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U.S.: DISMAY AT ARREST OF ETHNIC SERBS
http://www.adnki.com/index_2Level_English.php?cat=Politics&loid=8.0.369696675&par=0 ^

Posted on 12/18/2006 10:58:24 AM PST by kronos77

New York, 18 Dec. (AKI) - Serbs living in the United States are reported to be deeply disturbed and worried by recent arrests of fellow Serbs in connection with the 1990s Balkan wars, community leaders have said. In a six-state swoop, American agents arrested 13 Serb immigrants last week and are looking for another three who are still at large. One of those arrested, Nedjo Ikonic, is being investigated for allegedly having taken part in the massacre of up to 8,000 Muslim men and boys in the eastern Bosnian town of Srebrenica when it was overrun by Serb forces in July 1995.

If convicted, Ikonic and other suspects face up to ten years in jail and deportation from the US. "These cases demonstrate our resolve to identify and prosecute those who enter the US under false pretences," said deputy attorney general Paul McNulty. "Especially those who hide their military past," he added.

Those arrested were poor immigrants who had no money for lawyers of bail to defend themselves from freedom, the Serbian consul in Chicago, Desko Nikitovic, told Vesti daily. He said Serbia could not help them because most were Bosnian citizens.

"Unfortunately, this is a huge operation in which only Bosnia-Herzegovina can intervene with Washington. No-one needs to spoil the relations between our two countries, which have been improving," said Nikitovic.

Milwaukee lawyer, Nikola Kostic, said he was trying to organise a team to offer legal help to the arrested and their families, because neither Serbia nor Serb organisations in America have shown much interest in helping the suspects.

"Serbs are being hunted throughout America, but no one is checking Bosnian Muslims and Croats who have immigrated to the United States in the past 10-15 years," Zika Petrovic of Denver, Colorado, told Vesti. "No one asks them whether they have concealed what they did in the wars, what army they served and whether they committed crimes against Serbs," Petrovic said. "All this is creating an unfortunate impression that the war against Bosnian Serbs has now shifted to US soil," he concluded.

Vesti, distributed throughout Serbian emigre community - which numbers a million in the US - said that there is a list of over 300 people, submitted to the United States by Bosnian authorities and the United Nations' Yugoslav war crimes tribunal, who are suspected of having committed crimes during the 1992-1995 Bosnian civil war.

Officially, the suspects are being charged for failing to report to immigration authorities that they served in the Bosnian Serb army, which fought against local Muslims. (Vpr/Aki)

Dec-18-06 15:00


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; balkanization; balkans; bosnia; clintonlegacy; ihoppy; illegalimmigrants; immigrantlist; immigration; kosovo; mark502ss; reddhimmi; serbia; sorosfluffers; srebrenica; toothlessdhimmi; us; warcrimes; warcriminals; wrongplace; wrongside; wrongtime; wrongwar
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To: FNG

Same was in Montenegro. On Cetinje, old capitol of Montenegro children were playing with cut Turkish heads. Turks Ottomans were shocked and disgussed by that fact and were pretty much intemmidated by Montenegrin (Serb) actions against them.

Also on a seal of my home city, given to us by Austrian Emperor in 19th century abowe city panorama is arm holding sabre with Turkish head in turban stuck on the tip of the sabre...


121 posted on 12/20/2006 4:09:11 AM PST by kronos77 (-www.savekosovo.org- and -www.kosovo.net- Save Kosovo from Islam!)
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To: tgambill
Roman empire did not fall due to barbarian invasion but by the impotence of its sons and their love for gold instead of love for Rome... There were so many barbarians and no Romans...

There is saying "History after Rome is history of the barbarians.."
122 posted on 12/20/2006 4:12:26 AM PST by kronos77 (-www.savekosovo.org- and -www.kosovo.net- Save Kosovo from Islam!)
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To: kronos77

you see, it's not my country nor the government. There are however, signficant players and those that hold a high position that are controlled by the international bankers, the rest are in line for many different reasons. Most of them are actually misinformed by generations of propaganda. General Butler sums it up and he is just about as credible as one can get......the culprits span two continents that are linked together through the CFR and RIIA.


