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Gull |
Posted on 07/29/2005 5:37:23 AM PDT by RobFromGa
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During a sentencing Thursday in Allen Superior Court involving a drunken driving fatal crash, Judge Fran Gull said alcoholism is not a disease – a comment that contradicts the beliefs of much of the medical field.
Gull later defended her statement, saying she was referring specifically to the case at hand.
Gull, who is one of three criminal judges for the court, also oversees drug court – a program that began in 1997 aims to rehabilitate non-violent offenders with drug and alcohol addictions through 12 to 18 months of intensive supervision and treatment. Participants must take other steps to improve their lives, and if they remain substance free, their criminal charges are dismissed.
Before Gull sentenced Todd Anthony Bebout, defense attorney Mitch Hicks asked Gull to consider Bebout’s disease, referring to his addictions to alcohol and drugs.
“He had opportunities to rehabilitate himself, but it’s a disease. It’s not only a matter of wanting to quit,” Hicks argued. “Well, you are the drug court director, you know.”
Minutes later, while reviewing what she would consider in sentencing, Gull said Bebout didn’t have a disease.
“It’s not a disease,” she said. “People say that time and again, but it’s not.”
Gull continued by explaining that the man had a choice, and his choices led to the death of a woman. She also emphasized the man’s failed attempts at rehabilitation through the criminal justice system over the years, which included counseling, probation and intensive treatment.
Alcoholism is recognized as a disease by both the American Medical Association and the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, which is responsible for 90 percent of the nation’s research on alcohol addiction, spokeswoman Ann Bradley said.
It’s a disease that involves compulsive use that cannot be controlled until the alcohol or addictive substance is removed, Bradley said.
The symptoms of the disease, according to the institute’s Web site, include craving alcohol, loss of control, physical dependence and tolerance. Those afflicted by the chronic disease can experience withdrawal symptoms, such as anxiety, sweating, shaking or nausea.
Bradley said alcoholism is considered a brain disease and that there are medications available to help alcoholics. The difference between the addiction being a disease and a bad choice is the loss of control over how much one drinks.
When questioned about the comment later in the day, Gull defended her statements made in court. She said her comment was referring specifically to that case only. She said the attorney who brought up Bebout’s addictions invited her to comment about the situation.
“He invited me to consider it as a mitigating circumstance for sentencing,” Gull said. “But there was no evidence to show that it was a disease.”
Gull said she would have considered it had Hicks presented a medical diagnosis to establish his client’s disease. Although she did not ask for such evidence during the hearing or even mention that it was lacking, Gull later noted in a sentencing order that the argument was not supported.
Addiction doesn’t necessarily mean disease, she said, and part of the problem is the lack of consistent information, saying that the topic is still debated among various professional fields.
There are times when Gull has received medical information supporting that an offender has an addiction that has been diagnosed as a disease, she said. In those situations, which do arise in drug court, she orders the offender to follow doctor’s orders and makes that a requirement of participation in the program.
“I very specifically considered what I had in front of me,” she said. “There wasn’t anything that supported it.”
Finally. And yes, I agree with the judge for the sentencing decision, but not the reasons he gave.
Now, follow me here: supposing you are an alcoholic walking around doing your alcoholic thing and decide, "This has gotten pretty old. I lost the wife, the kids, my job, all the money and they kicked me off the bowling team. I gotta quit this." Should the guy rely on will power alone or seek help through AA or the medical community?
Want to bet? It was all I could think about when I was drinking. No matter the availability.
Have you ever asked that of people who have gotten sober?
I do know a good natured joke and I know an intentional barb as well.
I never said they knew they were alcoholic before they started drinking, I said that the condition was pre-existing. It is only in retrospect that they see the pre-existing symptoms that are evidence of the disease.
Again, I suggest you educate yourself on the disease before you try to make the case against it. You only reveal your ignorance otherwise. You claim to have an IQ. I assume you mean one higher than that indicated by your arguments here. I suggest that you use it to inform yourself before people begin to draw conclusions about you and your shoe size.
There is an advanced stage of drinking called alcoholic but that is a tiny percentage of drunks. Most people decide they've had enough or the die before they get to that stage. Actual alcoholics are small in number as they don't have long to live in this world. It isn't helpful to label drunks facing jail time with this condition, or to throw the word around calling problem drinkers alcoholics. Too many people are attracted to this label because it shifts the blame away.
My posted disagreements have been with those who have categorically stated that calling alcoholism a disease is wrong because it gives drunk a reason to continue to drink.
I'm all for trying anything that might work. Scientifically the highest success rate comes from within, so they should try that first, middle, and last. AA and the medical community have a high failure rate, and often prolong the misery by shifting blame all over. If AA were a drug, the FDA would not approve it due to lack of efficacy. Changing our culture to not give drinkers so many excuses and outs would go a long way in helping them.
While I can see what you are saying, I can't agree. AA works for those who are willing. Speaking for myself, success is a gift from God.
I'm happy it works. I don't think attributing success as coming from God would pass theological muster. You did all the important work yourself, and it's healthy to take the credit. The gifts he have you is a high powered brain and free-will and you've done well with it.
Even if you consider alcoholism to be a disease, it does not relieve the person of responsibility. You can't be found Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity due to alcoholism, for example. During the mitigation phase of a criminal case, the defense attorney can propose any number of circumstances in hopes that the judge will take them into consideration and lighten the sentence. The judge is under no obligation to accept any of these proposals.
The judge's only mistake here was to offer an unnecessary and gratuitous opinion for which she will take a lot of heat from the alcholism/addictions people.
"Your ignorance is only exceeded by you lack on knowledge about the nature of the subject about which you are speaking (your ignorance)."
