[tpaine]

"-- Indeed, it is the ability to act at will and without need for justification within some domain which is the essence of freedom, be it of speech or of property."

Normally, I agree with Vin.
But killing these working men for "the principle" of the ability to act at will and without need for justification" is beyond rationality.
A new sewer line running under his ~property~ was a justifiable cause for killing?

[sittnick]

But we are still obliged to honor their memories and the personal courage it takes to fight and die for a principle, even as we lament both their desperate, misguided actions ... and the systematic erosion of our liberties which gave them rise.

Sorry, there is nothing "courageous" about killing yourself. I don't agree with his action, but I would understand it if he threw down his weapon and surrendered after fulfilling his promise, or at least required a warrant.

[ClearCase_guy]

In my opinion, the whole reason we have the Second Amendment is that sometimes the King's Men need killing, and the people need to have the ability to do so.

[tpaine]

1 reply · 95+ views

Setting new records for reply - view ratios, bump.

[Dr. Bogus Pachysandra]

I work for a water company. We have easements. If we need to repair or upgrade a water main, and it requires working in an easement, we are entirely within our rights to do just that. All our easements are recorded in the landowner's deeds. And any repairs or upgrades are in the public's interest. This guy just lost it!

[Racehorse]

But killing these working men for "the principle" of the ability to act at will and without need for justification" is beyond rationality.

That's what happens when people are reduced to feelings of "powerlessness." You eventually get an irrational, sometimes deadly backlash.

Frankly, I'm surprised there have not been a whole lot more of these killings.

[beltfed308]

Residents say officials grew dissatisfied with their existing easement,

Then get a new one. A very sad story as it ended up with such a waste of life over what? A sewer line with questionable legal rights to tear up another persons land?

[John Jorsett]

Unless the town used condemnation to procure the easement, it was on the land when he bought it, and he shouldn't have bought it if he objected.

[cgk]

You see, to most of the people who work in government and the media these days -- especially in our urban centers -- "private property" is a concept out of some dusty, 18th century history book.

I'd remove the 'especially in our urban centers' portion of the above comment, and agree.

[jonascord]

The "working men" you value are part of the problem. They made the deliberate decision to throw in with an oppressive government, with the knowledge that ANYTHING they do to "civilians" will be forgiven, including killing them. The only thing that will get them dismissed would be to injure the government. Anything they do to outsiders results in "administrative leave, with pay", until the furor blows over.

[goldstategop]

The city can install new lines through my property after it has paid me for it. People in the Mountain West take their property rights zealously. Its not like the government had no advance warning the guy was going to protect his property. He owned it - not the state.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[vetvetdoug]

My City has annexed me and now are going to "improve" my property (about a half mile) along my frontage with a sewer line. They put in a water line and were supposed to do it with minimal damage and replace and fix my land back to the way it was.. what they did was make a damn mess, destroy my fences, and never repaired the ground that they destroyed with the use of the large equipment. They cut my phone lines, my cable lines, and existing water lines. Only after I raised so much hell did they fix the phones, cables, and water and I still had to deal with the phone company's uncaring employees and finally got my service back. I then had to spend time and money disking and harrowing and reseeding the ground they marked up. I also had to clean my paved driveway from their going across it with tracked vehicles. When they knocked down my fences they never told me they were not going to put them back up and my livestock were fence less for half a day when I discovered the uncaring attitude of the contractors. Now they want to come across my property again with a larger line? I can understand this landowner's probably more so than many others.

Cities/municipal government and workers don't give a tinkers' damn about your property, landscaping, fences and roads and be damned if you have spent many hours improving your property. I dread the return of the incompetent and uncaring government employees tracking again across my farm.

[unixfox]

Ya know what, a lot of people are getting fed up with crap like this. Lines are being drawn and I'm glad to see this guy take a stand.

[Ole Okie]

A new sewer line running under his ~property~ was a justifiable cause for killing?

Particularly when an easement existed on his property for this purpose.

I guess there are few surveyors who haven't been threatened with or faced a shotgun or rifle. It can be pretty scary, particularly when you're a green member of a surveying party chain gang. Been there. Done that.

[goldstategop]

Its like stealing. When the government doesn't bother to ask our permission as to whether they can do something on OUR land, that's trespassing pure and simple. Its no more right when your land is invaded under color of official authority than it is if unknown individuals enter your property without asking you first if its OK. Private means exactly that - PRIVATE.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[MaDeuce]

"But killing these working men for "the principle" of the ability to act at will and without need for justification" is beyond rationality."

No it isn't. They were warned before. They violated that warning ... they rolled the dice and lost. If they respected this mans private property rights they would be alive today.
The gov't could have negotiated something with the land owner, but instead just decided to do what ever they pleased ... there are consequences to every action.

[Thumper1960]

He warned them to not set foot on his property.

They did, he killed.

Fulfillment of a promise to defend his property. The choice made to not heed his warning.

Those shot knew they'd be shot. It was more like "suicide by landowner".

[Old Professer]

All this because of a shitty ditch?

[HEY4QDEMS]

Some governments fail to analyze how far they can push before someone pushes back.

[Artemis Webb]

Totally agree. I feel terrible for the workmen killed. I have no sympathy for the loser/coward who shot dead defenseless men then couldn't cope with what the justice that would come upon him. I hope the bastard burns in hell.

[An Old Man]

"-- Indeed, it is the ability to act at will and without need for justification within some domain which is the essence of freedom, be it of speech or of property."

Normally, I agree with Vin.
But killing these working men for "the principle" of the ability to act at will and without need for justification" is beyond rationality.
A new sewer line running under his ~property~ was a justifiable cause for killing?"

Retorically speaking, why is it that there is always a "but" in these things. Do we have to have some tribunal meet to declare that the government is acting in a tyranical manner? Just where is the line that must be crossed before good men are allowed to act?

I eagerly await your response.
Semper Fi
An Old Man