123 posted on 12/20/2006 6:15:24 AM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: tgambill

I see Red6 has just received the coup de grace, Free Republic style: praise from Mark.

As damning an indictment as it's possible to imagine.

Red6 , I suggest you sue.


124 posted on 12/20/2006 7:24:01 AM PST by infidel_pride
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To: joan

And that first photo of the set is more than a little poignant. Isn't it of an ethnic ALBANIAN couple of kids, who were RETURNING to their village when it was hit by NATO planes on the Djakovica to Prizren road in April, 99 .

They were almost certainly zeroing in on co-ordinates given by KLA target spotters. It was a death sentence to return home: to work with the Serb authorities: ruins the myth of the Serbs forcing the ethnic Albs out.

So they, and many others on that convoy were slaughtered.

As I said, it's poignant, though no doubt poignancy will be lost on the Red6s of this world.

Some more snaps.

http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/wb2/01.htm


125 posted on 12/20/2006 7:58:29 AM PST by infidel_pride
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To: tgambill
YU:

• Economically depressed
• Resource poor
• Years of socialism and pseudo isolationism before the war
• No major technology or industry worthwhile

About the only thing the former YU has is rocks.

The American soldier does not have magical boots. American leather boots do not make oil bubble out of the ground.

Examples:

1. As soon as US troops landed in Afghanistan, there were rumors of an oil pipeline that was going to get built. To date - nothing. But those against the war are still pontificating five years later. Occasionally this argument still surfaces with an article about how construction will begin soon, then a year later the next article about how construction will begin soon. Eventually, if Afghanistan succeeds and economically begins to prosper, they may actually be right. "Eventually" (In 20 years) there might be a pipeline as the energy demands increase. But was the war because of this? For whom will this energy be? Who is managing it? Not the US.

The reasoning is, if the nation does not have any natural resources, then demonstrate that it is transported through there. Even a pile of rocks, like Afghanistan can then be shown to have some strategic value for the US and be used as an example of ulterior motives at work. Every country on this planet (To include Mongolia) can be shown to have some strategic value in this way. All wars can be argued to be purely for oil since in some capacity, may it be producing, refining, transport of oil or gas, is in some way significant.

2. Somalia. As soon as US troops landed in Somalia, some reported that "although not yet developed, experts believe that vast oil reserves are present in Somalia." Answer is? Never was true. Sure there is some natural gas, but not even that is significant.

3. Iraq. Of course we know what the anti war pundit today says the real reason for the war was in 2003.

4. Did you know that in American academia some self proclaimed intellectuals in the 60s argued that Vietnam was because of the tin reserves? No shit, as if there is a world shortage of tin.

5. Of course in 1991 during Desert Shield and Storm we were again told "It's all about the oil". How this is the case they never really explained as we were paying millions for the cleanup and putting out massive fires, but hell, it sounds good.

Another example of a different type:

During the invasion of Panama the argument was “The US wants to control the strategically significant Panama Canal”. On time, the Canal was handed over to Panama in accordance to the bilateral agreements and in fact is operated by a firm today that is based out of the Peoples Republic of China. In this case, like so many other concocted theories of how it's all about the oil, the floated argument was that our "oil" needs the Panama Canal because it's shipped all over.

Do people like you ever go back and admit that they were wrong? Of course not, they just move to the next war and scream the same thing “It’s all about the oil”.

--

Cliché is no argument. It’s a method of arguing that is emotionally based. It tries to change perception by appealing to some preconceived notion.

Example of a cliché argument. After the unification in 1989 CNN ran endless reports on the new unified Germany. Coincidentally they showed a picture of a tank crushing a car and reports on the rise of neo-nazis in Germany. Anyone with a clue knows if anything, the threat to Germany comes from the left with parties like the WASG/PDS (Former Communists of the DDR) which actually DO have political influence. But nonetheless the cliché argument was floated and many talked about the threat of neo-nazi’s in Germany etc.

