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Newfound Dinosaur a Transitional Creature
Las Vegas Sun (AP) ^ | May 04, 2005 | Malcolm Ritter

Posted on 05/04/2005 12:32:23 PM PDT by MeanWestTexan

Caught in the act of evolution, the odd-looking, feathered dinosaur was becoming more vegetarian, moving away from its meat-eating ancestors.

It had the built-for-speed legs of meat-eaters, but was developing the bigger belly of plant-eaters. It had already lost the serrated teeth needed for tearing flesh. Those were replaced with the smaller, duller vegetarian variety.

(Excerpt) Read more at lasvegassun.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: crevolist; dinosaurs; evolution; godsgravesglyphs; paleontology; transitionalfossil
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To: FormerLib
Stalin's being kicked out of the seminary for declaring Darwin's theory as the answer to creation occurred decades before Lysenko published his theory.

Interesting claim. I did a bit of digging and I saw that he was kicked out for espousing Marxist views, but nothing about him being kicked out for advocating Darwinian evolution. Do you have a reference for this?
221 posted on 05/04/2005 4:35:28 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: MeanWestTexan
And God speaks unclearly --- on purpose, I suppose ...

You believe Alan Greenspan is ... NAH!!!

222 posted on 05/04/2005 4:35:30 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: PatrickHenry

"DNA evidence, if available, is very good for clearing up confusing cases. "

Not to nit-pick, but didn't you just state that their was no DNA evidence on this thing?

And yes, mis-classification may be minor on the most part, but that would apply to *current* species, wouldn't it? We have no genetic evidence (I may have missed one of your links on this, forgive me if I did) of links between such ancient beasts.

As for the "seriousness" of a reclassification, I defer to my statement about it applying to *current* species. We have no clue how "off" we are on older than that.

Regards,

-Mac


223 posted on 05/04/2005 4:36:33 PM PDT by MacDorcha (Where Rush dares not tread, there are the Freepers!)
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To: orionblamblam
You should have some sort of servicable alternate theory.

Well, even absent an alternative theory, showing that the existing paradigm is completely impossible would be sufficient for some level of fame. Creationists can't even do that much. Sure, they claim to have "proof" that it's all a sham, but examination inevitably reveals it to be founded in ignorance of basic scientific principles (such as just about any argument founded in thermodynamics), ignorance of the theory of evolution itself (such as in Hovind's case where he argues against claims that evolution does not make) or sometimes outright appeal to illogic (such as "if evolution is true then we're all just animals").
224 posted on 05/04/2005 4:38:00 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: jwalsh07
The omnivore is much better suited to survival than the herbivore or the carnivore.

It depends on the environment. "Jack of all trades, master of none" is not necessarily the best possible adaptation. Not all that long ago, there used to be bears in Africa. Not any more, though. Omnivorous generalists like bears don't do as well as specialists in such a highly competitive environment. They aren't as good at predation as superpredators like lions and leopards. They aren't as good at browsing and foraging as giraffes or elephants. And so they got pushed out.

225 posted on 05/04/2005 4:38:03 PM PDT by general_re ("Frantic orthodoxy is never rooted in faith, but in doubt." - Reinhold Niebuhr)
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To: lepton

I said they were imagining, not arguing.
Like darwin imaginersdon't argue.
They just call names at questioners.


226 posted on 05/04/2005 4:41:14 PM PDT by metacognative (eschew obfuscation)
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To: general_re

Except this fine feathered fellow maintained it's abiltiy to run down prey while at the same time evolving grinders and not the gut to go along with them. If it was transitional, it was transitioning between being and not being.


227 posted on 05/04/2005 4:42:53 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: balrog666

And being human ex-lax means you mock others and don't back up your words with thoughts.

Dataman was wrong and rude if the above statements are true (and with a lack of defense on his part, I will defer to Dimensio's claims as correct) But you, sir, are an out-right jerk.

You cover entire forums with "witty" one-liners that attack other's ideas, and make no contributions of your own.


228 posted on 05/04/2005 4:42:59 PM PDT by MacDorcha (Where Rush dares not tread, there are the Freepers!)
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To: balrog666
Dr. Dino-the-Huckster is broke and under another investigation by the IRS, the state of Florida, and Escambia County for fraud, tax evasion, and being an unrepentant, fraudulent dumbass.

It's about time they're enforcing the law against being an unrepentant, fraudulent dumbass.

229 posted on 05/04/2005 4:43:42 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: MacDorcha
Not to nit-pick, but didn't you just state that their was no DNA evidence on this thing?

I don't recall. DNA from creatures that old must be rare indeed, if any still exists. The Nature article (at post 22) says they "uncovered a skull, pelvis and limb bones ... ." That's probably enough for an expert to make a good classification. If more turn up, we'll learn if this initial classification is correct. Just relax. These things can take a bit of time. The foundations of science don't rest on this one fossil.

