Posted on 07/06/2006 11:35:38 AM PDT by GeorgiaDawg
Hi all....
FReepers have been very helpful in the past and I wanted to touch base to see if you could help again.
Our city council is debating putting Sunday alcohol sales on the ballot, yet again. The matter has been defeated twice in the past few years, but they are considering the referendum again.
While I am a believer of seperation of church and state, I also believe in keeping the Sabbath holy....can this be reconciled? I'd appreciate any thoughts or comments on any experience any of you have had with this issue...
Georgia Dawg
I still don't get it. People weren't leaving church that Sunday; the bombing started before 8 am that day, and most people weren't even out of bed yet.
Better yet, explain why these things exist.
The guy at the club used to say, "You know it's Sunday, so I have to charge you $.50 per quart." We'd all laugh and pay up, cause we were all 17/18/19 yo.
I'm talking 1961/'62/'63, when the Blue Laws were taken seriously.
Nanny state laws, forced morality, legislate morality and mandatory voluntary community services. All bogus. Do unto others as you would have others do unto you. Wrong. Leave other people to rise to their own greatness. Nobody's perfect and failures occur along the way. Social engineering is promoted by losers. That's to be expected because voting for the lesser of evils still begets evil. Your individual rights end where another person's begin.
I travel a lot on business. :)
I don't know, I've never been the recipient of any government benefits.
I sometimes barbecue on Sunday and have folks over.
Shopping for supplies, some of which I prefer fresh, needs to be done prior to people showing up.
You with me so far? Good.
I go to the store to get these supplies.. this is "grocery shopping".
The supplies include beer but I can't purchase it until some arbitrary time of day.
This is irksome. How is it disrespectful to the sabbath to purchase beer
at 11:30 but not at 12:01?
A "sketch" of the Blue Laws of Connecticut, according to the Rev. Samuel Peters, who often is criticized as puritanical extremist, are listed below. The author admits, though, that these "laws" were not actually put into draft, but their existence can be inferred through similar laws and statutes that New Haven and Connecticut amalgamated into their own codes or simply borrowed from codes that had already been adopted by adjacent colonies, such as the anti-papal or anti-Quaker codes of Virginia and New York.
The Governor and Magistrates convened in general Assembly, are the supreme power under God of this independent Dominion.
From the determination of the Assembly no appeal shall be made.
The Governor is amenable to the voice of the people.
The Governor shall have only a single vote in determining any question; except a casting vote, when the Assembly may be equally divided.
The Assembly of the People shall not be dismissed by the Governor, but shall dismiss itself.
Conspiracy against this Dominion shall be punished with death.
Whoever says there is power and jurisdiction above and over this Dominion, shall suffer death and loss of property.
Whoever attempts to change or overturn this Dominion, shall suffer death.
The judges shall determine controversies without a jury.
No one shall be a freeman, or give a vote, unless he be converted, and a member in full communion of one of the Churches allowed in this Dominion.
No man shall hold any office, who is not sound in the faith, and faithful to this Dominion; and whoever gives a vote to such a person, shall pay a fine of £1; for a second offence, he shall be disfranchised.
Each freeman shall swear by the blessed God to bear true allegiance to this Dominion, and that Jesus Christ is the only King.
No quaker or dissenter from the established worship of this Dominion shall be allowed to give a vote for the election of Magistrates, or any officer.
No food or lodging shall be afforded to a Quaker, Adamite, or other Heretic.
If any person turns Quaker, he shall be banished, and not suffered to return but upon pain of death.
No Priest shall abide in this Dominion: he shall be banished, and suffer death on his return. Priests may be seized by any one without a warrant.
No one to cross a river, but with an authorized ferryman.
No one shall run on the Sabbath day, or walk in his garden or elsewhere, except reverently to and from meeting.
No one shall travel, cook victuals, make beds, sweep house, cut hair, or shave, on the Sabbath day.
No woman shall kiss her child on the Sabbath or fasting day.
The Sabbath shall begin at sunset on Saturday.
To pick an ear of corn growing in a neighbor's garden, shall be deemed theft.
A person accused of trespass in the night shall be judged guilty, unless he clear himself by his oath.
When it appears that an accused has confederates, and he refuses to discover them, he may be racked.
No one shall buy or sell lands without permission of the selectmen.
