Posted on 09/11/2004 1:19:20 PM PDT by commonguymd
Sep 11, 1:47 PM (ET)
By ELLIOTT MINOR
ALBANY, Ga. (AP) - Frank Jones says he's angry about newly revealed memos that indicate President Bush got preferential treatment in the Air National Guard during the Vietnam war, but he's not surprised by favoritism in the Guard.
Jones, a Republican from Troy, N.Y., served in Vietnam in 1970 and 1971 before doing 16 years in the Guard himself. As the presidential election nears, Jones says controversy over both candidates' military records and the mounting death toll in Iraq are important issues.
"I'm really in neither camp at this point," he said. "However, I do see a direct correlation to Vietnam. The body count is really starting to get to me."
Some current and retired members of the National Guard and other military services say the newly revealed Bush documents do not bother them, while others say they are troubling.
The documents, which became fodder for Democratic critics last week, indicate Bush was suspended from flying with his Texas Air National Guard unit because he missed a medical exam and that he missed six months of training. Questions have been raised about the documents' authenticity.
Lt. Col. Jim Driscoll, spokesman for the Georgia Army National Guard, said retired service members may comment on political issues such as the Bush documents, but most current reservists and active-duty service members will hesitate to voice their political opinions.
"It would be inappropriate," he said. "The president is our commander-in-chief and so we have to be very careful from an ethical perspective of how we express our political opinions."
Some who served in the National Guard say it is common practice to miss drills - even up to six months - because of job conflicts, family problems or illness.
Ralph Bradley, 56, a Republican from Albany who served three years in Vietnam in the Air Force and 17 years in the Georgia Army National Guard, said members are encouraged to make up drills so they don't lose pay or retirement benefits.
"There's all kinds of situations ... that cause a person to go out of state for a period of time," he said.
Army Reserve Sgt. Tim Wilding, 37, of Jefferson City, Mo., agreed.
Back home for two weeks of leave from Iraq, Wilding said he remains a staunch Bush supporter despite allegations Bush may have tried to get out of Guard drills for several months in 1972.
"A lot of guys don't serve for four or five months at a time," he said. "They've got other stuff going on. They'll make it up later on, or they just won't get paid. That's really no big deal to a lot of National Guard soldiers."
Allegations of suspect conduct during the Vietnam war also have been leveled at John Kerry, who won three Purple Hearts, a Silver Star and a Bronze Star in Vietnam.
A group sponsoring television ads challenging his wartime record contends Kerry's own gunfire caused the wound that brought his first Purple Heart. Navy records and other veterans do not support the charge.
Ahmad Majied of Albany says the latest allegations about Bush's military record are more troubling to him than allegations about service honors leveled at Democratic challenger Kerry.
Majied, a Democrat from Albany who served 30 years in the Navy, including five years as a SEAL in Vietnam, said the memos support his belief that Bush was a "playboy" during his service years.
"He had enough money to get what he wanted," Majied said. "I think his main concern was not to go to Southeast Asia. I bet he never dreamed it would come back to haunt him."
Neal Eubanks of Leesburg, who served 39 years in the military - 23 in the Air Force and 16 in the Georgia Army National Guard - said the presidential candidates should move beyond their military records and focus on the issues, such as the economy and unemployment.
"You don't see Korean veterans or World War II veterans or Grenada veterans always talking about 'I served here and I served there,'" said Eubanks, 67, a Bush supporter.
This is a g-d rewrite of the first story, so as to position the "body count" quote first, never mind what all the other vets said.
Please include original titles.
Thanks.
This is funny, AP has two articles out but they reverse it on this one, an earlier one had it started out with guardsmen who support Bush, and the guy from troy wasnt a republican, now it starts out with the guy from Troy who just became a republican.
AP doesnt have a clue. The military is rock solid behind Bush.
They are messing with fire.... real fire....
Mr Jones and the others who are temporarily duped by this FRAUDcast will turn, and turn HARD, against the DNC and the FRAUDcasters when they discover how badly they've been misled by them. They _will_ find out.
Major Backlash.
/
"I'm really in neither camp at this point," he said. "
A 'Republican' who claims to be an undecided-where do they find these guys?
Oh yes he is in a camp, and it ain't republican "neither".
That's it. Just one sentence to indicate that the whole thing is likely a fraud. Sheesh, talk about political propaganda!
On Monday, the 10-year ban on selling military-style semiautomatic assault weapons in the U.S. will end because Congress would not vote to extend the law. What do you think?
16.5%
The ban should be re-enacted. There is no legitimate reason for people to own these guns. (191 responses)
83.5%
I agree with the NRA. The ban was ineffective, in part because these weapons are rarely used in crimes. (968 responses)
1159 total responses
There is only one Frank Jones listed in the Troy, NY phone directory. Maybe some media-connected Freeper could contact him and bring him up to speed on the scam, then ask how he feels about it.
Direct phone number to AP President & CEO Tim Hurley
1-212-621-7550
He actually picks up his own phone.
