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Darwin: Headed for the Ash-Heap
And Rightlyso...Conservative Book Club ^ | 1-20-2006 | Jeffrey Rubin

Posted on 03/14/2006 1:37:33 PM PST by joyspring777

Of the three intellectual pillars of modern liberalism -- Marx, Darwin, and Freud -- only one is still standing. Marx fell in 1989, along with the Berlin Wall. Freud's demise is more difficult to date; suffice it to say that, by the end of the century, no one, with the possible exception of Woody Allen, took him seriously any more. Darwin, I predict, will suffer a similar fate within the next ten to fifteen years.

That may seem counterintuitive in light of recent legal and public-relations setbacks suffered by critics of Darwinism -- notably a federal judge's decision forbidding the teaching of "Intelligent Design" (a term for one aspect of the anti-Darwin critique) in Dover, Pa., public schools. But it is a sign of weakness, not strength, when one side in an ostensibly scientific debate resorts to silencing the other. If the case for Darwin is such a slam-dunk, why not welcome the chance for its opponents to make fools of themselves?

No, Darwinists are running scared. Even their attempts to declare victory on scientific grounds betray more than a whiff of desperation. Case in point: the year-end edition of the journal Science hailing "evolution in action" as its "Breakthrough of the Year." Among the "dramatic discoveries" said by the magazine to make 2005 "a banner year for uncovering the intricacies of how evolution actually proceeds," none in itself demonstrates whether evolution proceeds, and they only shed light on how if you first assume that it does.

Here, for instance, is Science editor Donald Kennedy describing "one of my favorites" in this evidentiary explosion: "the European blackcap, a species of warbler that spends the winter in two separate places but then reunites to breed, with birds selecting mates from those who shared the same wintering ground. Assortative mating of this kind can produce a gradual differentiation of the two populations. Biologists have shown that new species can arise because of geographic barriers that separate subpopulations, but the divergent evolution shown in this case could result in new species arising within a single range."

If it seems that the bare facts adduced here don't quite amount to a clear instance of "evolution in action," that's because they don't. At best, they demonstrate what's known as "microevolution" -- modification within a species -- which no anti-Darwinist disputes. What is disputed is "macroevolution," the change of one species into another, which is the central claim of Darwinism. If macroevolution occurs, the "assortative mating" of the European blackcap might help to explain how it works, but it does nothing to prove that it does occur.

The fact is,nothing proves that macroevolution occurs, or ever has occurred. And, at a certain point, the absence of proof, especially where it ought to be abundant, constitutes, if not positive disproof, at least strong reasons for doubt. According to Darwin's theory of descent through gradual modification (by way of random mutation and natural selection), the fossil record should contain near-infinite numbers of ever-so-slightly-different "transitional" forms, and even greater numbers of evolutionary dead ends. Despite the best efforts of archaeologists, not even a hint of that has materialized in the fossil record. Instead, what we should not expect to find, according to Darwin's theory, is what we do find: the sudden appearance of innumerable distinct species, as we have in the so-called Cambrian Explosion.

Needless to say, a debate like this can't be settled in the space of a column. Neither, however, can it be settled by shutting out the other side. Darwinists, of course, would have us believe that there is no other side, only a bunch of anti-science religious fanatics who don't deserve to be heard. That approach can succeed, but not for long. As I say, I give them fifteen years, tops.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: anotheratheist; christianscience; christiantaliban; creatards; creation; crevolist; darwinism; dreamonmacduff; evolution; headinsand; idiocy; idispseudoscience; ignoranceisbliss; ignoranceisstrength; intellectualdesign; morons; ohplease; pridefullyignorant; pseudoscience; religionisnotscience
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To: ScubieNuc

May I ask what your point is with regard to a topic in science?


521 posted on 03/15/2006 7:30:40 PM PST by js1138
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To: ScubieNuc
Your point is clear.

The authority of the Bible was (and is) attacked by a few who think it has been proven unreliable by current scientific thought. Your logic is good and you are rightly showing the inconsistency of the accuser(s).

