Vindicating the Serbian People: An 'Aerial' Counter-Attack

Serbianna ^ | Friday, November 12, 2004 | T.V. Weber

[wonders]

Mark: I do think there is a meaningful distinction between "shot at close range" and "shooting from the hills at us". I should think any reasonable person could make such a distinction.

Actually this version does differ from some reports, but does not differ much from others. (BTW, there are always various versions of events in such situations, as is bound to happen. Ask anyone in law enforcement how many different versions of an accident or crime are recounted by eyewitnesses, and those being eyewitnesses who are honestly reporting what they remember.)

"Shooting from the hills at us" is not at all the same as shooting from the "edge of the ravine" (Paratrooper's words) or from "the top of the hill" (words of HRW witness and very similar to the published account of another witness). The "from the hills" version is more consistent with the accounts from yet other witnesses that they were "told to run" by the Serb police and were then "caught in the crossfire".

The Finnish ballistics report said "the victims were shot at a range of less than 30 metres from the trench and then dumped in it."

As for "humiliated," now that I think about it, I suspect that was an extrapolation from the HRW witness who said the victims were severly beaten with poles and/or planks in the Osmani courtyard before being led away. Dr. Ranta stated there was no evidence of beating or torture, so there could have been no such "wounds" indicating they were "humiliated" if the reporter was going by Dr. Ranta's autopsy report.

Mark, if I really wanted to pick apart that article, I could, starting with Angered by the slaying of three soldiers in Kosovo, the officials ordered government forces to "go in heavy" in a Jan. 15 assault on Racak to search out ethnic Albanian guerrillas believed responsible for the slayings... It was the slaying of policemen, not soldiers. But I'm not interested in just picking apart the article.

[wonders]

Just to set the record straight (not to be nitpicky), I never dealt with any HVO, only HV, ARSK and ABiH. Also, being a civilian, it wasn't my job to deal all that closely with the various parties' military commanders, although at times my duties did require it. And Paratrooper seems quite genuine to me. I don't think he necessarily had to know those particular people.

[wonders]

I don't doubt your identity Paratrooper, but if I still lived in Georgia I'd offer to meet you and verify it for the benefit of the others. But then if they won't believe you as to your identity, they wouldn't believe my verifying it, would they?

[Paratrooper]

Did you see the dead men in a ditch or in the barn? As I remember the photos were taken in a barn.

[wonders]

He also asked why Buja thought the KLA would attack Racak.

Just to clarify, did you mean to write MUP/VJ rather than UCK in this sentence? Thank you again for your account. I look forward to more.

[wonders]

Oops, make that "KLA"

[mark502inf]

I do think there is a meaningful distinction between "shot at close range" and "shooting from the hills at us".

Actually, you're right there is a distinction in the statements, but it is a distinction without a difference. One statement refers to distance and the other describes the setting. The two statements are not mutually exclusive; both can be correct.

The forensic team stated that the bodies had been shot where they were found. Bullets and human matter from bullets passing through bodies were found in the ground where the bodies were lying. The forensic team concluded these bullets came from weapons fring into and through people lying on the ground. Ballistic tests found that bullets in the bodies and bullets found in the ground under the bodies came from the same weapons--therefore the people had been killed where their bodies were found.

[ehoxha]

fine -I'll take your word for it.

soory about the mix up w/ the HVO vs. HV..........

Would you say that you dealt with company commander level leaders ?

These would have been precisely Ramush and Drini in 501's OZ. These also were their nom d'guerre. Therefore, the observers would have known them as such.

As for Remi, he was by far the most active local leader, with the most 'activity'. During the time 501 says he was in country - The Government had sucessfully concentrated Remi's fighters -- William Walker (apprantly) went quite often to check up on Remi, being 20-25 minutes drive from Walker's HQ.

I'll give 501 the benefit if the doubt that he wasn't involved with Remi's area, therefore doesn't recognize the name.

However, one does find it odd that 501 hasn't the slightest idea who Ramush and Drini were - These guys were local KLA leaders in the areas 501 says he was working in, who 501 would have had to have liasioned with

Wonders I am curious why you aren't questioning the way in which the evidence was obscured ny Walker and (presumably 501)

wraith why don't you question '501 on the observer patrol that you reported on, which hasn't come up in any of the offical reports ? (if I've recalled your posts correctly it)

501 Why isn't likely that Buja either a) killed those relutant Racak villagers he gangpressed ? b) them them in a tactical position where they would get killed and then finished them off at close range ?

