Posted on 04/14/2005 12:00:51 PM PDT by Dean Baker
Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism By JEANNINE F. HUNTER, hunter@knews.com April 13, 2005
NEWPORT, Tenn. - Two days after being posted, a church marquee message that questions the purpose of the papacy is still attracting attention in this small community.
"What I am trying to do is to let people know there's only one way to heaven through Jesus Christ," said the Rev. Cline Franklin, pastor of Hilltop Baptist Church. "There's no need for help. God sent his son, Jesus Christ. We're all priests if we're saved. I don't need to go to anybody else to pray."
The sign's side facing Broadway, the main thoroughfare in Newport, reads, "No truth, No hope Following a hell-bound pope!" On the other side, facing the church parking lot, it reads: "False hope in a fake pope."
The message appeared days after Pope John Paul II's funeral last week.
"It is unfortunate when it comes from within the Christian church. It's really sad," said the Rev. Dan Whitman, 54, pastor of Newport's Good Shepherd Catholic parish and Holy Trinity parish in Jefferson City. "You learn how to deal with it and pray not to be that way yourself."
It does not reflect mainstream Baptist thought, said Dr. Merrill "Mel" Hawkins, associate professor of religion and director of the Center for Baptist Studies at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City.
"When you see signs like that, they are almost like relics or artifacts of a bygone era," Hawkins said.
He spoke about animus between Protestants and Catholics persisting after the Protestant Reformation and for centuries, during which "harsh things were said, couched within misperceptions, misunderstandings."
Among the major misperceptions is that Catholics "venerate the pope on the same level as Jesus," Hawkins said, and that "the pope is connected to their salvation in place of Jesus Christ."
Catholics make up about 12 percent of the population in the South.
"Catholics are a minority faith in the South, and there's often bias toward minority religious communities because people don't understand," he said.
James Gaddis, a lay speaker who also chairs the board at First United Methodist Church, said he had not seen the sign but had heard about it.
"I understand that it's very degrading," he said. "I think it's tragic that any church group would stoop to this posture."
Following Tuesday night's council meeting, Newport Mayor Roland Dykes Jr. said he was a little saddened by the message.
"It doesn't behoove any of us to determine who is going to heaven or hell. I think the pope is a highly, highly respected person," he said.
Franklin's church is a five-year-old independent Baptist church. When asked what the message meant, he said: "What does 'pope' mean? It means father. We have a heavenly father, and the Bible says we shall call no man a father. "
He said people have been driving by or taking pictures or calling to share their views. He said the intent was not to offend Catholics and people are misunderstanding the sign.
Copyright 2005, Knoxville News-Sentinel Co.
I have seen posted on this thread that the proof that Mary was without sin is that: "We know that Mary was sinless because the angel Gabriel declared her so ("full of grace")."
How do you know that Mary was "full of grace" continually throughout the rest of her life? Or, was this true at this instant (and other points in time) in Mary's life? In the O.T. we see many examples of men where we are told that they had the Spirit of God and then at a later point the Spirit of God had departed from them. As a matter of fact, I believe that it would be consistent with Catholic belief to say that an individual is ultimately close to God at singular points in time, and then sins, so that only through Confession can they once again be close to God.
As far as "full of grace", if you read Greek, you will see that the term "kecharitomene", is the passive femine perfect participle of "charito" (which means to give or endow with grace). And thus the term is quite rightly translated as "endowed with grace" or "full of grace".
-A8
What about celebrating the Eucharist?
****
Eucharist is not found in the bible. Do you mean breaking bread and drinking wine? Your wafer does not look like bread, either is it broken, nor do you pass wine for all to partake in REMEMBERING what Christ did for us.
Your system couldn't leave that alone either. By some sort of ridiculous witchcraft, you think you turn the Eucharist into Christ and you are actually EATING HIM. He said do this in REMEMBERANCE OF ME. I know what scripture you will grab for.....but hey...what is wrong with just taking a hunk of bread, breaking it and passing a cup of wine. What the heck is with this round thing that gets laid on the tongue, where did that come from. If I made you a sandwich out of that thing you call bread you would starve to death.
Hey Elsie....there's them 95 THINGS....roflol. :)
Good job.....altho protestants are pretty much extinct at this point in time.
Very widespread. It never ceases to amaze me how Baptists and other Evangelicals seem to not think such behavior might be deemed by offensive by those they're trying to "help".
Did you baptize yourself, or did you need someone else to do that for you? Do you prepare your own grape juice and crackers every Sunday morning, or does someone do that for you? Did you translate the Scriptures into English yourself, or did you need other men do that for you? Did you decide which books belong to the Bible, or did you need other men to do that for you? When are you going to start being consistent with your own philosophy?
-A8
-A8
Did you baptize yourself? If not, then you are not living what you are preaching.
*****
How the heck did you get being baptised by someone else as a go between? I do NOT need a priest or a pastor to talk to my Father, I do NOT need a priest or a pastor to interpret what He says for me. I can have a mutual believer baptise me, you think if a priest does it, its has more credence in God's eyes, its a holier baptism, or is it all in the heart of the one being baptised?
Aquinas says, "But she would not have been worthy to be the Mother of God, if she had ever sinned. First, because the honor of the parents reflects on the child, according to Prov. 17:6: "The glory of children are their fathers": and consequently, on the other hand, the Mother's shame would have reflected on her Son. Secondly, because of the singular affinity between her and Christ, who took flesh from her: and it is written (2 Cor. 6:15): "What concord hath Christ with Belial?" Thirdly, because of the singular manner in which the Son of God, who is the "Divine Wisdom" (1 Cor. 1:24) dwelt in her, not only in her soul but in her womb. And it is written (Wis. 1:4): "Wisdom will not enter into a malicious soul, nor dwell in a body subject to sins."
-A8
A fellow Christian baptized me. That is all that is required. You don't have to have a Pope or a Father do it. Same with the Lords Supper.
It is obvious you have your beliefs and I have mine. I would encourage you to dust off your Bible instead of your Good Catholic Manual and give it a good reading. Make sure that the men you are following are not leading you astray. Good luck and God Bless.
-A8
Did you translate the Scriptures into English yourself, or did you need other men do that for you?
*****
How arrogant..."God said even the rocks would cry out." That.."All creation waits for the manifestation of the Sons of God."
Wonder what version of bible creation uses.
-A8
A fellow Christian baptized me. That is all that is required.
I thought you "need no one" to show you to salvation - how can you reconcile these two comments?
There is no need to resort to ad hominems. If you don't need the Bible, then why don't you throw it away and listen to the rocks?
-A8
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