(Back to your pipeline)
They are building a small pipeline that will regionally feed energy. The US does not own the pipeline. They are not building the pipeline. They are merely one of the investors. Read your BBC article again. In long tradition of “It’s all about the oil” you present this as some reason for a war which cost tens of billions. When the Balkans began falling apart, no one knew what the future would be, but apparently the US at the time already knew about the pipeline when they looked in their crystal ball. Do you know what asinine means? There are hundreds of pipelines. There are pipelines in Texas, Utah, Nevada, California, Alaska…… more or being built by the week. Your argument fails in so many aspect of the “common sense test” it’s hardly worth mentioning, if it were not for the fact that it keeps getting recycled in EVERY war by those who oppose US military action.

Look Look, they’re building a pipeline through Panama! The war in Panama was all about the oil! http://www.intertanko.com/templates/Page.aspx?id=32911 20 years after the war I can concoct that the intervention was actually for oil. (Do you see what nonsense this is?)

A present day parallel:

In Iraq people say it’s “all about the oil”. The typical cliché argument.

• Iraq is an OPCEC country
• We get practically no oil from Iraq (Our imported oil is from Canada, Mexico, Venezuela and Nigeria)
• US firms are not the ones that are developing Iraqi oil reserves. (It was and remains French and Russian firms)
• The revenue from Iraqi oil goes to the Iraqis who also manage their own production.

We have been spending nearly 100 BILLION since 2003, and some want to pretend this war is about the oil as if there is an economic incentive.

--

If you want to complain, do so with the Germans and British. They were the political instruments behind the Balkan intervention. If you’re going to construct an argument trying to pretend as if this war was all about an ulterior motive “oil” or “gas” at least do so with those who pushed for the intervention.

"Oil" - the argument that never gets old. At least when it conveniently fits into the picture, no matter how asinine it really is.
126 posted on 12/20/2006 8:02:17 AM PST by Red6 (Weird thoughts -)
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To: Red6

Red6, you're losing it.

You forgot to compare the Serbs with the Nazis. And where's the talk of Auschwitz , etc. gone ? Surely de rigueur for any Serbophobe on the internet.

Stay on the ball.


127 posted on 12/20/2006 8:25:28 AM PST by infidel_pride
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To: mark502inf; Red6; tgambill; joan; kronos77; Honorary Serb; SJackson
"It is both factually incorrect and an insult to the United States of America for the Serbs to try and associate what they did in the 90s--in terms of either goals or methods--with what the United States is doing in our current war on terror."

No, Mark, what is "an insult to the United States" is that an illegal alien named Florin Krasniqi-- a Kosovo Albanian-- can steal into the US from Mexico in the trunk of a car, get his citizenship and then be seen 10 years later USING US laws to smuggle weapons to KLA terrorists, and paying off high level US politicians to buy US foreign policy! (What's the Krasniqi quote from the Brooklyn Connection? "America is a great place! You give politicians money -- and they pay you back!") That is a slap in the face to America and real Americans!

And if all those here who disagree with you are "Serb Nationalists", then why would the Chief Rabbi of Kosovo, who was driven out of Kosovo by the Albanians, agree with them? He says that Albanians from Albania came in and threw him and the other non-Albanians out, driving them from their homes and the UN would not help him!

Get it straight, Red, the former Yugoslav Muslims (in Bosnia & Kosovo) are not "the Jews" in some modern day Holcaust story -- the Albanian Muslims drove out the actual Jews to make room for more Albanians!

And what is in it for the US to have ever gotten ourselves involved in this Balkan fiasco? Nothing! It has made us more enemies than friends, because besides intervention being a mistake period, we topped it off by intervening on the wrong side!