501 - I am sure that you are familiar with the extensive post-war investigations & trials by Kfor and UNMIK which conclusively establish that the KLA systematically murdered Albanian civilians during the very period (Oct '98 - Mar '99) that you were a observer.

Given the dramatic upswing in the Albanian civilian murder rate post June '99 once the KLA had a free hand- Isn't it reasonable to posit that the KLA killed those people at Racak ?

[ehoxha]

a buuch of Racak related articles and threads from FR:

Detailed Body Count of Clinton's Kosovo War
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a39fa5c094b29.htm

KLA killed moderate & loyalist Albanians in 1998 and 1999
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a3a8d74920fd6.htm

KLA Lied says Danny Pearl in WSJ
1999http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a386c976f6ffa.htm

Kosovo- KLA Commander testifys he brought 47 KLA to fight at Racak
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/695375/posts

Kosovo OSCE observers admit to distorting their 'neutral' reports to favour KLA
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/focus/news/650948/posts

Kosovo- Complete Analysis of the Incident at Racak
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/focus/news/686417/posts

Full Text of Finnish Forensic Report Published on Racak - No Massacre
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a3a8e7f557ebf.htm

Albanian rebels swear no one will leave Macedonian village (UCK use their own as human shields)
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a3af1c8cb0465.htm

[Paratrooper_501]

Correction to post 300.

I stated, "He also asked why Buja thought the KLA would attack Racak."

Correct that to read, "He also asked why Buja thought the Serbs would attack Racak."

[DTA]

RACAK story continues on FR

Racak reports written by the proponents of NATO aggression are even more important. The beauty is that those people can not be accused of being Serb apologists like decent people can -their track record of being rabidly anti-Serb is impeccable.

Here is for example what Alex J. Bellamy from School of Political Science and International Studies , The University of Queensland, Australia wrote in "The Kosovo Verification Mission". He used OSCE, HRW and other skunk sources to conclude:

"However, at 3 p.m. villagers heard shots coming from the direction where the bodies were later found. [i.e. gully - comment DTA]

The men shot in the gully were "taken away by blue-uniformed MUP officers."

At about 4 a.m. villagers discovered the bodies of 45 people scattered on a hillside, 25 together in a small gorge

The KVM's spokesman, Berend Borchardt was amongst this first inspection team [i.e. January 16 -DTA comment]

William Walker arrived at Racak at around midday

Compare this with an IWPR article published February 1, 1999 two weeks after alleged massacre .Gordana Igric claims that :

[E.B., a 40-year-old woman said that] Her 12-year-old son Halim was killed next to her, as they ran together through a courtyard towards a nearby forest

[Speaking of Serbian police, witness E.B. said] : “There were over 40 of them, in blue police uniforms” They fired as soon as we got out of the hideout into the courtyard.

Twenty-three bodies were found early the next morning on the slope of the hill Kodrie Bebushit , outside the village. They had bullet wounds shot through, and traces of torture.

"They [i.e. police- comment DTA] took all of us out into the courtyard and separated us children. They took long wooden planks prepared for making a fire and began to beat the men, who screamed. ”

"But the next morning , the bodies were found on the hill, the body of my father, and the bodies of Sadik, and Jashar and Raif, and Shukrija and Sali and Fatmir and Nexhat.”

During the night the locals who survived got out of hideouts that the police had not reached and began to search for the wounded and the dead with torch-lights. “It was four o’clock in the morning when we came across the body of Bajrushi, Nusret's son,” a visibly distressed 50-year-old S.A. recalls. “Then, one after another, there lay all my relatives. I wanted to cover the dead in accordance with our custom, but someone decided that we should not touch anything until the verifiers have arrived. So we did not touch. We only stood there next to them, waiting for the morning.”

Bloopers and bad directing shows throughout the modified script:

Villagers have heard shots in the gully at 3PM yet it took them 12 hours after police departure to find the bodies (at 4 AM)

The number of the corpses found in the gully is 23, 24 and 25. It seems that different copies of the script were in circullation.

Prior to execution alleged victims were beaten with a heavy object (blunt force injury) and tortured, yet post mortem did not find blunt force injuries. In another IWPR article, Igric quotes a witness who claim that victims were beaten over face and bled. Hovever, there is no traces of bleeding from beating on the garments of the dead found in the gully.

It gets even more interesting - there is allegedly an eyewitness account of execution in the gully

"For six hours, Rame Shabani lay motionless, his face pressed to the dirt, while Serb police and army units shot and mutilated 25 men on a hillside above the Albanian village of Racak. He escaped by throwing himself into a ravine when they opened fire.'...'I heard their screams as they were being massacred. They were begging for their lives,'' Shabani said, sitting cross-legged on the floor of a spartan room decorated only with a photograph of the victims' coffins blanketed with Albanian flags. When they were finished they sang a nationalist song: ``Who is saying, who is lying Serbia is small? Serbia is not small. Serbia is not small.''

