’s fun and what’s not, being cold, or unfeeling. I am a male chauvinist pig, proud to be one. My wife likes me that way, and I care far more about her opinion than anyone else’s

Your posts often smack of feminism and a feminist viewpoint, this is one of them.

We guys really do not LIKE the ceremony, sitting quietly, getting dressed up, we go along with it because we want to be married, but the wedding is for the wife. So as a guy, the reception is more fun (as long as I don’t end up washing dishes again).

As for actually being “Callos and unfeelong; Two of my brothers married Japanese girls, their parents were sitting in that waiting room I was talking about with me trying to explain in sign language what was going on. (Different times, different temples, same me, as I had not yet been to the temple myself)

When I got married, my wife’s father was unable to attend and was sitting in that waiting room, so once again, you have no idea what you are talking about.

From a Guys’ viewpoint:
The reception is more fun.
The food is at the reception.
The reception is where the pictures that you will look at for the rest of your lives will be taken will be taken.
The reception is more important to the Guy than the ceremony, except that the ceremony needs to happen.

You think I am being flip, well, I always am, but this is also true. There are more perspectives than yours. It seems to me that want everyone to agree with YOUR perspective, or else admit that they are wrong.

I have my own views and your perspective does not invalidate my views

This goes back to the whole reason this thread has gone on for so long. Here we are a group of people with differing perceptions of reality. One group trying to get the other to agree with their perceptions at all costs, the other group desperately struggling to protect their perspective thrust an parry, slice and block, feint and spin.

The funny thing is, both sides to me anyway, think they are the ones being attacked.

Of course I have my own perspective, so I am as guilty as the rest.

[colorcountry]

Did you ever hear what happened to Klingensmith??

Didn’t think so, nobody else has either.

Some say he moved to Nevada....basically disappeared of the face of the earth.

But I know? Seven, that is a clue to some of the information my mother will not allow to see the light of day....but when she passes......

[greyfoxx39]

DU, all I can say to this reply is that you are completely overlooking my point that these parents that are excluded are loving, feeling people, and what should be a joyful occasion for them is instead hearbreaking. I won’t even address that bunch of spin in your reply except, oooohh beware the dreaded feminist!

[colorcountry]

Have you ever been to a Mormon Wedding Reception (rhetorical question)?

They aren’t fun! That is unless you like punch and cookies and shaking hands.

[greyfoxx39]

No green jello? Awww....

[Truth-Miner]

Okay, I checked at Yahoo but didn’t find any reference to
***** Color, was their not a recent action by the general authorities in SLC removing the Ladies Relief Society from the leadership of women and substituting men?

The LDS site stated
“A new Relief Society general presidency was announced during general conference. Julie B. Beck was sustained as the general president of the Relief Society, and Silvia H. Allred and Barbara Thompson will serve as first and second counselors, respectively.”

The names and the pics are distinctively Female. I don’t follow.

[colorado tanker]

the reality is, the DNC is going to exploit the deep differences in Christian Orthodox beliefs and Mormonism beliefs

Yep. The Mormon-bashing and Mormon, as you put it "proselytizing" (don't think I'd put it that way), is playing right into the hands of the Dems.

IMHO, it's just part of a sad spectacle right now on FR, where the political debate mainly consists of hit-posts on the other candidates rather than supportive posts of one's own candidate. Howard Dean must be loving this - a President with numbers trending below 30 and a divided Republican Party to boot.

[DelphiUser]

As the parents of their first born who happens to be the BRIDE you state, 'Just don't GO?

I am sorry that you were not ready to be a part of something eternal. But the tenor of your post here says some very interesting things, please read this all the way through before you react.

as a matter of FACT, we did because we PAID FOR IT ALL

You paid for it because you love your daughter, and that’s beautiful.

I can assure you, no one in the Bride's family was "having any fun". Were too busy tearing up by this tragedy referred to as a "Beautiful Mormon Wedding.

Were you sad for her, or were you sad for you, be honest.

no you just stole my child away so she could be a part of your CULT!

Did you raise your daughter right? (I expect a yes here)

Is your Daughter smart? (Again I expect a yes here)

Does / Did your daughter know how you felt / feel?

What possible reason could such a beautiful young woman have for causing you such pain? If she is smart, she would not have fallen for some ginned up religions experience and hocus pocus, she would have seen through all that. If she loves you half as much as you judging by your pain love her, then why?

Because she believes it’s true, and a am sure you know what the bible says about leaving the gospel for family.

There will be many (and maybe already are since I seem always to be playing catch-up with this thread) who will echo your sentiments about cults. They are wrong. Ask your daughter if the Gospel makes her happy and if it does than want for her what makes her happy. If you cannot accept that she wants this and him you need to let her be happy anyway.

My oldest is twelve and she is beautiful. I have never yet had to face her going away, but that will happen. When it does, I hope I can concentrate on her happiness, not my sadness that she will be leaving.

My God grant you peace and let you know that his will is always done.

[HungarianGypsy]

They aren’t fun! That is unless you like punch and cookies and shaking hands.

Maybe it depends on who's reception it is. All the receptions I went to had plenty to eat. Some even had dancing.

[restornu]

Ok I am guilty but I like to know more so I could correct my ways!:)

[Truth-Miner]

I wasn’t allowed to be at my 2 eldest daughters weddings. It had nothing to do with a temple. For the first the information about the wedding was purposefully withheld by my Ex. The other, they did it without telling anyone.

Sad yes. But I chose to take no offense cause it wouldn’t fix anything. It would’ve just made me bitter which in turn would have affected all involved. I got over it in a month or so.

[Netizen]

Gen 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

Why did Noah find grace?

Gen 6:9 These [are] the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man [and] perfect in his generations, [and] Noah walked with God.

Just like:

Gen 26:4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

Why?

Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

[John Leland 1789]

It is true that all of us that believe the Bible also believe that Mormonism is an un-biblical cult as to its theology and form of leadership.

[DelphiUser]

Seems a little callous and unfeeling to me.
Me too. Other faiths do similar things, and that's too bad.
Of course, this issue has nothing to do with whether or not to vote for someone.

I am a male chauvinist pig (as I have said before, and will again), and my wife likes me that way. I like me this way. I care far more what she thinks than what all freeperdom (Is that a word?) thinks. I am not going to apologize for thinking that. (thought crimes here we come!)

I have been sat out side the temple during a wedding I wanted to attend, My Wife’s father sat out side, I know what that feels like from both sides (just not as a parent yet) so the “you are so mean” posts only remind me of my six year old, but don’t impress me with logical content.

As for the “you are unfeeling” comment You are right! I am unfeeling because I am a high functioning autistic and I will never be able to fully empathize with “Normal” people. I am not going to cry about it. I am not going to blame anyone for it. I am not going to get mad at anyone for it. I will not apologize for being who I am.

If I hurt anyone’s feelings, that I will apologize for.

I am sorry if I hurt your feelings