The Mormon Advantage

Townhall.com ^ | 4/5/2007 | Maggie Gallagher

[Utah Girl]

Mitt Romney is riding high this week after his victory in "the first primary," which consists of raising cold, hard cash to compete: more than $20 million in the first quarter, $5 million more than his closest contender, Rudy "Lay off my wife!" Giuliani. John McCain came in a lackluster third with $12.5 million.

Romney's campaign benefited from two distinct donor networks, according to media accounts: Wall Street and Mormons. GOP front-runner Rudy, struggling with one of those weird media freak shows erupting around his wife, Judith (her alleged participation in future Cabinet meetings and former puppy killings), must be a little envious on both counts.

Why is it that all the Dem candidates are still married to their first spouse, while among the current crop of leading GOP contenders, the only guy with just one wife is the Mormon?

Truth is, I don't think this is just an accident. There's something about Mormons the rest of us ought to pay attention to: Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints do much better than almost any other faith group at sustaining a marriage culture -- and they do this while participating fully and successfully in modern life. Utah is above the national average in both household income and the proportion of adults who are college graduates.

[sevenbak]

In addition to that, if those pics truly mean so much to you CC, then have some respect for your grandfather that you say is buried in them. I’m sure he’d really appreciate what you are doing here! /sarc

[ronnie raygun]

The Liberal Left is more afraid of Christians and Mormons than the head chopping unforgiving Islamic militants! How sick is that!

[sevenbak]

I’ve done both, (Scouts, not SP) and I have to agree with you!! SM is much more admin oriented.

[rbookward]

I’ve done both, (Scouts, not SP) and I have to agree with you!! SM is much more admin oriented.

At the mere hint that Stake President might be in my future (or even Bishop), I’ll be joining colorcountry! (Just kidding...sort of.)

[Rameumptom]

>>>The Christian “thing” to do is uncover blasphemies.

Speaking about that which is sacred is blasphemous.

I'll quote a "True Christian" speaking of sacred temple ordinances.

Chrysostom speaking of the practice of baptism for the dead, refused to discuss the subject openly:

But first I wish to remind you who are initiated of the response, which on that evening they who introduce you to the mysteries bid you make; and then I will also explain the saying of Paul: so this likewise will be clearer to you; we after all the other things adding this which Paul now saith. And I desire indeed expressly to utter it, but I dare not on account of the uninitiated; for these add a difficulty to our exposition, compelling us either not to speak clearly or to declare unto them the ineffable mysteries. Nevertheless, as I may be able, I will speak as through a veil. John Chrysostom, Homilies on 1 Corinthians 40:2, in NPNF Series 1, 12:244.

[Rameumptom]

Dear Moderator, colorcountry has acknowledged on her homepage that she is posting photos of innapropriate material.

I quote.

"This is clothing worn in the religion of my birth. Private message me if you have questions. For some reason the moderators here at FR have deemed it innappropriate."

I don't find them offensive when used in their proper context (Temple and the burial of my mother).

However, I think you know full well what the effect would be. You seek to intentionally offend.

I would suggest you re-read the purpose of this forum.

Please enjoy our forum, but also please remember to use common courtesy when posting and refrain from posting personal attacks, profanity, vulgarity, threats, racial or religious bigotry, or any other materials offensive or otherwise inappropriate for a conservative family audience.

[sevenbak]

It’s funny because it’s true. I’ve served in a few Bishoprics, and the running joke is that I’d break a major commandment to keep off the “hit list”

JK of course! ;-0

[sevenbak]

Rame, forgive me of my ignorance, but who was Chrysostom and when/where did he live?

[Rameumptom]

>>>I have been asking some specific questions about your religion in order to become more educated about it, and have gotten nothing except generic, dance around, dodge the bullet responses.

Basic questions about my faith can be answered here.

mormon.org Basic Beliefs

lds.org The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

I've been a cop also. I have Scottish ancestors who were in the Battle Of Bannockburn (the last Battle in Braveheart) where the Scots won their independance.

The Mormon and anti-mormon debates here can get heated. Generally, Mormons are taught to not engage in heated contentious debates about Doctrine. Its obvious that when one argues about doctrines the Spirit quickly leaves out the nearest exit. But hey, its hard to resist at times.

[Rameumptom]

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Saint John Chrysostom Bishop and Doctor of the Church Born 349, Antioch Died 14 September c. 407[1], Comana in Pontus [2]

Venerated in Roman Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church, Eastern Catholic Churches, Anglican Communion, Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod

John Chrysostom (349–407, Greek: Ιωάννης ο Χρυσόστομος, Ioannes Chrysostomos) was the archbishop of Constantinople. He is known for his eloquence in preaching and public speaking, his denunciation of abuse of authority by both ecclesiastical and political leaders, the Liturgy of St. John Chysostom, and his ascetic sensibilities. After his death he was given the Greek surname chrysostomos, "golden mouthed", rendered in English as Chrysostom.[2][1]

The quote is taken from "Joseph Smith: Restoring the Ancient Church" which I have linked previously on this thread. (From lds FAIR) I'm still reading it. It can be tough to make sense of some of the Greek philosophy which infected later Christianity but it does a good job of laying out the beliefs of early Christians.