Yet, Rame Shabani did not come to alert search party who were searching for the dead with torchlights.

[DTA]

Jane, do you recall "styckmordet" case in Sweeden? It was strongly hypothesis-driven case, with buildup of Doctor as a killer and the media cheering up the process.

Everyone involved had a reason - police to hide their incapability to find Palme's murderer, liberals to gloat over powerful white male society, fake scientists to push unreliable concepts as facts, perverts to enjoy the corruption of justice. Doctor's life was ruined, only because he was not liked by the community.

The most interesting part was that the murder victim was alive at the time when Doctor allegedly murdered her and Police allowed likely culprit to walk free.

The similarity with Racak is chilling. Liberals will do anything to push their cause. If you have time, read the whole article and share it with Swedish friends. Then ask them if they remember Racak.

it took 18 years for the truth in styckmordet case to come out. We should not wait until 2017. If we do not push it, it will never come out.

[Paratrooper_501]

I saw them scattered all around. The ones in the gully were in the gully. Inside the town, some were still out laying in their yards. Some others had been recovered by their families and taken into their houses, laid out in the main room, and covered.

[ehoxha]

The forensic team stated that the bodies had been shot where they were found

sure - Buja and his loonies fired a few bursts after they murdered the gangpreseed (anti-KLA) villagers

[Wraith]

The Internet is a wonderful thing and I have no doubt that you are a real smart guy.

Shukri Buja was in fact the KLA commander controlling the KLA activities during the Racak incident. Did you know the KLA tried to stage a similar event some months before in the village of Petrova? You don't know the name of the local KLA commander under Buja in Stimlje? This name is not on the Internet and you would have met/seen him while visiting Racak.

I personally know Keljmendi's widow, a real nice lady.

Do you have any in site about the backlash that occurred between the local Stimlje / Recak villagers and the KLA after the 15th of January?

It sounds like you walk the walk but you have to understand that their are those self proclaimed experts out there on FR that suffer from an accute case of denial and lack of an open mind. A lack of an open mind is defined as taking everything that was spun about the incident as fact from various news sources not to mention the so called official OSCE reports.

Perception is everything when world opinion is at stake. The KLA know this and are masters of deception. The recent attempt to kill the remaining Serbs in Kosovo this past summer by drawing KFOR to Mitrovica is an example of how calculating the KLA are. Racak was no different.

[Jane_N]

To be honest DTA, I don't really know much about the styckmordet case as I wasn't living in Sweden at the time. It was in the news again a few months back though as a group of doctors wanted it reinvestigated due to discrepencies in investigations. I'll speak to my husband about it as he should know more and read up a little on it too and than get back to you on this if that's ok :)

[Paratrooper_501]

However, one does find it odd that 501 hasn't the slightest idea who Ramush and Drini were - These guys were local KLA leaders in the areas 501 says he was working in, who 501 would have had to have liasioned with

I was assigned to the Urosevac area in mid Dec after spending about two weeks in Klina and before that less that a week in Pec. Previous to this there had been little KDOM presence in this area due to lack of manpower. At this time KDOM was drawing down and turning over regions to OSCE. We had already turned over Pec and Klina. On my team was an american contractor, several Swedes, and several Italians. They american later went to OSCE. The others were already part of OSCE. My mission was to establish a presence there, get the "lay of the land", and find them a place to live and set up a regional OSCE HQ. We did that for about two weeks and then the entire region was turned over to OSCE.

Even withing KDOM there was little known about this region when we started operating there in mid Dec, sometime around the 17-20th. In getting the lay of the land, I decided that we should locate a KLA HQ and establish liaison. We did the same with the Serbs and personally contacted the police chiefs in each town. I looked at a map and estimated where I thought likely locations for KLA HQ would be. Among others, the area south of Stimlje seemed likely. During the last week of Dec I drove down the road south of Stimlje and in approaching Petrovo found the road blocked by KLA. We talked to them and eventually got access to the KLA meeting house where I met Femi and a man who I was told was his boss. I talked to them and eventually after several days got to meet Buja. My total time being responsible for this area was about two weeks after which time we turned it over to the OSCE. Had I been meeting with them for a longer time I might have discovered the identity of the others you think I should have known. I tried through various questions to ascertain information on the KLA order of battle in the region but had limited success in the short time I had available.Buja designated Femi and his boss to be their spokesmen to us and for the most part that was who I talked to.

