Posted on 11/17/2004 8:54:21 AM PST by Ron H.
The chairman of a House International Relations subcommittee yesterday urged the Bush administration to drop its proposed temporary guest-worker program and not "reward Mexican nationals living and working illegally in the United States" with legal status.
"It is our hope that in future discussions with the Mexican government, you will encourage Mexico to do its part to address illegal immigration rather than encourage their citizens to illegally enter the U.S.," said Rep. Elton Gallegly, California Republican, who heads the subcommittee on terrorism, nonproliferation and human rights, in letters to Secretary of State Colin L. Powell and Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge.
"Cooperation with our close neighbor Mexico is essential, but we also feel that Mexico must respect our sovereignty and our laws, and ........
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
I've pinged the person who would definitively know the answer to this question.
Where the rubber meets the road is allowing illegal aliens in our country to apply for legal status. That will cause the flood to become a tsunami based on empirical evidence. Applicants must live in a place where they live legally to apply. That is my considered judgment, and as you might have noticed, I have considerably dissonance on this issue, have changed my opinion somewhat, and did not come to my present view lightly, and still believe that in the end, the Hispanic diaspora in the fullness of time will be to our advantage. But the system can take only so much shock at once, and yet stay alive to see the promised land.
How about this idea:
In order to receive welfare, current (American) citizens on welfare will be required to work these "jobs Americans dont want" in order to receive welfare.
Of course, the welfare pay-out would be less since the recipients will have a low income (5.15/hr).
That should take care of it.
Your argument is now blown out of the water.
Try again -
We are still not dealing with those already here.
We don't have the intestinal fortitude to round up possible Muslim extremists in the country, so in my honest opinion, we won't have the intestinal fortitude to round up millions of Mexican families and remove them from our soil.
So we will simply continue not to do anything about it because one option is not achievable, and we fear the consequences of another.
What we all seem to agree on is that doing nothing is not the right thing to do, yet, it seems that it's the only thing we manage to do effectively.
If you want to truly stop the flow, then we must help make there as palatable as here...then they'll just stay home.
But they are already here!
We all seem to have this notion that since they're not here legally, we can make believe that the system hasn't already absorbed the shock.
Yes, of course, improving the standard of living in Mexico is job one. Job two, is to squeeze out the illegals by squeezing in the legals on tours of duty who play by the rules, with maybe something more permanent down the line. Job three is to crack down on employers. Job four is to get enough personal to deal with the chaos on the Arizona border. We need to get control of who is here. It is not about the browning of the median color of America's skin.
My delta function is what would entail if Bush rewarded the current illegals by giving them illegal status. The flood as I said would become a tsunami, and under the Bush administration, the flood has become close to unmanageable fiscally in many border states. The numbers were once manageable. They are no longer. That is my opinion.
So, the solution as you see it is to remove ten million illegals living in the country, while simultaneously bringing in ten million trained replacement legal immigrants who are ready to take the jobs being vacated by the illegal immigrants.
And of course, no one will be crossing the borders illegally while we carry this restructuring of our workforce out, and the same majority of the US population who are now demanding a roll back in the number of immigrants being allowed into the country legally will have a change of heart, and get behind the increases in inbound legal immigrants.
I'm willing to bet large amounts of cash that any illegal immigrant who's been in the country longer than three years, and who was young enough to do so, now has American citizen anchor kids.
Imagine the outcry.
Economics is a powerful force. The jobs the illegals seek will be already filled, by those playing by the rules under a guest worker program, applying from Mexico et al (and not just Mexico, why should it just be Mexico?). The economic incentives will be diluted, and the illegals will get the message, and many will return home to start the process anew legally. Employers will have less incentive to cheat, and there will be a more robust stick for those that do. Identity swipe cards should be part of the equation. I am not sentimental about this. I want to the ship to tack - slowly - and I am patient.
Anchor babies is an issue. No doubt. It is insane that that is in the Constitution, intending something else, but that is the way it is. But am not suggesting a roundup, just an economic squeeze. The parents will get the message.
America is generous. If immigrants come in legally, on temporary work visas, and after a few tours of duty, with a clean record, are granted citizenship, they will be accepted, by all except the nativists, with open arms. After all, this is America. America needs to be renewed and energized by the aspiring and energetic from across the globe. Ameerica is an idea, not a race, or a tribe. That is what makes us special.
You continue to discuss means to stop aliens coming in illegally at some undefined point in the future, and are not discussing those aliens who are already here and working.
The ten million who are already here illegally are not seeking work, they already have work.
So in effect, the first order of business would be to dislodge illegal aliens already HERE and working, and replacing them with legal immigrants.
That's the part no one addresses.
You are correct. The illegals would tend to lose their jobs, at least temporarily.
Let's take the tomato canneries in Stanislaus County as an example.
They were nearly completely manned by Mexicans when I was there last year, and according to my hosts (the owners), they'd been working there for years...in many instances there were three generations of the same family who had been coming and working the harvest for decades.
They all had papers, whether those papers were legal or not no one knew.
These people will never be squeezed out, they would literally have to be removed by the INS, and replaced with legal immigrants.
I'll tell you one thing however...legal immigrants will not spend three generations working at the same tomato cannery.
So after removing all illegal immigrants, and replacing them with legal immigrants who would, and now I'm using empirical evidence, rise above working as field hands in a generation or so...who picks the tomatoes?
First you have to somehow identify the illegal aliens, and differentiate them from legal immigrants, in many instances working the same fields/restaurants/hotels.
As legal temporary workers learn the language, and get good reviews, they will be in demand for other temporary jobs off the fields, and slowly just move on up to citizenship. And who says that temporary workers will be just field hands? Heck, they might even work at Tyson's chicken plants in beautiful Arkansas, or make funiture in beautiful downtown Gardena in California. Maybe we can import some lawyers too, just to keep me agile, or some salesmen, to put some pressure on the nice little deal the Cubans have in Florida. Bring it on.
Swipe cards, and employer sanctions. Of course you and I know none of this will happen. We are just tripping out. The status quo ante will prevail, with slowly tightening borders, and maybe some large cheating employer roundups. So if you love the status quo, the future is yours. As I say, I am cautiously confident, that despite temporary insolvencies in border states, it will work out in the end. America is a very resilient and seductive place.
I don't want to intrude on your conversation, I just wanted to say that I was enjoying seeing a calm and reasoned discourse on this difficult issue. I wish this were the model for most.
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