128 posted on 12/20/2006 9:15:07 AM PST by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Bokababe
So far as I can tell, this isn't an American issue, other than immigration. If the suspects are being charged for failing to report to immigration authorities that they served in the Bosnian Serb army, which fought against local Muslims. is correct, they entered the country illegally and so should be deported. Whether to Bosnia or Serbia, I don't know, but that's where their actions will become an issue.
129 posted on 12/20/2006 9:45:56 AM PST by SJackson (had to move the national debate from whether to stay the course to how do we start down the path out)
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To: mark502inf
Mark: If you want to support the point of view that Serbia was equivalent to Nazi Germany (which is what Red6 did) then knock yourself out.

Oh, by the way, can you tell me where the gas chambers and ovens are in Bosnia?...That question points to how stupid your remarks sound.
130 posted on 12/20/2006 10:53:47 AM PST by LjubivojeRadosavljevic
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To: infidel_pride

9-11 and the GWOT came at an opportune time.

Ever since then the Serb agenda has been pushing to make the conflict into the Balkans something that it never was. They want to rewrite history.

Serbia was the antagonist. They had the means and motive to wage a war. They were told to stop because they were destabilizing the entire region and creating chaos. They were warned and threatened. Eventually they were bombed into submission with an air campaign. Now you can attempt to “spin” this reality anyway you want, but those are the facts.

“You forgot to compare the Serbs with the Nazis”

While you attempt to mock this, 48 people are convicted of crimes that were the same sort of things Nazi war criminals were sentenced for. Your defense is always the same as well, deny deny deny.

Example: http://www.un.org/icty/glance/milosevic.htm

You can create all the “free Slobodan” websites you want. The legal proceedings will continue and he will go down in flames, like 48 others so far. Because the evidence is there, and unlike here, where all you do is suck up bandwidth by repetitive screaming of irrelevant or bogus arguments, the “facts” speak for themselves.

What makes the Nazi regime what it was? They acted in a "deliberate" and "premeditated" fashion. The orders to commit these atrocities came from the top (leadership directed) and it was "systemic" of the regime in power at the time.

A bad Example: The anti war pundit in Iraq tried their hardest to connect Rumsfeld and even Bush to Abu Gharib. While complete nonsense, this attempt was to construct exactly the argument I'm making which in this case has been "Proven" correct. The leadership in Serbia directed much of what happened. The actions were systemic and widespread, it was premeditated and deliberate. Yes, it is very much so a rational argument to compare Nazi Germany with the actions of Serbia in the Balkans in the late 90s. It’s the same type of scenario where a state engages in activity that is in flagrant violation of international law.

The comparison to Nazi’s truly is over used in the media and common language. Everyone wants to compare those they don’t like to a Nazi. However, in case of Serbia in the late 90s, you have a state that fulfills all the tenants of what in essence made the Nazi regime what it was. The atrocities committed were not the actions of an individual taking it upon himself to do wrong. It was a deliberate state sanctioned premeditated and systematic behavior which Serbia engaged in reference the crimes committed, and this is very much like what the Nazi’s did, like it or not.

On a personal level, I have no love for the Muslim religion. I saw and lived with Arabs on numerous times and have no affinity for their culture. I agree that Islam is the root out of which most the worlds terrorism is borne. I think many who practice this religion sympathize with the Jihadist, even if they don’t personally blow something up. I don’t find very much admirable about this part of the world. It’s a hot ugly, backward place with nasty women. Fluent in several languages myself, I find even the sound of Farsi/Arabic to be repugnant. French is eloquent, Farsi is guttural and from the throat. But what happened in the Balkans late 90s was simply wrong. The ones who are practicing revisionism are the ones who today, in a world of heightened Islamic threat want to just exploit this “argument” as another bullet on their laundry list of fake reasons for why the leadership in Serbia acted the way it did. Truth is, this war in the late 90s was a classical case of where a state wanted to expand its influence and power, increase its area and seize the land/property of others. In complete disregard of human life and suffering, this state went on a quest to seize as much territory as possible just like Germany did in its expansion. The Serbs had the tanks, the fighters, surface to air missiles, officers, and artillery. The Serbs were calling the shots. Just like WWII was “Germany’s” war, the Balkan crisis was a product of “Serbia”. Just like many innocent Germans died in the crushing of this regime, in Serbia many innocent people died when an end was put on the state sponsored actions of that regime. Had NATO not bombed, Serbia no doubt would have just continued their conquest, and this had nothing to do with the protection of Serbs. Just like Germany actually claimed that Poland had attacked them, the Serbs today want to pretend that they were the victims. Today with the advent of the GWOT the new “spin” is that Serbia was fighting Islamic terrorists, gee, what hero’s. It’s nice when the terrorists all congregate together and you can burry them in a mass grave isn’t it? Your pick: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=mass+grave+bosnia&btnG=Search


