Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Ayatollahs in the classroom [Evolution and Creationism]
Berkshire Eagle (Mass.) ^ | 22 January 2005 | Staff

Posted on 01/22/2005 7:38:12 AM PST by PatrickHenry

A movement to drag the teaching of science in the United States back into the Dark Ages continues to gain momentum. So far, it's a handful of judges -- "activist judges" in the view of their critics -- who are preventing the spread of Saudi-style religious dogma into more and more of America's public-school classrooms.

The ruling this month in Georgia by Federal District Judge Clarence Cooper ordering the Cobb County School Board to remove stickers it had inserted in biology textbooks questioning Darwin's theory of evolution is being appealed by the suburban Atlanta district. Similar legal battles pitting evolution against biblical creationism are erupting across the country. Judges are conscientiously observing the constitutionally required separation of church and state, and specifically a 1987 Supreme Court ruling forbidding the teaching of creationism, a religious belief, in public schools. But seekers of scientific truth have to be unnerved by a November 2004 CBS News poll in which nearly two-thirds of Americans favored teaching creationism, the notion that God created heaven and earth in six days, alongside evolution in schools.

If this style of "science" ever took hold in U.S. schools, it is safe to say that as a nation we could well be headed for Third World status, along with everything that dire label implies. Much of the Arab world is stuck in a miasma of imam-enforced repression and non-thought. Could it happen here? Our Constitution protects creativity and dissent, but no civilization has lasted forever, and our current national leaders seem happy with the present trends.

It is the creationists, of course, who forecast doom if U.S. schools follow a secularist path. Science, however, by its nature, relies on evidence, and all the fossil and other evidence points toward an evolved human species over millions of years on a planet tens of millions of years old [ooops!] in a universe over two billion years in existence [ooops again!].

Some creationists are promoting an idea they call "intelligent design" as an alternative to Darwinism, eliminating the randomness and survival-of-the-fittest of Darwinian thought. But, again, no evidence exists to support any theory of evolution except Charles Darwin's. Science classes can only teach the scientific method or they become meaningless.

Many creationists say that teaching Darwin is tantamount to teaching atheism, but most science teachers, believers as well as non-believers, scoff at that. The Rev. Warren Eschbach, a professor at Lutheran Theological Seminary in Gettysburg, Pa., believes that "science is figuring out what God has already done" and the book of Genesis was never "meant to be a science textbook for the 21st century." Rev. Eschbach is the father of Robert Eschbach, one of the science teachers in Dover, Pa., who refused to teach a school-board-mandated statement to biology students criticizing the theory of evolution and promoting intelligent design. Last week, the school district gathered students together and the statement was read to them by an assistant superintendent.

Similar pro-creationist initiatives are underway in Texas, Wisconsin and South Carolina. And a newly elected creationist majority on the state board of education in Kansas plans to rewrite the entire state's science curriculum this spring. This means the state's public-school science teachers will have to choose between being scientists or ayatollahs -- or perhaps abandoning their students and fleeing Kansas, like academic truth-seekers in China in the 1980s or Tehran today.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: antitheist; atheistgestapo; chickenlittle; creationism; crevolist; cryingwolf; darwin; evolution; governmentschools; justatheory; seculartaliban; stateapprovedthought; theskyisfalling
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 1,101-1,106 next last
To: WildTurkey

I just meant that they seem against any other point of view.


21 posted on 01/22/2005 9:12:32 AM PST by mlc9852
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: NJ Neocon
Why is it that we're seeing a new religious dogma develop around attacking Evolution?

I suppose it is easier to organize people if there is a "bad guy", a demon somewhere to oppose. It elevates emotions, and opens wallets.

Although I support Christianity, I suppose there is no way to prevent some denominations from attempting to replace science with theology except by making it painful for them to do so. And at the same time they need reasurance that Evolution is not anti-Christian. Opposing ID needs to be a carrot and stick strategy.

