Posted on 12/23/2005 3:50:05 AM PST by EBH
WASHINGTON — In a development health experts are calling alarming, two bird flu patients in Vietnam died after developing resistance to Tamiflu, the key drug that governments are stockpiling in case of a large-scale outbreak.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
Ping the list please.
It sounds like the treatment is deadlier then the disease!
The Hanoi doctor who's overseeing the bird flu cases announced weeks ago that Tamiflu is useless. He4 seemed rather indignant about it.
H5N1 attacks alveolar epithelium directly and causes death within 72 hours, it is quite improbable that antivirals will give a significant survival advantage (unless given for exposure, where they may work).
Of course, it is also quite improbable that H5N1 disease will become widespread among humans, at least in its present form.
>>>Those who stockpile Tamiflu may "jump the gun" at the outbreak, giving themselves the wrong dosage as a precaution. This will actually assist the illmess. Sort of like practice before the real game takes place. >>> 70 deaths to Avian flu so far in Vietnam and Thailand
No one can tell whether or not Tamiflu will be effective until it's tested. Same thing with flu shots, from what I'm reading.
I read a few weeks ago that this flu causes a "cytokine storm" and thus kills rapidly.
I've been wondering if anybody's read anything that indicates that corticosteroids have been tried or would have any effect on slowing down this particular flu?
Haven't been following this as much, but I did see it on the news last night.
So Tamiflu isn't a magic bullet.
The form of the flu would kill millions of humans hasn't been recombined yet and there is no way of knowing today what would be effective.
What they are calling cytokine storm now is a new description for an old idea - that it's the immune system's attack on the pathogen that kills you. There are some diseases where this is more or less true, notably pneumococcal pneumonia and some types of meningitis.
There is nothing new under the sun.
pinged
I thought the flu virus itself becomes resistant, not the people. If the virus becomes resistant then Tamiflu won't work for anyone. Is that right? I'm confused.
Not all that surprising, actually. I was wondering whether this might happen.
Makes me feel pretty good about some of the other remedies we have discussed.
Second all of, Tamiflu must be taken within 48 hours of contracting Avian Influenza in order to counter this particular virus's very deleterious effects.
In the case of 'regular' winter strains of A or B influenza, of which one strain or the other is already reported to be in Arizona, southern California, northern Washington state, Idaho, Montana, large portions of Texas, and now even spreading in greater NYC-Long Island, the same directions must be adhered to, within 48 hours.
>>So Tamiflu isn't a magic bullet.
No, it certainly isn't, but much higher doses can be used.
Niman's commentary is interesting.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1545178/posts
Also, I relayed the observation that 500 mg/day of Tamiflu can be tolerated, if you are so lucky.
Elsewhere I have read that some of the patients with fatal outcome were treated with both Tamiflu and prednisone. Prednisone doesn't seem to help with cytokine storm, which also occurred with SARS. Prednisone was tried there too, and was largely ineffective.
Somebody with a bigger knowledge base than mine could probably say exactly why prednisone and other steroids don't help much if at all, but my understanding is that a cytokine storm differs significantly from an allergic reaction.
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