Posted on 09/19/2005 3:32:59 PM PDT by blam
September 19, 2005
Notebook: Archeology
Medieval ancestors measured up to our height standards
By Norman Hammond, Archaeology Correspondent
OUR ANCESTORS were as tall as we are, contrary to popular belief. Over the past five millennia the average height of men in Britain has remained stable at about 170cm (5ft 7in), and that of women at 160cm (5ft 3in). We may be surprised at how small the armour worn by the Black Prince or King Henry V was, but such giants on the battlefield were not physically large and were towered over by contemporaries of all classes.
“The enduring myth that people in the past were much shorter than we are today contains a small element of truth,” writes Sebastian Payne, chief scientist at English Heritage, in British Archaeology. “There have been small changes, and average height has increased by an inch or so over the past 50 years,” he says, attributing the increase to better health and nutrition.
The myth seems to stem from such things as low doorways on some medieval houses, and the small suits of clothes and armour in museums. But Dr Payne says that there are plenty of tall doors, and we simply don’t register “normally” sized outfits. “Recruits in 18th and 19th-century military records were considerably below today’s average heights,” he says, but adds: “Recruits are often from poorer families whose average height is less, and were often not fully grown.”
In the abandoned medieval village of Wharram Percy in Yorkshire, the churchyard has yielded hundreds of skeletons for analysis. There “ten-year-olds were around 8in shorter than children today: by the time they were fully grown they were nearly as tall as modern adults”.
A study by Charlotte Roberts and Margaret Cox, drawing together evidence of stature from skeletons across the country, shows that adult heights in both sexes have remained constant since the Neolithic era.
British Archaeology No 84: 51
Just a possibility. I've seen the uniforms of Audie Murphy, from World War II, and Confederate General Wheeler. They were both about the size of my 14-year-old daughter, about 5'2", maybe 110 pounds soaking wet.
There was a fluff in the filmmaking community when the recent movie of "Cold Mountain" used Romanian Army reservists as Civil War extras, but the producers pointed out that American reenactors are almost all too big, too old, too clean, and have too many teeth to be anything like realistic :-).
I had a good laugh when I went through Windsor Castle and saw the armor made for Henry VIII’s portly size.
I don’t recall Henry leading his troops into battle so the armor was no doubt ceremonial. Like Clinton, he was too busy with the ladies to bother about war.
Keep in mind the clothing most likely to survive to be in a museum was clothing the heirs had no use for. If the clothes fit others it would have been worn until it was worn out. Smaller clothes might have had a better chance, statistically, to survive. Just a thought
Have you ever been to Korea? You'd be a freak over there. I remember riding a bus there once and I felt like I was a NBA star.....and I'm only 5-11.
I'd question that figure. The requirement to be Roman Cavalry was 5'8", so legionaires would have a considerably lesser requirement.
Well, there is tallness on both sides of my family...my dad was the short guy at 5'10"...my brother was 6'7"...my mothers brother was 6'2"...my mom herself was 5'8"...all my male cousins on both my mom and my dads side were at least 6' tall...I am the short lady, being only 5'6"
So I was always used to being around tall men, and would not even date a guy shorter than 6'...luckily for me, my hubby is 6'2"....our older boy died after just turning 15, from leukemia, but by then he was already 5'11"...my younger boy is 6'5"
What I find unusual is my hubbys family...they are all from Sicily...I had always thought that Sicilian and Italian men were short, but not in my hubbys family...his dad, and all his uncles are over 6'...even the old grandfather was over 6' tall...
I like em tall...
Gads, I didn’t realize that Audie Murphy and General Wheeler were so short. Audie Murphy looked short, but I didn’t know HOW short. No wonder the Germans couldn’t zero in on him and shoot him. He was a mere speck in the distance.
Thank you about that information on the movie "Cold Mountain" and why Romanians were used. I found that interesting. And yes, the Romanians don’t have good dental care as well as other folks in that area of the world.
Ahem.
But that is the average height of kids so unhealthy--and so likely stunted--as to die at ten.
Um, weren't the great majority of people poor?
I am very sorry to read about your son.
God bless you and your family.
They were little - short, and small-framed, and strong without being bulky. Made me feel enormous, and I'm 5'4", under 120 lbs. (between babies).
It's a trial for historical costumers, because uniforms of say, the WWI era, have to be cut very differently from the originals if today's actors or reenactors are going to wear them. You can't just make the old patterns bigger, because the shoulders will be too tight, sleeves too narrow, etc. People are not only bigger than a few generations ago, but shaped differently.
Thanks for your kind thoughts...
I always find it amazing how different people can be. You're 5'6", and wouldn't date a guy under 6'. My wife is 6', and married 5'1" me. Her father who's 6'6" or 6'7" still suspects that I'm "ethnic".
Mostly fatter. I don't think modern Americans grasp just how sinewy and lean people were before all the modern advances that allow us to put on pounds with such ease.
xenalyte is how tall? 5'10"
Thats wonderful...we all have our preferences in life, preferences as to who we would date or not date...even tho I am a blond, I dont believe I ever dated a guy who was blonde...I just preferred 'dark' men...
My very tall son, usually dates gals who are under 5'3"...that is just how it works out with him...
“It's a trial for historical costumers, because uniforms of say, the WWI era, have to be cut very differently from the originals if today's actors or reenactors are going to wear them. You can't just make the old patterns bigger, because the shoulders will be too tight, sleeves too narrow, etc. People are not only bigger than a few generations ago, but shaped differently.”
That is interesting. Now that you have pointed that out, yes, the skeletal structure appears to be different. Could we say that the skeletal structure is bigger? (“bigger”…lack of a better word).
Me too at 5'10", and I'm a woman.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.