"No member of the military is EVER permitted to be part of a political event while in uniform. Ever."
Posted on 09/14/2006 10:29:02 AM PDT by Dubya
NORFOLK, Va. - A jury recommended Thursday that a Navy chaplain receive a letter of reprimand for disobeying an order by appearing in uniform at a political news conference at the White House.
The jury also recommended that Lt. Gordon Klingenschmitt forfeit $250 pay per month for a year but suggested that the monetary punishment be suspended.
Rear Adm. Frederic Ruhe, commander of the Navy's Mid-Atlantic Region, must decide whether to approve the recommendation.
The jury of five officers at Klingenschmitt's special court-martial determined Wednesday that he had disobeyed a superior officer's order prohibiting him from wearing his uniform during media appearances without prior permission.
Klingenschmitt said he believes he was punished for making a political speech in uniform because he prayed in Jesus' name. He had argued that he was allowed to wear his uniform if conducting a "bona fide worship service."
"I will continue to pray in Jesus' name, I will continue to worship in public and I will not be broken," he said Wednesday.
He said he would appeal the conviction and fight to remain a chaplain. He said senior naval officials had already decided to fire him before the March 30 event, which protested Navy policy requiring nondenominational prayers outside of religious services.
Last December, the chaplain went on an 18-day hunger strike in front of the White House over the right to invoke Jesus' name outside such services.
His wearing his uniform to that political event was in direct violation of an order from his superior and in that sense was a direct violation of the scriptural command to follow the orders of those who are your employers or masters:
Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; (Ephesians 6:5 KJV)
He was under both a military and scriptural duty to follow the orders of his commanding officer. He broke both the UCMJ rules and the biblical rules.
Had he gone to that event dressed as a civilian there would have been no problem. But then again he would have avoided all this publicity, which (obviously) is why he decided to violate the order in the first place. He was not drawing attention to Christ at that rally, he was drawing attention to himself.
He was to obey every law and ordinance of man as a Christian UNLESS that law is in opposition to God. In this case there is nothing wrong with a law that says military members are not to engage in political activities while in uniform. They are not to give the impression that the US military supports this political cause or that political cause. That's the reason for the rule.
He could have prayed in Jesus' name at that event in his civilian clothes all day long and all night long.
Instead, he chose to disobey a direct, legal order from an officer appointed over him.
He was not following the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
How do you know that? Was Peter and Paul following the Holy Spirit? I read they put in jail for preaching Jesus.
You are exactly right, LK.
His issue about praying in Jesus' name was correct. AR 165-1 says that Army chaplains cannot be forced to violate their faith traditions in any ceremony, program, etc. I cannot imagine that the Navy regulations would read differently.
But he got sidetracked, I think, by the glamor of the media event, and like the general in New Orleans said, "he got stuck on stupid."
The bible says to obey every law and ordinance of man.
Jesus said to render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and unto God the things that are Gods. Preaching about Jesus was clearly a thing of God. They were right to disobey and go to jail.
Insisting on going to a media event in uniform violates known military policy that has nothing to do with God. To insist on violating a legal order from a superior officer in this instance is not because of the prompting of the Holy Spirit.
Thats is one of my questions. If you answered it I didn't see the answer.
"No member of the military is EVER permitted to be part of a political event while in uniform. Ever."
Yup...and our comrades in ministry may end up feeling the effect of his bad choices
Precisely.
Kerry violated a long standing policy.
When a person puts on his nation's military uniform he doesn't automatically become a god-hating atheist as you suggest.
First, you refuse to answer my questions. Then, you post this doggerel, although it bears no resemblance to what I posted.
Very revealing.
Once again, please answer the questions:
Go ahead - the questions are really quite simple.
You are a real bunch of political wizards! This incident : a christian chaplain professing his love and belief in jesus while wearing a military uniform, is manna from heaven to the atheist liberals. GWB started the faith based program, yes? This solidified his christian base and got him elected twice. Now, if he lets this guy twist in the wind, there goes 2% or more of that base : SF flake pelosi and fruitcake reid are IN like flynn, making the next 2 years HELL for our president and country, and laying the groundwork for hilary in 08'. Yup, real wizards, order your conical hats now, ready to wear on election eve....as that critical slice of the christian base deserts our president and republican party...
Where did that come from? He was convicted for disobeying a direct order from a commanding officer...and for violating a long standing regulation prohibiting wearing a uniform at a political function. It was NOT about the content of his prayer...it was about violating standing Navy regulations.
Like I said, Navy Regulations mean NOTHING vs political perceptions. This incident is manna from heaven to the liberals, they'll blare it constantly in ads : Bush won't stand by fellow christian being persecuted. That's all they'll ever hear about it, enough to split off that 2% of the christian base. What planet are you from? The electorate is so closely divided that a hand-full of votes can decide almost any political race. Remember : AlGore won the popular vote in 2000, GWB won in FL(and the electoral vote)by 1 vote in 500. Penny-wise/pound-foolish, what planet are you from? And don't bother pounding on the Navy Regulations as if it was the BIBLE, it doesn't work with me anymore than with that 2% that will stay home on election day; you'll see which BOOK rules...
Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; (Ephesians 6:5 KJV)
Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,
(Titus 3:1 KJV)
Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God: And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;
(Colossians 3:22-23 KJV)
Servants, be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward.
(1 Peter 2:18 KJV)
Exhort servants to be obedient unto their own masters, and to please them well in all things; not answering again; Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things.
(Titus 2:9-10 KJV)
I'm not going to say that means you can't understand what's going on here, but it's pretty obvious you don't understand. This guy has blatantly disobeyed regs.
That's certainly clear, isn't it?
Timer, you have consistently refused to answer my very reasonable questions about this case. Instead, you post non sequiturs and rants that have nothing whatsoever to do with the facts.
The man knowingly violated Navy regs. That's the only issue here.
I'm smelling a DU troll, here to create some bizarre stereotype of FReepers as hypocritical religious nuts.
I did. You just didn't like the answer.
One more time - if you believe the military is correct in silencing the preacher because he is recognizing his faith (not just some general faith) and might offend a sailor who is Muslim, then should the atheist have the right to have the preacher silenced?
Do you, as a Christian, have the right to force atheists to listen to your prayers and preaching? Does a Muslim have the right to force you to listen to his prayers and preaching?
In other words, you're saying that the "christian base" (which you loudly claim to be part of) is perfectly willing to elect Democrats because someone violates longstanding law and then screams that he's being persecuted.
In that case, you idiots deserve to get President Hillary.
Yeah, he's definitely working from a script.
Civics 101 - we are a nation of laws. And the military, which I served in for 29 years, is governed by regulations. Decisions are not based on political expediency. Military officers, sitting on courts martial, do not consult with the President's political advisors before deciding a case. When someone in the military is given a lawful order, and not appearing at a political event is a LONG standing regulation, willfully violating that lawful order must be dealt with, regardless of who you are. Politics has nothing to do with it.
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