Posted on 09/09/2006 8:39:07 PM PDT by curiosity
In the final analysis (God) used evolution to set us free.
Brown University biologist Kenneth Miller used this quote from his book Finding Darwins God as a central point in his speech about simultaneously believing in evolution and religion.
Miller spoke to more than 500 people Thursday evening in the Kansas Union Ballroom.
He testified for the pro-evolution side in the recent lawsuit against the Dover, Pa., school district, where a federal judge ruled against the districts teaching of intelligent design in biology classrooms. He said it was creationism in disguise.
Conservatives on the Kansas State Board of Education approved science standards last year that criticized evolution, but after the August primary election, it appears moderates will regain control of the board and eventually reinstate the former standards.
Miller gained several laughs from the audience during his speech as he described the Dover trial, including a scene when intelligent design proponent Michael Behe asked the judge if he could move the evidence to the side.
Plaintiffs attorney Eric Rothschild had stacked 58 scientific papers, nine books and other textbook chapters on evolutionary evidence supporting development of the human immune system in front of Behe on the witness stand.
Miller said religion and evolution are too often played as opposing forces and incorrectly identified as mutually exclusive. At Brown, a student once told him he could not worship at the university chapel and cited a book that places evolution as the fruit in the serpents mouth or a tool of Satan.
But Miller said the root of the portrayal of religion and evolution as opposites may come from scientists who have an anti-theistic interpretation of evolution, a stance he disagrees with.
People of faith are shooting at the wrong target. They should not be shooting at evolution itself, he said.
Miller, a Catholic, said evolution has been remarkably robust in answering criticism through fossil records, the fusing of human chromosomes and other examples.
Instead of attacking evolutionary theory, the argument should be against the anti-theistic interpretation of evolution, he said.
He quoted several scientists, philosophers and religious leaders, including Pope Benedict XVI, who has written: Even the outcome of a truly contingent natural process can nonetheless fall within Gods providential plan for creation.
By understanding the mechanics of this world, what one is really doing is praising and glorifying God, Miller said.
Miller will answer questions from the public at 10 a.m. today at the Hall Center for the Humanities.
The lecture was the first in the Difficult Dialogues series on Knowledge: Faith & Reason, presented by the Hall Center and the Biodiversity Institute.
Federal Judge John E. Jones III, who ruled in favor of the Dover plaintiffs, will speak Sept. 26.
5. Image: A personification of something specified: That child is the image of good health.
Get it? I hope so.
Yes, you ARE incorrect. God works in wonderful and mysterious ways.
Shying away from the word makes one shy against defending the Truth.
God passed in front of Moses in Exodus 33. That doesn't sound so allegorical. Why should people be so bent out of shape about the thought that God would have a form that is similar to ours, or more correctly, that we should have a form that is similar to God's? Why should we presume that God has a different form of body or no body at all, if when He says in Scripture that He does?
He refers to Himself having different body parts in Scripture but doesn't give us a complete rundown of each and every one. I personally don't care about it in all it's fine detail and I don't see why it should matter.
Clearly when Jesus was talking to the Pharisees and referred to Himself as the *bread of life*, He meant that allegorically, as He was physically standing in their very presence but just because some parts are allegorical, doesn't mean that all are to be taken that way all the time.
Brown University biologist Kenneth Miller used this quote from his book Finding Darwins God as a central point in his speech about simultaneously believing in evolution and religion.
In the final analysis,
b'shem Yah'shua
you either believe in the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Israel
or you believe the lies of the Evil One.
Glad I didn't say that.
Presuming to know the mind and methods of God is a symptom of at least one of the Seven Deadly Sins.
Spread all over the internet for everyone (including God) to see.
I thought the same thing the first time I saw the millipede symbol on the back of an auto, which I believe began as a response to the fish symbol many Christians place on their vehicle. Though I wasn't as much disgusted as I was puzzled at the insecurity of person who would go to that length to argue against the peaceful symbol of the fish. I don't think the fish represents any thing other than Jesus, though I could be wrong on that.
Your whole tone is one of humility, and I believe you when you say you're searching, and I get a distinct sense that you're searching for God because God, in whatever personal and distinct manner, has made himself known to you.
I hope you are not offended by my post to you. I'm am by no means a person who is trying to push you into believing anything. I'm just a person, like C.S.Lewis, who has, for whatever reason(s) a special kind of affection for agnostics.
We all have to remember that the Bible was written before man knew about DNA and other scientific tests.
If God rewrote the Bible in 2006 scientific terms, it would probably sound differently than what we have in Genisis.
That does not mean that Genesis is wrong. It just means that it was written very simply so that the people of that time could understand it.
> Why ask me? Ask Him yourself.
Because you seem so sure that God has body parts, I'm asking you. So, if we mirror God's *physical* body, since you seem to know so definitively... does God have nose hair? How about intestines? How about toenails? Stomach acid? Cartilage? Nipples? If not these, why? God has every part we have, except for the embarrassing ones?
> He refers to Himself having different body parts in Scripture but doesn't give us a complete rundown of each and every one. I personally don't care about it in all it's fine detail and I don't see why it should matter.
It matters because it illustrates the absurd nature of God having a physical body. For one thing, God is infinite. How could He possibly have a contained, finite body? Why would he need a digestive system if he was the alpha/omega and immortal? Why would He need to be born of a woman to have a physical manifestation here on Earth?
> Clearly when Jesus was talking to the Pharisees and referred to Himself as the *bread of life*, He meant that allegorically, as He was physically standing in their very presence but just because some parts are allegorical, doesn't mean that all are to be taken that way all the time.
What (scriptural or otherwise) evidence do you have that He is not speaking allegorically when He is talking about His mouth, face, etc.? Keep in mind He is trying to explain Himself to puny, finite beings for whom it is nearly impossible to understand what omnipresent, omnipotent, and infinite really means.
I'm not scared of debate.
You must be thinking of someone else.
And, I don't believe the Bible is God's word.
That means that not all theists are Christians. The terms aren't interchangeable.
Your Bible has no allegory, or is it your mind cannot grasp it?
God with a physical body. Like the Hindus believe, or like the old pagans...
And you are in the same religion as the people who do not believe God has a body?
There are no words...
I'm getting nauseous...
I was really hoping I was wrong about this...
Now I have to talk to my pastor friend...
Now it all makes sense to me.
The one you committed and professed is known as "Pride", since presumption is an element.
God gave you a brain. Use it.
Properly defined it is merely a hypothesis.
You caught me in a generous mood.
Incorrect. See post #23.
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