Utah House kills evolution bill

Fort Wayne Journal Gazette ^ | 28 February 2006 | JENNIFER DOBNER

[PatrickHenry]

House lawmakers scuttled a bill that would have required public school students to be told that evolution is not empirically proven - the latest setback for critics of evolution.

The bill's sponsor, Republican state Sen. Chris Buttars, had said it was time to rein in teachers who were teaching that man descended from apes and rattling the faith of students. The Senate earlier passed the measure 16-12.

But the bill failed in the House on a 28-46 vote Monday. The bill would have required teachers to tell students that evolution is not a fact and the state doesn't endorse the theory.

Rep. Scott Wyatt, a Republican, said he feared passing the bill would force the state to then address hundreds of other scientific theories - "from Quantum physics to Freud" - in the same manner.

"I would leave you with two questions," Wyatt said. "If we decide to weigh in on this part, are we going to begin weighing in on all the others and are we the correct body to do that?"

Buttars said he didn't believe the defeat means that most House members think Charles Darwin's theory of evolution is correct.

"I don't believe that anybody in there really wants their kids to be taught that their great-grandfather was an ape," Buttars said.

The vote represents the latest loss for critics of evolution. In December, a federal judge barred the school system in Dover, Pa., from teaching intelligent design alongside evolution in high school biology classes.

Also last year, a federal judge ordered the school system in suburban Atlanta's Cobb County to remove from biology textbooks stickers that called evolution a theory, not a fact.

Earlier this year, a rural California school district canceled an elective philosophy course on intelligent design and agreed never to promote the topic in class again.

But critics of evolution got a boost in Kansas in November when the state Board of Education adopted new science teaching standards that treat evolution as a flawed theory, defying the view of science groups.

[js1138]

You can believe in invisible pink flamingos. Just don't make false statements about what evidence is available to back you up.

If you require physical evidence to support your belief in miracles you are going to have trouble.

[Doctor Stochastic]

When I taught calculus, we didn't differentiate people into different groups or fields; they were just integrated into one class. Differentiation leads to the slippery slope of discriminants.

[Junior]

The Grand Master isn't in the business of answering prayers.

So I discovered last Christmas bonus time..

[longshadow]

Attributionally challenged?

CDD: "Citation-Deficit-Disorder"

[dread78645]

and I personally know many people who think Elvis is still alive.

Are you suggesting that he is not?

Kay: "Elvis is not dead. He just went home."
-- Men in Black

[CarolinaGuitarman]

CDD it will be. :)

[Fester Chugabrew]

You can believe in invisible pink flamingos.

I suppose I could. I just don't have any evidence that causes me to go in that direction. Besides, it tends against faith when I know you pulled that notion out of your own behind. A fossil record denoting worldwide death is not so easily fabricated, either in theory or in the physical world, as are invisible pink flamingos.

[Junior]

I run the TV as background noise too. Oddly enough, I also use it to slow down the flow of time; if I'm reading or net surfing in a quiet room, hours can fly by before I know it. With the TV on part of my brain is keeping track of the time.

[xzins]

From Young: Mr 7:31 - And again, having gone forth from the coasts of Tyre and Sidon, he came unto the sea of Galilee, through the midst of the coasts of Decapolis,

This matches the TR text. Apparently, there is a textual variant between the WH and others. The Byz agrees with the TR. I looked for my UBS, but I must have it at the office.

The "dia" associated with Sidon doesn't necessarily make anything wrong, because that might well have been the direction Jesus chose to go.

There is nothing that requires Him to go on a straight line from Tyre. Nor is it said that He does. In any case, it appears to be a continuation of a journey into predominantly Gentile country.

CDL teaches Greek, so if he comes online maybe he can clear it up.

So far as "bible scholars" is concerned....presuppositions makes all the difference in the world.

[js1138]

You're welcome to believe in global genocide if you wish, but don't post silly falsehoods about imaginary evidence for such an event.

[xzins]

For that matter, why were they able to choose anything at all?

Yet, "Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord."

He chose to create the way He did because to Him the end result was worth the cost.

But what position is a clay pot in to question a potter's decisions?

[phantomworker]

Interesting. TV does work like that to mark time. It's fun watching the TV on mute as well. I learned that in an elementary acting class I took once. Interesting to watch the actors in their craft. But I have an ENFP Jungian personality type so I like to watch people. LOL! Did you take the test last weekend from Alamo-girl? We can learn so many things online. LOLOL!!

It's great to have the TV on in the background to keep track of the news and current events also. I missed an earthquake once and a big windstorm another time because I was so absorbed in reading.

[Doctor Stochastic]

And why are there no records (in India or Bhutan or Tibet) of such an orogeny.

[blue-duncan]

"In other words, you did not have an actual court citation, and simply decided to engage in another round of frequently-repeated erroring"

Acts 26:26 (KJV) "For the king knoweth of these things, before whom also I speak freely: for I am persuaded that none of these things are hidden from him; for this thing was not done in a corner."

This is an actual court room hearing and the judge has been cited as a witness to the truth of the suffering and resurrection of Christ. It was written by a physician/historian, not a disciple, from interviews and records to a third party who was not a disciple. The judge does not deny the facts just the implications drawn from them.

[ahayes]

Eep! I'm INTJ/P. Stay safely away on the other side of the internet, you're too overwhelming for me.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"For that matter, why were they able to choose anything at all?"

Because, according to the story, God gave them some latitude in behavior. Of course, he knew exactly how they would choose before he made them, because he was omniscient.

" He chose to create the way He did because to Him the end result was worth the cost."
" But what position is a clay pot in to question a potter's decisions?" Not much. A clay pot has no will of it's own. If the pot is defective, you blame the potter.
As someone famously said, if you are going to make an omelet you have to break some eggs.

[Fester Chugabrew]

I do not consider the fossil record to be imaginary. Nor do I consider the presence of organized matter that performs specific functions to be imaginary. Global genocide is imaginary, however, and I do not believe in that.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"Global genocide is imaginary, however, and I do not believe in that."

So you believe that the Flood story is not true?

[Fester Chugabrew]

Do you believe all foreknowledge is causative? If I "know" you are going to see the sun tomorrow does that mean I caused you to see the sun?

[wyattearp]

I have been told in the past that the water came from outer space. Apparently the earth was surrounded by a massive water canopy. The rains came from orbit when the water canopy collapsed.

From Genesis 1:

[6] And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
[7] And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
[8] And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

So basically; the sky is the firmament (even though Genesis calls it Heaven), the waters under the firmament are the lakes and oceans, and the waters above the firmament are what collapsed onto the earth from space causing the flood.

I saw once where somebody had done the math on what would happen if enough water to cover Mt Everest fell from space: it would have released enough energy to boil the oceans.

Anyways, this is what some people believe in regards to where the water came from. (I actually have friends who believe this, which is where I heard it in the first place).