[MHGinTN]

A sign of the times I’m afraid, the upside down times.

[tantiboh]

I'm not even going to address your most silly claims; if you don't care to go out there and find out the real stories behind these myths, then the chances are slim that you will listen to me when I try and refute them.

Since, however, research is more difficult regarding what you term "temple secrets," I will attempt to correct the record for the sake of people who aren't too bigoted to take into consideration what I am saying. Does this include you? We shall see.

The temple ordinances are not secret; they are sacred. You will doubtless think of that as a distinction without a difference, but the difference is real. We are counseled by Christ Himself not to cast our pearls before swine, and the promises I made to God in the temple are among my most precious assets. When and where the circumstances are appropriate, these ordinances may be freely discussed.

What I will tell you, however, is what they are NOT. You can take or leave my word on this; that's your decision. Nevertheless, I have participated in these ordinances dozens of times in my life, so I am qualified to tell the truth.

Therefore, let it be clearly understood: There is no part of any temple ordinance where a slashing motion is made against the throat or abdomen; nor is there any part of any temple ordinance where any symbol or motion is used that could be interpreted to have similar significance. We do not kill animals, plants, or minerals, (except, of course, for the roast beef sandwiches in the cafeteria, which aren't really that great), nor do we utilize blood in any way. The consequences of inappropriately discussing temple ordinances are spiritual; if I were to do so, they would as a natural consequence become less meaningful for me and therefore less of a power for good in my life, and therefore I am commanded not to do so unless appropriate. No consequence is stated or implied against the safety or physical well-being of any person who does.

The record is set straight. Take it or leave it, it's up to you.

And now, one final point regarding your statement: A cult mind means that a person is so unquestioning to a religious organization that they will do anything that their leaders ask of them

By that definition, I will gladly accept your absolution of the LDS Church as being guilty of cult status. We are not counseled to accept ANYTHING that we are taught in blind faith. There are those who are too lazy to do otherwise, but a truly faithful Mormon is one who questions EVERYTHING; he or she will probe and prod every doctrine for weaknesses and flaws, will pray for confirmation of its truth, and will test it out in his or her life. In that way, the truth of the doctrine is found through the good that it brings to one's own life. (Indeed, there are a number of points of doctrine that I continue to study, ponder, and pray about, because I remain unconvinced. But that lack of knowledge in no way disqualifies what I already know to be true.) That is not blind faith; that is the kind of faith that cannot be blinded.

Is it any wonder that we are so eager to share the kind of joy and spiritual security that only this kind of belief can bring?

[sevenbak]

Thanks. I haven’t had time to read it all yet. I’m looking forward to it, it’s quite and in-depth peice.

Thanks for pointing it out!

[sevenbak]

Great post tanti!

[AnalogReigns]

< sigh > Read my posts. I never mentioned anything about pay, except in the spiritual sense. If you believe you do this, that and the other thing, good deeds all, to merit advancement in heaven, such is a definition of religion, not Christianity.

In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, one God over all that is, in 3 Persons, Amen.

[sevenbak]

Christ alone can reconcile us to the Father, through His atonement.

But we must also obey His commandments, otherwise, why have them at all?

James 2:
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is bdead, so faith without works is dead also.

[cookcounty]

.....his closest contender, Rudy "Lay off my wife!" Giuliani. ...

Lay off your own wife, Rudy!

[cookcounty]

"could a big factor be that mormons stay married because half of every mormon marriage - the woman - is depending on her husband to choose to call her name so that she will be resurrected someday? That would tend to keep you from making him mad. Add community pressure, which is great.

While community pressure may be a significant factor, They "stay married" because that is how a mormon is defined. If you divorce, you're out. Saying Mormons have a high rate of staying married is like saying farmers have a high rate of agriculture. There are plenty of divorced ex-mormons who are not included in the statistics.

[cookcounty]

"I especially have always admired their program of sending their youngsters on a one year Mission of service upon graduating from high school. It’s a great way for their kids to mature some before entering college. I think that the rest of us should pick up on this idea. "

A lot of familes have picked up on it. Some folks say you should kick your kids out of the house at 18. We managed to kick ours out of the country. Two did missions work, one worked in a youth hostel in Israel, and one "toured" Iraq with the Army. They came back appreciative of other countries and cultures while totally in love with good old America. I highly recommend it. You can't fully appreciate the USA until you've had to go without.

[cookcounty]

"the Mountain Meadows Massacre."

Seriously? I was a college history major and from memory could write a pretty long and mostly accurate narrative of the Mormons from Palmyra to the Nauvoo burn-out to the "Reorganized" split to Brigham Young and the seagulls and beehives and unique address-coding in Salt Lake City, but I am stone-cold ignorant of such an event. I better go back to my books.