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Alpine ice man may have been childless outcast
Reuters ^ | Fri Feb 3, 2006 | Sophie Hardach

Posted on 02/03/2006 6:43:25 PM PST by presidio9

Stone Age man found frozen in the Alps some 5,300 years after he was murdered under mysterious circumstances may have been a childless social outcast, a new study showed.

Italian anthropologist Franco Rollo studied fragments of the DNA belonging to Oetzi, as the mummy has come to be known, and found two typical mutations common among men with reduced sperm mobility, the museum that stores the "iceman" said.

A high percentage of men with such a condition are sterile.

"Insofar as the 'iceman' was found to possess both mutations, the possibility that he was unable to father offspring cannot be eliminated," the South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology in the Alpine town of Bolzano said in a statement.

"This not improbable hypothesis raises new questions concerning his social rank within his society," it added, arguing that the new evidence supported a theory that viewed the man as a social outcast.

Hikers discovered Oetzi in the mountains between Italy and Austria in 1991.

In 2001, scientists found an arrowhead in the iceman's shoulder blade, and tests revealed blood from four different people on his clothes and a cut in his hand, possibly from a fight.

Medicine in the man's pockets and sophisticated weapons seemed to indicate that he was a shaman or a chieftain, and one theory says Oetzi was the victim of a power struggle in his own tribe. A rival theory proposes the opposite -- that he was a reject.

Rollo, a researcher at the University of Camerino in Italy, was also able to assign the mummy's DNA to one of the basic groups of human DNA historically occurring in Europe.

His basic DNA resembles that of the Ladines, an ethnic group still living in the region today, and that of residents of the Oetztal valley where he was found, the museum said.

Rollo's latest research findings will be published in February's edition of the American Journal of Physical Anthropology.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: ancientautopsies; bushsfault; dna; georgergervin; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; iceman; mtdna; oetzi; otzi; superseded; theiceman; valkilmer
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To: Virginia-American

Let's assume that they can prove it is human blood. Given the nature of life back then, there is no way to make the jump to "he was murdered."


21 posted on 02/03/2006 7:08:14 PM PST by presidio9 ("Bird Flu" is the new Y2K virus -only without the handy deadline.)
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To: presidio9

Are they trying to find next of kin to tell them their father/husband/son is dead?


22 posted on 02/03/2006 7:13:01 PM PST by xander
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To: presidio9
and found two typical mutations common among men with reduced sperm mobility

Hey, the ice man was cold. Haven't these scientists ever heard of shrinkage?

23 posted on 02/03/2006 7:16:45 PM PST by faq (FR BORN ON DATE: 02 FEB 2005)
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To: presidio9

No condoms in his pocket?


24 posted on 02/03/2006 7:21:13 PM PST by silverleaf (Fasten your seat belts- it's going to be a BUMPY ride.)
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To: presidio9
Medicine in the man's pockets and sophisticated weapons seemed to indicate that he was a shaman or a chieftain...

Seems to indicate??? Whoa, whoa, whoa... Slow down... How do they know he wasn't a common bandit who robbed and murdered a shaman and then was himself tracked down and killed by angry townscavepeople? Or how do they know he didn't legitimately acquire those items through trade or something? Too many logical leaps of faith for me.

25 posted on 02/03/2006 7:22:18 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker

Archeology tells us mostly whatever we want to believe. For a long time people believed that pottery was an extremely important Greek art, until somebody realized that pottery was the only Greek art form likely to survive in significant quantities.


26 posted on 02/03/2006 7:26:35 PM PST by presidio9 ("Bird Flu" is the new Y2K virus -only without the handy deadline.)
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To: presidio9

The speculation here is almost as bad as those Discovery channel shows on dinosaurs that try to tell us how they looked, sounded, acted, etc. based on nothing other than bones. And I just love how the scientists speak with such authority and they really have no idea what they are talking about.


27 posted on 02/03/2006 7:31:01 PM PST by Evie Munchkin
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To: Casloy

You're right. In the old days, we could just meet the bad guy outside the city limits!


28 posted on 02/03/2006 7:40:22 PM PST by GVnana (Former Alias: GVgirl)
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To: presidio9

(it added, arguing that the new evidence supported a theory that viewed the man as a social outcast.)

They found a DNC card on him.


29 posted on 02/03/2006 7:44:39 PM PST by RetSignman (( HELP...I'm trapped between these curved things))
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To: presidio9

He could have been an avid rock collector. And a lover of poetry.


30 posted on 02/03/2006 7:55:34 PM PST by dr_who_2
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To: presidio9

Another perfect example of post traumatic stress. This man was my great x 200 grandfather. His inability to produce offspring has created terrible problems for me. Just like to ancestors of slavery, I am desperately in need of therapy to overcome the stress of being born of a childless great x grandfather.


31 posted on 02/03/2006 8:21:01 PM PST by Louis Foxwell (Here come I, gravitas in tow.)
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To: GVnana
The poor man has been dead for 5300 years. Enough already!

I agree. As a kid, I was absolutely fascinated with looking a Egyptian mummies in the museum. But after a while, I realized they were real people. Today when I see them I want to say let these people rest in peace. Yes, it's ok to "study" their corpses for a while to gain understanding of the past, but they should not be display items like a painting. They were human beings, not artifacts.

I think it's time to give this "Ice Man" a decent burial that any human deserves.

Just my quirky feelings, I guess.

32 posted on 02/03/2006 8:30:52 PM PST by Ditto ( No trees were killed in sending this message, but billions of electrons were inconvenienced.)
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To: Amos the Prophet
This man was my great x 200 grandfather. His inability to produce offspring has created terrible problems for me.

You shouldn't be complaining. You shouldn't exist!

33 posted on 02/03/2006 8:59:45 PM PST by naturalman1975 ("America was under attack. Australia was immediately there to help." - John Winston Howard)
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To: presidio9
Would you guys believe that the Science Channel had a 2 hour special on this guy called "Iceman: Cold Case Solved?"

I just can't believe that I sat there and watched the whole thing. I have no life.

34 posted on 02/03/2006 9:00:57 PM PST by TNdandelion
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To: presidio9

He was mugged on his way home from the big game.


35 posted on 02/03/2006 9:02:55 PM PST by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: Ditto

This is probably my number one reason for preferring cremation. I'd really hate to think that my remains might escape the complete decaying process with all the Sure-jell they inject ya with in the funeral homes.


36 posted on 02/03/2006 9:03:16 PM PST by TNdandelion
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To: presidio9

He wasn't much of a chick magnet, I'd say.


37 posted on 02/03/2006 9:04:12 PM PST by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: Casloy

He was probably an infidel cartoonist.


38 posted on 02/03/2006 9:10:59 PM PST by auggy ( http://www.wtv-zone.com/Mary/THISWILLMAKEYOUPROUD.HTML)
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To: presidio9

Man! If it wasn't embarassing enough back then, they have to announce it to the world again....


39 posted on 02/03/2006 9:14:34 PM PST by I'm ALL Right!
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To: presidio9

"Dang! I'm really, really late!"


40 posted on 02/03/2006 9:19:54 PM PST by WestVirginiaRebel (The Democratic Party-Jackass symbol, jackass leaders, jackass supporters.)
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