131 posted on 12/20/2006 12:23:43 PM PST by Red6 (Weird thoughts -)
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To: kronos77

I sure hope the good people of my country (America) realize what we are dealing with like you have. Some people here were horrified by Mel Gibson's movie "The Patriot" when he had to have his children help shoot the attacking Redcoats.


132 posted on 12/20/2006 12:50:06 PM PST by FNG
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To: FNG
Zehra T, her face and hands deformed by fire, recalled her escape from a house at Bikavac, into which some 70 people had been locked and burned to death, corralled there, she said, by Lukic and others. Esma K recalled being taken to another house, and imprisoned. "The Passat arrived at 5pm," she said, and within four hours "the sky was light because the house was in flames". She had escaped through a window.

Who're the Redcoats, again?

133 posted on 12/20/2006 1:35:17 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: mark502inf
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

And a Happy Festivus to you too!

= )

Frank Costanza: Many Christmases ago, I went to buy a doll for my son. I reached for the last one they had, but so did another man. As I rained blows upon him, I realized there had to be another way.
Cosmo Kramer: What happened to the doll?
Frank Costanza: It was destroyed. But out of that a new holiday was born … a Festivus for the rest of us!
Cosmo Kramer: That must've been some kind of doll.
Frank Costanza: She was.

134 posted on 12/20/2006 2:10:55 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite
There is no full name given for the accusations. These people may be unreal, phoney. Where are the photos and full identification.

Many Serbian victims, camp survivors testify and give their full name in the court proceedings.

135 posted on 12/20/2006 2:15:30 PM PST by joan
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To: FNG
Well, I just arrived but a few hours ago in the country of Vlad Tepes and this will make it the perfect opportunity for me to pray at his grave (the one where the historians think he was buried anyway) for his service to his fellow countrymen, his neighbors and his fellow Christians. His impaling was a warning to the enemies of the Christians and also his punishment for the thieves, murderers, the greedy or anyone committing crimes. His judgment was so fierce, gold cups were used at fountains located in street squares, merchant roads, villages and so on, for any thirsty traveler to use and nobody would dare stealing them: they belonged to the people! I am tired and the jet lag is setting in so time to get some sleep. Good night and see you around the forum!
136 posted on 12/20/2006 2:45:55 PM PST by rxgalfl
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To: joan
The trial of Sreten and Milan Lukic hasn't yet started hearing evidence, as far as I know, so you're just going to have to either wait for it, or review the similar Pionirska Street burning portion of the completed Vasiljevic trial, (who's victims are listed under Annex A of the linked Lukic indictment), of which I link the judgement here.
137 posted on 12/20/2006 3:18:45 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Red6

And Agim Ceku, who killed more Serbs than anyone, you attempt to seat as the Prime Minister of the stolen state of Kosovo.

Hell of a glass house you got there, Dhimmi.


138 posted on 12/20/2006 6:35:30 PM PST by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: mark502inf

marky mark, I see you think you can change propaganda into facts if you shout it loudly enough.

You are an excellent Dhimmi.


139 posted on 12/20/2006 6:37:34 PM PST by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Red6
On a personal level, I have no love for the Muslim religion.

Your posts show that to be yet another falsehood.

140 posted on 12/20/2006 6:40:25 PM PST by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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