A drunkard shall have a master appointed by the selectmen, who are to debar him from the liberty of buying and selling.
Whoever publishes a lie to the prejudice of his neighbor, shall sit in the stocks, or be whipped fifteen stripes.
No minister shall keep a school.
Every rateable person, who refuses to pay his proportion to the support of the Minister of the town or parish, shall be fined by the Court £2, and £4 every quarter, until he or she pay the rate to the Minister.
Men-stealers shall suffer death.
Whoever wears clothes trimmed with gold, silver, or bone lace, above two shillings by the yard, shall be presented by the grand jurors, and the selectmen shall tax the offender at £300 estate.
A debtor in prison, swearing he has no estate, shall be let out and sold, to make satisfaction.
Whoever sets a fire in the woods, and it burns a house, shall suffer death; and persons suspected of this crime shall be imprisoned, without benefit of bail.
Whoever brings cards or dice into this dominion shall pay a fine of £5.
No one shall read Common-Prayer, keep Christmas or saints-days, make minced pies, dance, play cards, or play on any instrument of music, except the drum, trumpet, and the Jews-harp.
No gospel Minister shall join people in marriage; the magistrates only shall join in marriage, as they may do it with less scandal to Christ's Church.
When parents refuse their children convenient marriages, the Magistrates shall determine the point.
The selectmen, on finding children ignorant, may take them away from their parents, and put them into better hands, at the expense of their parents.
Fornication shall be punished by compelling the marriage, or as the Court may think proper.
Adultery shall be punished by death.
A man that strikes his wife shall pay a fine of £10; a woman that strikes her husband shall be punished as the Court directs.
A wife shall be deemed good evidence against her husband.
No man shall a maid in person, or by letter, without first obtaining consent of her parents: £5 penalty for the first offence; £10 for the second; and, for the third, imprisonment during the pleasure of the Court.
Married persons must live together, or be imprisoned.
Every male shall have his hair cut round according to a cap.
I think blue laws are unnessesary imposition of government on the populous. If your faith calls for you to not buy alcohol on Sunday then dont go buy it. I dont think the government has to tell you that. You should be doing it.
If you cant help yourself then you have bigger problems.
In New Mexico there used to be a no alcohol on Sunday law. None. All day. The result was that people were making drinks out of hairspray, aftershave, and anything else that had some alcohol in it on Sunday. Pretty dangerous stuff there.
The changed it to after 12:00 PM on Sunday as a result of this.
That's a giant load of crap and you know it. The purpose of Blue Laws was to force unwilling members of society to comply with the Sabbath. They originally covered a whole lot more than booze.
I guess all those folks who couldn't restrain themselves from seeing movies and buying clothes without Blue Laws are in a mess of trouble now too.
See post 218 above.
Laws which violate rights are unacceptable in a free society. The laws are designed to compel some people to conform to the desires of some other people, at gunpoint if necessary. Such is the nature of so called "blue laws".
I didn't stir the pot and back off....I'm just trying to work my way through this. I oppose Sunday sales, but not government mandated. I will just choose not to buy if the Sunday sales law is voted in. Like I said, the Chick Fil A model works the best...Not open on Sunday, but not government mandated.
Our city is promoting Sunday sales as an "economic boost" because we supposedly lose revenue to neighboring counties. That is a silly argument. We are about 30,000 population wise and the "neighboring county" they refer to is about 250,000 with more tourist attractions.
And what that list is supposed to prove, I really don't know. I don't think the Japanese ever bombed Connecticut. Blue laws have obviously been very individual wherever they have existed, and their time is over.
Then perhaps my understanding of the day's events is not accurate. That said, I don't honestly know a fig about wartime etiquette!
But on what basis are you saying that doing ___ is a right? Is it tradition or philosophy?
Yes, and that's what the list proves. As you say, many are already done away with. I posted it for interest only. I wasn't ever defending Blue Laws, merely stating that they don't bother me. Sheesh!
Thanks..but I don't deserve the credit for stirring the pot....I really am trying to work through this as a Christian and as a conservative.
What a bizarre statement. Drink or not, as you like, but selling alcohol is not a VICE.
You are correct, sales is not a vice, but consumption is. And unless you're making it yourself then it falls under sales, and my statement is consistent.
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