I've spoken to him about the AP's "1000 booed while Bush did nothing" and I called to ask why the AP hasn't requested Kerry's military records.
On the Military record issue, the guy tried to lie to me that the AP had seen ALL of Kerry's records and there was nothing to report. I asked how that could be since Kerry hasn't signed Form 180 and released all his records. Silence, thank you, click.
SOunds like Mr. Hurley needs another call from me.
I posted to the wrong thread, my apologies
IIRC, radio-show host Dennis Prager said that in this election, Dubya is running
against Kerry AND the MSM.
http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/news/politics/9639085.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp
Posted on Sat, Sep. 11, 2004
Authentic or not, Bush memos no big deal to retired guardsmen
ELLIOTT MINOR
Associated Press
ALBANY, Ga. - Retired National Guard members and even an Army Reservist home on leave from Iraq say they aren't bothered by memos indicating President Bush was suspended from flying because he skipped a medical exam and missed six months of training with his Texas Air National Guard unit during the Vietnam war.
They said it's common for Guard members and reservists to miss drills - even up to six months - because of job conflicts, family problems or illness, and the members are encouraged to make up the drills so they don't lose pay or eligibility for retirement benefits.
"We worked around it. There's all kinds of situations ... that cause a person to go out of state for a period of time," said Ralph Bradley, 56, who served three years in Vietnam with the Air Force and 17 years with the Georgia Army National Guard.
Bush's performance as a fighter pilot in the Texas Guard became a focus of Democratic criticism this week with the newly unearthed memos that his opponents say show Bush shirked his National Guard duties - a charge that Bush denies.
"It's just politics. That's what they are doing; it's kind of obvious," said Neal Eubanks of nearby Leesburg, who served 39 years in the military - 23 in the Air Force and 16 in the Georgia Army National Guard.
Bush's Democratic challenger, John Kerry, won three Purple Hearts, a Silver Star and a Bronze Star in Vietnam. But a group sponsoring television ads challenging his wartime record contends Kerry's own fire caused the wound that brought his first Purple Heart. Navy records and other veterans don't support the charge.
Eubanks said it's time the presidential candidates move beyond their military records and focus on the issues, such as the economy and unemployment.
"You don't see Korean veterans or World War II veterans or Grenada veterans always talking about 'I served here and I served there,'" said Eubanks, 67, a Bush supporter. "I think those people in Vietnam were heros. I realize it was bad and it was hard on a lot of people, but it's over with."
Army Reserve Sgt. Tim Wilding, 37, of Jefferson City, Mo., back home for two weeks of leave from Iraq, said he remains a staunch Bush supporter and has come across only one other military member who publicly supports Kerry.
As for reports - and criticism - that Bush may have sought to get out of Guard drills for several months in 1972, Wilding said: "It's stupid. They're trying to dig up crap.
"A lot of guys don't serve for four or five months at a time. They've got other stuff going on. They'll make it up later on, or they just won't get paid. That's really no big deal to a lot of National Guard soldiers. I don't see how it's relevant now," said Wilding, who has served nearly 20 years as an Army Reservist and has been stationed just north of Baghdad with the 428th Transportation Company.
Frank Jones, 60, of Troy, N.Y., a Vietnam veteran and a Republican, said he's angered by reports that Bush got preferential treatment in the Texas Guard, but he said favoritism and politics were not surprising in the National Guard.
Jones, who was an Army helicopter pilot in Vietnam from 1970 to 1971 before serving 16 years in the National Guard, said he hasn't decided who to vote for in November but admits the daily news of soldier deaths in Iraq combined with the political furor surrounding the candidates' military records is coloring his perception of this campaign.
"I'm really in neither camp at this point," Jones aid. "However, I do see a direct correlation to Vietnam. The body count is really starting to get to me."
Savannah attorney Joseph Brennan, who flew C-130 transport planes as an Air Force pilot in Vietnam and served in the Georgia Air National Guard from 1977 to 1998, said he doesn't understand what the big deal is about the military records of Bush or Kerry.
Brennan, 57, voted for Bush in 2000 and said what he's heard or read about Bush's Vietnam-era Guard stint won't stop him from voting for the president again.
"I don't understand why there's so much concern over this," he said. "Whether someone serves in Vietnam or not has nothing to do with their qualifications to be president of this country."
---
Associated Press correspondents Russ Bynum in Savannah, Ga., and David Lieb in Jefferson City, Mo.; and writer Michael Gormley in Albany, N.Y., contributed to this report.
I'm starting to think every wire service story should trigger a blogosphere follow-up.
Bloggers should provide the people named in the article with a copy, and ask them if they feel their position was presented accurately.
In this way the blogosphere would evolve into a true media watchdog.
The good thing is that the internet and talk radio is now breaking the monopoly of the main stream media and disrupting the Lib playbook.
Absolutely correct -- a textbook propaganda ploy that would make Goebbels blush.
The same place the "Bush Memos" came from. A very dubious origin. Not that there aren't Liberal Republicans, though.
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