FR Poll Thread: "The Patriot Act Should be..."

Free Republic ^ | 6-13-2005 | DTogo

[DTogo]

As recently suggested, here's a thread to allow FReepers to post (if they want to) how they voted on this poll, why, etc. Let's keep it civil! :)

[inquest]

As long as presidents are limited to 4-year terms I don't see presidents as all powerful and above the law.

And how are voters going to know if the law's been violated, if it's mostly conducted in secret?

[Bean Counter]

Patriot Act needs to have some fine tuning done, and then be made a permanent part of Federal Law.

However, there is no chance in hell that anyone is going to support major expansions or permanent status of the Patriot Act that affects Citizens, as long as illegal aliens control the entire I-5 corridor, clear up to Seattle...

[B4Ranch]

My problems with the Patriot Act are as follows.

That it was even considered for a vote and that it was passed by our 'freedom loving' lying legislators. The man who authorized it to go to the floor for a vote should be lynched!

[CSM]

"Maybe if we didn't decide to bring the war to the terrorists who know what more would be happening here at home?"

How can you state such a thing. Your support of the Patriot Act would indicate that you think that is what will protect us from terrorist acts.

Which is it that you support? Taking away rights of our own citizens or taking the fight to the terrorist's home land?

[Txsleuth]

WOW, you guys---this was obviously a great idea over two hundred posts already!!!

I'll be back, have to change a diaper!!!

[processing please hold]

Thanks, see you when you get back. :-)

[B4Ranch]

One of my old tag lines was something like ,"Wave your flag, don't waive your rights."

Where are the FReepers who lost a parent or a relative in a war? Voting to make it permanent or extend it? I hope not!

[april15Bendovr]

I am for taking the fight to the terrorists and moving the termites nest away from America.

I am not for permanently removing the rights of American citizens as I am a Constitutionalist. I due however strongly feel that we do need to give up some rights at the time of war just like we did during WW2.
I remember my mother telling us how they had a curfew on leaving the lights on near the coast. My grandmother stated to me they had to ration everything.

I wonder how much Americans are focused on entitlements rather than rights when it comes to preventative measures to preserve our freedom?

[billbears]

Iran, Syria and Iraq have historically attacked the US with terrorist acts.

REALLY? The only attack on US soil was 9/11 and that was from the Taliban in Afghanistan, an attack that could not be tied to Iraq.

The Whole World thought Iraq had WMDs,

Wow and to think we were a sovereign nation of states that didn't need to receive any sort of confirmation from the rest of the world. Now that WMDs aren't there, nor were they ever probably, we rely on the argument the 'whole world thought so'.

Not only are there no WMDs in Iraq, Saddam will never get WMDs in the future.

And in place of Saddam, the police action has removed the only secular government in the region. I'm sure you'll think it just as cozy in 25 years or less, the Iraqis vote in their theocratic government. But it'll be done democratically and so it will be acceptable.

The CIA warned US of a threat and that threat already had hit US in the 1993 wTC bombing that for the grace of God did not topple the building instantly and kill many more than died on 9/11. So those who would place the CIA under condemnation, bunch our enemies with our friends - well....... I don't confuse those two very different groups.

I can't respond because I have no idea what you're saying here. The CIA was the group that supplied the 'intel' on WMDs. The WMDs weren't there. Who do you blame? Let's just continue the blatant falsehood and say they were shipped somewhere. WorldNutDaily thinks so and that's all the confirmation we need right?

[Lazamataz]

Make it permanent. We are in a war that will probably never ever end. I hope we can prevent another mass murder 911 attack. Not arrest suicide bombers after an act is carried out. I disagree with the arguments that this act would be dangerous with another Clinton administration. That sounds like DU conspiracy talk to me. As long as presidents are limited to 4-year terms I don't see presidents as all powerful and above the law.

"Never underestimate the will of the downtrodden to lie flatter." -- Dead Corpse, Free Republic.