230 posted on 05/04/2005 4:46:33 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: FormerLib
My point is that the sort of folks who despise religion seem to cling to the theory of evolution with a very fervent faith.

By my definition "faith" is something accepted with no genuine evidence. As in "I accept on faith that the guy wasn't a murderer, because he told me he wasn't".

That's completly counter to evolution which has mountains of evidence. The new link pointed out to me today is merely one a great many. Yet, as the OJ Jury refused to consider DNA evidence, many creationists refuse to take that link as "evidence" for evolution and declare it "faith" instead.

I can't help but notice that some of the same folks bolstering evolution by mocking Christianity on this thread are the same folks who rail against us Christian barbarians when we pass laws banning "gay marriage." Odd coincidence!

I really haven't seen anyone railing against laws banning "gay marriage" around FR. But maybe I just don't frequent posts on the subject. I think gay marriage is damaging to civilization because like creatures evolve, I think cultures evolve as well. And our culture has demonstrated its success by being generally sexually straight and monogamous. I think that homosexuality is a "step backwards" in the evolution of civilization.

As for railing at Christians, It's hard for me as a Christian to not get mad at fellow Christians who are so obviously wrong about evolution. It makes me look stupid if I claim to be a Christian among scientifically literate non-Christians. Creationism is damaging to Christianity, because such non-Christians are never likely to take anything Christians say seriously and perhaps come to know God as a result.

231 posted on 05/04/2005 4:48:25 PM PDT by narby
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To: MacDorcha
Dataman was wrong and rude if the above statements are true (and with a lack of defense on his part, I will defer to Dimensio's claims as correct) But you, sir, are an out-right jerk. You cover entire forums with "witty" one-liners that attack other's ideas, and make no contributions of your own.

Well, gosh, I think the same thing about you. But you knew that already.

232 posted on 05/04/2005 4:49:20 PM PDT by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: MacDorcha
... you, sir, are an out-right jerk.

[*Sigh*]

233 posted on 05/04/2005 4:49:28 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: MacDorcha

Touche'....you're making all the right enemies!


234 posted on 05/04/2005 4:49:36 PM PDT by metacognative (eschew obfuscation)
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To: metacognative
Touche'....you're making all the right enemies!

You mean reason and logic?

235 posted on 05/04/2005 4:52:57 PM PDT by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: FormerLib
Stalin's being kicked out of the seminary for declaring Darwin's theory as the answer to creation ...

So, if the seminary had believed, as I do, that Genesis and evolution do not conflict. Then they would not have kicked Stalin out, he would have been a priest, and the soviet state might not have been the problem it was for 75 years.

God works in mysterious ways....

236 posted on 05/04/2005 4:53:06 PM PDT by narby
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To: balrog666

Since you're paying attention...why don't you answer the question Pathen ducks: What is your best single reason for believing matter can organize itself upward by mere chance?


237 posted on 05/04/2005 4:55:51 PM PDT by metacognative (eschew obfuscation)
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To: narby
So, if the seminary had believed, as I do, that Genesis and evolution do not conflict. Then they would not have kicked Stalin out, he would have been a priest, and the soviet state might not have been the problem it was for 75 years.

Maybe God spoke to the people in charge of the seminary and told them He didn't like competition?

238 posted on 05/04/2005 4:57:57 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: jwalsh07
Except this fine feathered fellow maintained it's abiltiy to run down prey...

Or the ability to run from predators. Gazelles and ostriches are quite fast also, and when was the last time you saw one of them take down another animal? ;)

...while at the same time evolving grinders and not the gut to go along with them.

It happens. Pandas don't have the gut for being herbivores either - their digestion is horribly inefficient when compared to, say, cows. So they make up for it by eating enormous amounts of food, relative to their body size. Just because some adaptation would be advantageous, that doesn't mean you'll develop it - it's all in the luck of the draw.

239 posted on 05/04/2005 4:58:46 PM PDT by general_re ("Frantic orthodoxy is never rooted in faith, but in doubt." - Reinhold Niebuhr)
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To: metacognative
What is your best single reason for believing matter can organize itself upward by mere chance?

Kind of like crystals organize themselves by chance?

Kind of like on a windless morning, where the surface of a lake organizes itself into a "mirror".

Kind of like snowflakes organize themselves into 6 sided thingies (I suppose that's redundant cause it's a crystal).

Kind of like planets and stars organize themselves into orbital planes and spheres, and gravity lights off the H2 releasing energy?

Kind of like light organizes itself into a rainbow in the rainstorm? (I suppose light isn't "matter", but hey, it's organized)

240 posted on 05/04/2005 5:03:02 PM PDT by narby
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