Jeez, you people are in denial. Does the truth hurt that much? Back at ya- Your ignorance is only exceeded by
you(r) lack on knowledge about the nature of the subject about which you are speaking (your ignorance).
You don't know anything about alcoholism except your own hatred.
I pity you because like as not one or more of your kids will turn out to be alcoholics and there is nothing you can do about it but pray. I hope I am wrong, but I doubt it, you carry the gene for alcoholism and have passed it on to them. If they do are you going to blame them and be angry at them or will you seek to understand and help them?
I sympathize with your pain at being the adult child of an alcoholic, That is not your fault. But you can't blame your father for the way your life has turned out or the way you feel. You alone are responsible for that. I strongly reccommend that you seek help. Your life can be so much more without all of that hatred. I will pray for you.
And the Judge has what kind of medical degree?
Remember, alcoholism became a disease when INSURANCE started paying for it's treatment.
first of all, everything I ever needed to know about drunks I learned in the first 20 years of my life. There is nothing "ignorant" about what I say.
Alcohol gene? BS. There are "alcoholics" in my family dating back to the early 1800's. I have no desire to get drunk. (I guess the gene skipped me)
Everything is a disease these days. Even heart burn (acid reflux) for God's sake.
Don't pity me. My kids will be fine. But, if they do make the choice to be drunks, its their own fault... NOT A GENE.
I will not dis-own my kids but I will not equate their drunkeness with that of a disease. Drinking is a choice, not a disease. I will show my kids what being a drunk can do to you and your family.. Both by words, and the physical scars I have acquired by living with a drunk.
My life is fine and I blame no one for the way it is. Thats a cop-out. If anything, my father has taught me how NOT to treat my kids.
You wanna know whats ironic? My father was a special agent for a Federal agency. He was a GS14. He made some of the biggest drug busts in the agency's history. He retired after 32 years. He was good... If you didn't know him, you would have never know he was drunk. He was nice to everybody... Until he came home. Many people would tell me he was a fine man... I would just laugh at them.
Bottom line is I DO NOT speak out of ignorance.
I do not wallow in self pity because there is none. I never lose my temper because I can control my emotions. But when this subject comes up, it brings out a part of me that not even my immediate family has seen.
That part of me is the reality of what living with a drunk can do to you.
To all you "alcoholics" out there, your habit effects EVERYBODY in your family. Not just yourself.
Yes, and some say they felt better while using. I have heard "a sober life is not all it's cracked up to be" on many occasions. It's not as if all of your problems will magically disappear. Some people actually felt better downing a 12 pack after filling out forms handing over half of their income to Uncle Sam. Heck, some people actually made more money when the worked less hours because of drinking because they were in a lower tax bracket.
Giving up a substance you are addicted to because you like it's affect does not necessarily lead to a happy life. This is probably the biggest lie perpetrated by the addiction industry.
I think you're wrong, unless you just worded your post badly. You said they knew they were alcoholics before they ever took a drink. Or at least they claimed to.
Again, I suggest you educate yourself on the disease before you try to make the case against it.
There is no "disease" on which to educate myself. It sex addiction a disease? Is complusive gambing a disease? Is looking at internet porn a disease? EVERYBODY is addicted to something. Most people more than one thing.
Fine, if you want to call it a disease, it's a disease. But everybody on planet earth has a diease then.
You only reveal your ignorance otherwise.
Yes, yes, only former alcoholics are enlightened, everyone else is ignorant. We got the message ... repeatedly. Perhaps we should go on a bender to educate ourselves.
You claim to have an IQ. I assume you mean one higher than that indicated by your arguments here.
LOL. High IQ? Me? No. I don't think anyone on Free Republic has ever accused me of that. Not even myself. When polled 80% of people describe themselves as having "higher than average IQ's" (a statistical impossibility). The lower the IQ of the person, the higher they tend to estimate themselves, and vice-versa. Geniuses have a higher tendancy to rate themselves "average" while those in the 30-50th precentile consistently rate themselves "above average".
The moral? Beware of anyone who touts themselves as being smart. Chances are, they're wrong.
I suggest that you use it to inform yourself before people begin to draw conclusions about you and your shoe size.
Fine. Everyone in the world has a disease. I'm now educated. Yippie.
Yes, but that's you. That's why on election day ... they don't just ask you who gets to be president.
There are like, 200 million other people that see things differently.
What you have described is a symptom of obsessive compulsive disorder. It could apply to alcohol, crack, sex, gambling, vintage cars, porn, or Xbox gaming.
Is it all a disease? Maybe. But who cares? It is what it is. It's just semantics.
Though reported dubiously, there is not a gene which makes one imbibe EtOh. Without question there is an addiction to alcohol, just as there is an addiction to cocaine, heroin, tobacco, and other chemicals.
The choice to drink alcohol is a conscious decision of mind and is not directed by a gene locus on any chromosome.
You're right. Alcoholics are selfish, and liars. unreliable, mean, I can use all the words.
But it is a disease. That's why I said earlier it's a family disease. You should have tried Ala-teen or Ala-non. It would have helped you deal with your anger and hatred and given you some peace.In Ala-non and Ala-Teen we learn to take care of ourselves and not dwell on the alcoholic. Learn some facts on alcoholism.
I am a grateful member of Ala-non and it literally saved my life and for sure saved my sanity.
Most drunks do not get pleasure from drinking. Alcohol is an anesthetic and a crutch to many. They drink to pass out.Ask any alcoholic if they feel better when they drink they will probably tell you no. Many are depressed, and drink because of guilt, then they feel guilty about getting drunk. Many alcoholics are Bipolar, depressed, insecure, and have other problems and they self medicate. FACT.
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