[to_zion]

"One of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the great struggle for independence." - Charles A. Beard

“For your own good” is a persuasive argument that will eventually make a man agree to his own destruction." - Janet Frame

"Now those who seek absolute power, even though they seek it to do what they regard as good, are simply demanding the right to enforce their own version of heaven on earth, and let me remind you they are the very ones who always create the most hellish tyranny." - Barry Goldwater "If the author of the Declaration of Independence were to utter such a sentiment today, the Post Office Department could exclude him from the mail, grand juries could indict him for sedition and criminal syndicalism, legislative committees could seize his private papers ... and United States Senators would be clamoring for his deportation that he... should be sent back to live with the rest of the terrorists." - Frank I. Cobb

"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -John Hay

"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy" - James Madison

"Everything secret degenerates, even the administration of justice; nothing is safe that does not show how it can bear discussion and publicity." -Lord Acton

"If men, through fear, fraud, or mistake, should in terms renounce or give up any natural right, the eternal law of reason and the grand end of society would absolutely vacate such renunciation. The right to freedom being the gift of Almighty God, it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave." - Samuel Adams

"The first people totalitarians destroy or silence are men of ideas and free minds." - Isaiah Berlin

"Every effort to confine Americanism to a single pattern, to constrain it to a single formula, is disloyalty to everything that is valid in Americanism." -Henry Steele Commager

"Men in authority will always think that criticism of their policies is dangerous. They will always equate their policies with patriotism, and find criticism subversive." -Henry Steele Commager

"Find out just what the people will submit to and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them; and these will continue until they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress." -Frederick Douglass

"It is better, so the Fourth Amendment teaches us, that the guilty sometimes go free than the citizens be subject to easy arrest." - Justice William O. Douglas

"The mission of the Gestapo expanded steadily as, from 1933 onward, “political criminality” was given a much broader definition than ever before and most forms of dissent and criticism were gradually criminalized. The result was that more “laws” or lawlike measures were put on the books than ever." -Shelia Fitzpatrick

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive." -C.S. Lewis

"I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson

"There is no crueler tyranny than that which is perpetuated under the shield of law and in the name of justice." - Charles de Montesquieu

"Necessity, the tyrant's plea" - John Milton

"The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience" - Albert Camus

[skr]

Extended, with common sense adjustments. Keeping in mind that misuse and abuse of these powers will occur in the wrong hands.

[CSM]

Rations wouldn't be necessary if the free market were allowed to work. If prices were allowed to rise in tragic times, people would self ration. People would still be free to chose how to spend their resources.

Your example of rationing is a far cry from the Patriot Act.

[billbears]

As long as presidents are limited to 4-year terms I don't see presidents as all powerful and above the law.

Haven't studied a lot of our own history in the past 145 years have you?

[ncpatriot]

I would like the Patriot Act to sunset again in about 5-10 years. I do NOT support making it permanent.

[processing please hold]

"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy" - James Madison

There's the winner. It's happening now.

[faq]

There are very few secrets in government. Think of all the whistleblowers. And if someone is wronged, you know the press would be more than happy to report their story.

(Note: Sorry, I meant to post a reply the first time, not send a freepmail. That was an accident.)

[gregwest]

Dump the Patriot Act and just enforce the borders. Allow the FBI to "profile" possible terror suspects. Hmmm, that's odd...they're all young, male, Middle-eastern descent, and Muslim. Could it be a profile?

[Txsleuth]

I'm thinking there should have been a choice that we have the Patriot Act when a Republican is POTUS, but NOT when a dem is POTUS!!! lol

I am afraid I haven't found a choice that fits my vote, without a tweak here and there...that also isn't on the list.

I'm thinking, and reading---

I am totally enjoying the different responses and reasons...I just love Freepers--they are all so smart!

[Dead Corpse]

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. -Declaration of Independence.

Too big to fit on a tagline though. Also, I have no idea who first came up with my tagline. I found it off of Google at some point in the past. If anyone knows, let me know so I can give proper attribution.