The focus of most of our conversations was in trying to confirm or deny reports the police gave me about KLA activities and in getting reports from them on police activities which I would then attempt to confirm or deny at the appropriate police HQ. Had I been there longer I might have met or learned of some of these other personalities. However, in the time I was there I was only able to establish a relationship with Femi and his boss who were the designated spokemen for Buja.

[Paratrooper_501]

501 Why isn't likely that Buja either a) killed those reluctant Racak villagers he gang-pressed ? b) them them in a tactical position where they would get killed and then finished them off at close range ?

501 - I am sure that you are familiar with the extensive post-war investigations & trials by Kfor and UNMIK which conclusively establish that the KLA systematically murdered Albanian civilians during the very period (Oct '98 - Mar '99) that you were a observer.

Given the dramatic upswing in the Albanian civilian murder rate post June '99 once the KLA had a free hand- Isn't it reasonable to posit that the KLA killed those people at Racak ?

I am neither an Abanian apologist nor a hater of Serbs. I have no interest in the area other than stating that I believe Racak happened as reported. That is why I entered this thread.

Do I believe that the UCK kidnapped and imprisoned Albanians that they considered collaborators? Yes I know this to be a fact. They told me so.

Do I believe that the KLA killed Albanians they considered to be collaborators? I do not know this personally but based on the evidence some of you have presented believe it is true.

Neither of these facts change what happened in Racak on 15 Jan 99.

Based upon my experience, I know that the the civilians in Racak were pro-UCK and anti-Serb. I had spoken to them several times prior to the incident. Other OSCE observers had had tea with them. One of the OSCE observers told me that one of the dead men in the gully was a man he had previously had tea with. They unanimously, as well as villagers I questioned in several other small towns, said "they loved the KLA. The KLA was their friend." Based upon their body language at the time I believed that they were sincere.

Racak was attacked and partially burned by the Serb Police in Sept 98. No, I do not have personal knowledge of this but it was reported to me. In that report I was given the name of a specific official who was witnessed burning houses. No, I will not name him on the internet, but I did give this information to the ICTY. After Sept 98, in Racak as in many other villages throughout Kosovo, the Serbian gov't cut electricity. From Sept 98 until Jan 99 Racak was without electricity in the winter and controlled by the KLA. As some of you have pointed out, the population in Racak in Jan 99 was greatly reduced from its pre Sept levels. If any pro-Serbian Albanians had previously existed in Racak, they were not there anymore. I was in Racak several times before 15 Jan and never heard the slightest pro-Serbian sentiment.

If I remember correctly, someone the other day posted a link where Buja said the UCK asked for volunteers in Racak on 15 Jan. I have no doubt that this may be true. However, this is not the same as gang-pressing. If you have evidence of gang-pressing please post the link for my consideration.

I neither saw nor heard of any evidence of KLA killing Albanians in Racak. I find this difficult to believe because of the extreme pro Albanian sentiments of the town. Also, we never heard even a hint of this in our efforts to find and question any eyewitness of the killings in the following days.

Someone in a later post asked if I was aware of problems between Stimlje and the KLA in the weeks following Racak. I have no personal knowledge of this but if true it does not surprise me because Stimlje had a significant Serbian population. Also, if you will recall what I wrote earlier, the Albanians in Racak reported seeing citizens of Stimlje, dressed as police, in Racak on 15 Jan.

As to whether I have been following the events in Kosovo and the ICTY trials, no I have not. Other than a brief period in 2002 when I thought I might have to testify, I have neither thought nor read about it.

That said, based upon what I saw and heard, and regardless of what happened before or after, I am convinced that the MUPs, supported by the VJ murdered Albanian civilians in Racak on 15 Jan 99.

[wonders]

fine -I'll take your word for it.

It's not my word, just my opinion.

soory about the mix up w/ the HVO vs. HV..........

No problem.

I am curious why you aren't questioning the way in which the evidence was obscured ny Walker and (presumably 501)

I've decided to wait on questions until Paratrooper is finished with his narrative. He's already answered several of my questions without my having to ask. Also, the poor guy can't get through it all if questions keep intruding.

[mark502inf]

after they murdered the gangpreseed (anti-KLA) villagers

Enver, you've failed to support anything you say about Racak. Spam about other events in the region or simply parroting unsupported assertions made by your fellow apologists is not evidence of what happened; although it is pretty convincing evidence of self-induced brain-washing.

Racak happened. Civilians were murdered. Serbs did it. The evidence proves it.