522 posted on 03/15/2006 7:56:56 PM PST by OriginalIntent (Such dogma from those who claim to oppose dogma.)
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To: joyspring777

Of course not, but you assume that every theistic evolutionist is worshipping the same God as you and is therefore reading the Bible wrong. Depending on who you're talking to, your particular theist might worship Yahweh, Allah, or the "inactive" God of Deism.

Keep in mind that I am an atheist, and so when I say "a different God," I do not mean that there are actual seperate entities receiving worship. I am referring to the fact that differences in beliefs among theists lead to differences in the image of God they are worshipping.


523 posted on 03/15/2006 8:01:36 PM PST by hail to the chief (Use your conservatism liberally)
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To: js1138
"I assume you disagree with at least some of science, or you would not be bringing religion into this thread."

First, your assumption is wrong. If you read my whole response to narby, you would see that I did not claim to be able to prove God, or Genesis, or creation. I admit that those are items of faith. I was merely trying to point narby in the right direction to find God, since he?she brought it up in a previous thread.

Second, I love science. But let's throw a definition from Websters down, so we don't get confused.

scientific method
Function: noun
: principles and procedures for the systematic pursuit of knowledge involving the recognition and formulation of a problem, the collection of data through observation and experiment, and the formulation and testing of hypotheses

Notice the phrase "collection of data through observation and experiment." This is where alot of my disagreement with TOE lies.

I try a small example to illustrate....

Fossil found in China....Fact.
Fossil appears to be a bird with lizard scales (archeoptorix spelling?)....Fact.
Proof that Birds come from lizards...False.

Evolutionists will say that TOE is based totally on Science and no faith is needed. However, you cannot create, through experiments, a bird turning into a lizard. Therefore you must believe something that cannot be observed (faith).

Does that by default mean that the evolutionist is wrong? No, and it also doesn't mean by default that creationists are right either. It simply means that it is not proven.

As far as Christian beliefs being brought into a science forum...I don't think that you can completely separate the two. My relationship with Jesus is the core of who I am, and everything else radiates from that.

Likewise, I don't think that it is uncommon, for say an evolutionist, whose core belief is that there is no God, to have everything they believe radiate from that. Therefore, you will have religious/philosophical threads off of scientific debates.

Sincerely
524 posted on 03/15/2006 8:01:55 PM PST by ScubieNuc
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To: joyspring777

Oh, you know what I mean. Secular humanists do not view man as a deity in the normal sense of the word.


525 posted on 03/15/2006 8:02:50 PM PST by hail to the chief (Use your conservatism liberally)
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To: ScubieNuc
However, you cannot create, through experiments, a bird turning into a lizard. Therefore you must believe something that cannot be observed.

You cannot find a biologist who believes a bird ever turned into a lizard. So what's your point?

In the standard understanding of evolution, nothing has ever been born that is not of the same species as its parents.

526 posted on 03/15/2006 8:08:17 PM PST by js1138
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Placemark

527 posted on 03/15/2006 8:20:46 PM PST by dread78645 (Sorry Mr. Franklin, We couldn't keep it.)
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To: js1138
"May I ask what your point is with regard to a topic in science?"

Certainly. In post #417 Junior stated...

"or you can ignore reality in favor of your own personal interpretation of Scripture. Note: ignoring reality and clinging to a fantasy is the very definition of insanity, not to mention the height of hubris."

So I asked him..." So do you think Bible believing Christians are insane?"

He refused to directly answer the question. What I find odd, is that he seems to have no problem calling people who believe in the literal translation of Genesis insane, and yet won't call people who believe Jesus raised from the dead, insane.

From a scientific approach, I would also ask this...Which is more insane?

1) The insane person? or
2) The person arguing with an insane person?

Let's carry this a little further.
What have God believing Creationists brought about? (think America, Democracy, defense against tyranny)
What have atheistic evolutionists brought about? (think communism, gulags, Nazis)
Who is safer....a atheist in an creationists society? or
A Christian in a evolutionist society?

I think that Junior showed that it isn't the evolutionists that are threatened, it is the creationists.

After all, wouldn't you feel safer if "insane" people would locked away? I would. However, I would never call someone insane for believeing in the TOE.

Sincerely
528 posted on 03/15/2006 8:23:50 PM PST by ScubieNuc
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To: js1138
"You cannot find a biologist who believes a bird ever turned into a lizard. So what's your point?"