The stick is forcing Christians to actually read and defend the Bible. Pointing out the two separate and different creation stories in Gen 1:1 and Gen 2:4 forces them to acknowledge that the Bible cannot be taken word-for-word litterally. There must be some interpretation, so they might as well interpret it to allow for Evolution.

The carrot is pointing out how grand a design Evolution actually is. And that God is so great that He designed a truly wonderful system. A system that has operated itself for 2-3 billion years. An adaptive, and immortal system, that man could only dream of designing.

22 posted on 01/22/2005 9:12:41 AM PST by narby ( A truly Intelligent Designer, would have designed Evolution)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: PatrickHenry
Everyone be nice.

You post an article that basically calls doubters of evolution "Ayatolla's" and you want us to be nice? What's the matter, you couldn't find an article that calls us "terrorists" or charge us with killing innocent women and children?

23 posted on 01/22/2005 9:14:06 AM PST by DannyTN
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: PatrickHenry

Thanks for the ping!


24 posted on 01/22/2005 9:16:22 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: DannyTN

He's a troll, who just happens to have been on Free Republic for a while.


25 posted on 01/22/2005 9:17:38 AM PST by Tench_Coxe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: mlc9852
I just meant that they seem against any other point of view.

No. You said they were against advising them that it was just a theory.

I guess you would also like them to teach that aliens brought life to the earth?

26 posted on 01/22/2005 9:20:06 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: PatrickHenry

The only "Ayatollahs" I see represented in this article are "activist judges" imposing their dogmas on the citizens of Georgia.


27 posted on 01/22/2005 9:21:24 AM PST by Gritty ("blue staters’ theophobia is more pervasive than red staters’ homophobia"-Mark Steyn)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Alacarte
It sort of precludes an intelligent debate about a science issue when the majority of one side has forgotten what they learned in grade 5 science class.

There is a different mindset in highly religious people. It's more emotion than logic. They have their belief, and they're sticking with it.

One thing that I have not seen much attention in science is the study of how people are lead. How are political movements (which are almost entirely emotional) generated. This is a very tough thing to study. But political movements are the most powerful thing in human civilization. They need to be studied, and that research distributed as wide as possible. This will take the edge off of these movements, and dampen their ability to do damage.

The ID movement has become very sophisticated, and has broken the boundary of what we would call religion, and is now into politics. Similar to activities of the Sierra Club and PETA on the left. Like those entities, the ID movement is self sustaining by seeking donations and selling media to those it convinces. Like the Greens, who have a demon to oppose in "big business", ID organizations have an evil in "Evolution" to oppose. It is a highly seductive method of gathering and keeping a political following.

In the end, it could be very dangerous. Where the Greens took basically non-religious people and formed a "Gaia" following that they don't claim to be a religion. The ID people at the Discovery Institute are attempting to hijack a genuine established religion and get it to do it's bidding. I don't think they have any evil designs. But they are after power. And power does corrupt. What the ID movement may spawn in 50 years we will probably not like.

28 posted on 01/22/2005 9:32:07 AM PST by narby ( A truly Intelligent Designer, would have designed Evolution)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: narby

"young earth creationist"

In my reference to burn/size/gravitational pull I cited a physics argument against an old earth. Do you have a rebuttal or just a rebuff based in your own theories and memes?

I am looking for scientific rationale, as an empiricist with faith in God. Please show me you are an empiricist as well--with faith in not only your belief, but an astrophysics-appropriate validation or argument. Thanks.


29 posted on 01/22/2005 9:32:35 AM PST by The Spirit Of Allegiance (AHEM Useful Idiots: YOU are the REDS. You and your Red-Stream Media. True America is BLUE.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Blurblogger
In my reference to burn/size/gravitational pull I cited a physics argument against an old earth.

You "cite" but you give no basis for your citation.

I now cite "If God were a good god, he would allow innocent babies to suffer, therefore he is an evil god."

