Posted on 07/30/2006 12:56:25 AM PDT by vimto
JULIA and Richard do not look like fugitives but they could be jailed under new Indian laws to stop missionaries converting low-caste Hindus to Christianity without a magistrate’s approval. A well educated British couple with young children, they left London two years ago to teach missionary work in some of India’s poorest states, such as Madhya Pradesh, Rajasthan and Orissa.
Last week Madhya Pradesh became the latest state to pass an anti-religious conversion bill that could leave Christian missionaries open to criminal charges. Leaders of India’s 26m Christians say the bill is an attempt to intimidate and persecute them, while increasing votes for the Hindu nationalist BJP party. Under its provisions missionaries and their converts face up to three years in jail if they do not notify a magistrate of their intentions.
Christian leaders also fear the initiative will encourage attacks against them. India’s National Commission for Minorities has voiced concern about incidents in Madhya Pradesh and Rajasthan in which orphanages and schools have been targeted.
Last month police in Madhya Pradesh raided a Bible study group and arrested worshippers after complaints that they were converting Hindus. Nuns have been raped and several priests have been murdered in the past seven years. Last year 11 members of a Hindu mob that burnt an Australian missionary and his two young sons to death as they slept had their convictions overturned.
Hindu fundamentalists claim missionaries, mostly American and South Korean, prey on the ignorance of lower castes and persuade them to turn against their culture. The missionaries say they provide education and healthcare and teach the Bible to untouchables whose own religion treats them as outcasts.
(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...
I am not against Christianity, I am against Evangelical fascism (very much wahabbism) which isn't Christianity.
Actually 'evangelism' (minus the fascist part) - spreading the 'Word' - is an important part of Christianity (just behind love for others):
Matthew 28:18-20
And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
We do this because we love the lost -- who we once were -- but its understood that we are just to bring the 'Word', not bludgeon people with it:
Luke 9:2-6
And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.
And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece.
And whatsoever house ye enter into, there abide, and thence depart.
And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them.
And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.
Now I'm not going to deny that history is laced with examples of 'convert or die' "programs", but these actions were/are clearly unBiblical (i.e., 'sin'). Unlike another "religion", there is no basis in Christianity where forced conversion is allowed - or even deemed possible. We get the privilege to bring the Word, but only God can save:
Ezekiel 36:24-28
For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
Only God can change our hearts of stone, and put HIS Spirit within us to make us clean. And the only way this can come is through belief in Jesus Christ as God's only Begotten Son and Saviour of us sinners. Only through Him can we be Just before God.
"Hindus should respect ours and allow for evangelization......"
"Hindus are allowed to do the same......"
No deal.
Because they are done through force or fraud.
Ping.
I don't see why it has to be a hierarchy, with one or all at the top. My belief is that religious differences come up according to the the climate, geography, culture, and historical time, but that the essential message, God, is the same. The expressions of a warlord, a carpenter, a wealthy prince, and a cowherd, from different parts of the world and different historical times, will be different, but they all spoke of one omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient supreme Being. Certainly value judgements can be made about the the differences, but I think that is missing the main point.
The passage in the Gita you referenced, where Lord Krishna tells Arjuna to stand up and fight, was not, I think, primarily about caste or war. Prior to saying this Krishna said "established in yoga perform action". He was admonishing Arjuna to honor his military duties, to perform his actions in life, according to the will of God, in union with God. I think the message is wholly consonant with the teachings of Christ.
There is a big disparity between the tenets of Christianity and that which the belivers actually practice.
And in anycase we got the Word form God millenia before the birth of Christ from a different Messiah. We dont need the words of a mortal Missionary who got it all wrong.
Considering I don't support their mission or their methods, I am no way am defending them. I am objecting to your mischaracterization of who they are. They are not foreign missionaries anyway you cut it. They are locals.
I think India is done with providing the evidence and waiting patiently for America to act. Its time for India to enact the laws and crack down on the missionaries and be done with the nuisance.
Again, this law does nothing to stop the atrocities you are talking about. This law only prohibits freedom of religion and religious expression. If there are groups funneling money to these terrorists, they should be identified and shut off. This has nothing to do with conversion.
It doesn't change my point. And don't wag your finger at me -- I was using poetic license.
I think Paul and Peter made to Rome 1st. So I think it is part of Europe, thus Europe 1st. :)
Witholding/taking away humanitarian aid is not criminal? It would be criminal in the eyes of most religions, not to mention the laws of most countries, and international laws.
I have read some of those and others. Their is still much debate about St. Thomas the apostle being India. Most of it in the translation of many writings and stories handed down. I hope this is true and he follwowed his Masters calling.
So a lot of it is word of mouth, which I hope is true, as people need to be saved, which you seem to reject.
Be it Hindu, Budda, Islam, or whatever, there is always someone who wants you to be converted. It is not just in religion but in politics, work, and life. So tell me, when you are at work, do you not conform to the rules and regulations? If you do, then you have been converted to their style of work.
Are you a republican, democrat, libertarian or whatever political party you chose, guess what, you have been converted to their political views.
Conversion is change and any time you change you convert.
Yes, I want people to convert. I want to see them come to know the Lord. Some will, many won't, but I will keep on trying just like Thomas and what you are saying now is trying to convert me to a life style of not converting people. Kind of ironic, don't you think?
Occasionally it happens.
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