Ok. Lizard turning into a bird. You know what the point is....If it can't be experimented on, if it can't be observed, and data collected on it, then it is an guess. A scientific guess, but a guess none the less.

A fact is something that has actually existance, something that can be observed. The archeoptorix may have been a unique species, it may have be a one of a kind hybrid, it may actually be a lizard and a bird fossilized at the same place.

However, until you can reproduce lizards turning into birds or any other creature, you don't have facts to support the TOE.

Sincerely
529 posted on 03/15/2006 8:36:39 PM PST by ScubieNuc
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To: William Terrell
"Punctuated evolution". LOL. A newly minted defensive action when the evolutioners were pinned down by the fact that all their few fossil examples were just as easily explained as birth defects.

Or an example of the adaptability of science versus the inflexibility of religion and/or ignorance.

And it's not that newly minted. It's quite a bit older, for instance, than "intelligent design" - which is neither.

So, considering birth defects account for maybe one in a thousand births and a much smaller number survive until adulthood (I'm making the numbers up, but I'm sure they are within reason even if not totally accurate) how do you explain every fossil ("all of their few") as a birth defect?

Is that all that is preserved?

And you're laughing at me?
530 posted on 03/15/2006 9:02:53 PM PST by Filo (Darwin was right!)
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To: VadeRetro

I tagged my last note of the day.

You are so funny I can't stand it.


531 posted on 03/15/2006 9:39:56 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: Junior

There is no evidence of many things that occurred over 1,000 years ago.

Does that mean they are not reality? There is a historic method, and by this method the existence, death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ is undeniable except to the most insincere and blinded skeptic.

The Nina, the Pinta and Santa Maria don't exist anymore. Does that mean Columbus never sailed in them?

"However, there is positive evidence Genesis cannot be taken literally."

Yours and those who agree with you are stating an opinion, not a fact.

There are folks who would regularly debate this with you either via archaeology or other means.


532 posted on 03/15/2006 9:44:41 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: ScubieNuc

Amen!

Which is why Christians who don't believe in a literal Genesis foolishly and ignorantly undermine all of Scripture with their synthesized belief mixture.

They just don't think or logic it through.


533 posted on 03/15/2006 9:47:10 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: Junior

Junior

Come on...the lives of the Apostles, almost all of which died ignominious deaths give a type of proof to the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

People will not die horribly for a lie. At the stake, on the way to the cross, on the cross, at some moment they would break down and retract.

None of the 11, from multiple historical sources, did this.


534 posted on 03/15/2006 9:50:12 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: Junior

Not so.

He is tying the two together because Jesus Christ does not give us any choice but to do so.

See my prior post regarding the Apostles lives.

There are books that deal with these too.

The Resurrection Factor, Evidence that Demands a Verdict.

We don't have electronic copies of such books to cut and paste in here. You have to research and read them yourself.


535 posted on 03/15/2006 9:53:34 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: Junior

Safe assumption.

I think you should base your entire eternal existence on that safe assumption, and others like it.

It is a gamble though.


536 posted on 03/15/2006 9:55:19 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: hail to the chief

One had said on this post,

most christians and jews believe in evolution.

Quite frankly, I don't have much respect for followers of Islam. The Koran is full of such foolishness, plain hatred and inconsistency...it has no standing as a work of God...but is just a work of a man...


537 posted on 03/15/2006 9:59:30 PM PST by joyspring777
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To: nmh

BTTT

W.


538 posted on 03/15/2006 10:03:28 PM PST by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: joyspring777
The biggest thing I think some Christians miss is the relationship between sin and death.

Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

You can't have millions of years of death and then man shows up. That's not consistant with the Apostle Paul who believed Genesis.

Sincerely
539 posted on 03/15/2006 10:08:06 PM PST by ScubieNuc
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To: firebrand

to be honest, the fossil record already has disproved evolution with the lack of transitional fossils that should be very plentiful throughout the fossil record. That just isn't so. Even Darwin himself said that his theory would not stand without the transitional fossils.


540 posted on 03/15/2006 10:44:04 PM PST by fabian
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