30 posted on 01/22/2005 9:36:40 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: WildTurkey

Why would you think I would want students taught that aliens brought life to earth?


31 posted on 01/22/2005 9:36:59 AM PST by mlc9852
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Alacarte

I'm relatively new but posted on another related thread a thought about Creationists-by-Faith versus Creationists-by-Argument.

I have utmost respect for Creationists-by-Faith.

Creationists-by-Argument seem to me to be dishonest at some level and don't believe their own rhetoric. It may be that they are dishonest with themselves and fear that to accept evolution is to somehow lose their faith. I wonder if meeting deeply religious people who accept the theory of evolution as a wonderful evidence of the glory and magnificence of Creation would relax that group. One might hope.


32 posted on 01/22/2005 9:41:00 AM PST by e p1uribus unum
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: narby
Why are you against God? For generations the Bible was read in schools and teachers prayed and everyone survived. I don't understand why people are against God in school. This nation was founded by people who believed in God and wanted to worship God and thanked God for this nation. Why all of a sudden must God be kicked out of schools and other institutions? Whose idea was this? The majority of Americans who believe in God and believe in creationism? Or was it a small, radically atheist group with the help of judges who see the Constitution as something to be overcome?
33 posted on 01/22/2005 9:43:20 AM PST by mlc9852
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Blurblogger
and the fact that if the solar system was anywhere near as old as some claim--our sun would have been so much larger--

What "fact"! Oh, it was stated on some creationist's web-site therefore it is FACT.

34 posted on 01/22/2005 9:45:16 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: mlc9852
Why would you think I would want students taught that aliens brought life to earth?

I thought you were in favor of teaching the students that other alternative to evolution existed.

35 posted on 01/22/2005 9:46:21 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: e p1uribus unum
I have utmost respect for Creationists-by-Faith.

Same here. Creationists-by-Argument seem to me to be dishonest at some level and don't believe their own rhetoric. It may be that they are dishonest with themselves and fear that to accept evolution is to somehow lose their faith. I wonder if meeting deeply religious people who accept the theory of evolution as a wonderful evidence of the glory and magnificence of Creation would relax that group. One might hope.

Ditto! Excellent!

36 posted on 01/22/2005 9:49:19 AM PST by NJ Neocon (Democracy is tyranny of the masses. It is three wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: mlc9852
Why are you against God?

Did God tell you that? Nothing in his post infers that.

37 posted on 01/22/2005 9:49:23 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: narby

"...One thing that I have not seen much attention in science is the study of how people are lead. How are political movements (which are almost entirely emotional) generated...."

Study advertising and sales. They've got it.

Also some studies like the one popularized by the book "Obedience to Authority" by Milgrim.


38 posted on 01/22/2005 9:50:21 AM PST by e p1uribus unum
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: mlc9852
Why all of a sudden must God be kicked out of schools and other institutions?

Why do yo distort. No one here has ever said that. In fact, many have supported the teaching of religions in a RELIGION class. But not in a science class.

39 posted on 01/22/2005 9:50:52 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: narby
There is a different mindset in highly religious people. It's more emotion than logic. They have their belief, and they're sticking with it.

So much that they will pretend they don't understand the semantics of the word 'theory' simply not to disturb their beliefs? That mentality has frightening implications.

I don't care who espouses what philosophical or religious ideas, I only care when they start purposely misrepresenting science like IDers and creationists do. I don't know much about PETA and the 'Greens,' so I won't comment on them.
Without science on their side, these groups are all rhetoric with nothing to back it up.

BTW Narby, I think we have very differing POV at a higher idealistic level, so this isn't backslapping, but I very much enjoy your posts. They seem well thought out and honest, and you present your points in an articulate manner. I hope to read lots more. Cheers.
40 posted on 01/22/2005 9:55:06 AM PST by Alacarte (There is no knowledge that is not power)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 1,101-1,106 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson