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Beslan Changed Russia...and the world.
National Review Online ^ | September 07, 2004 | Barbara Lerner

Posted on 09/07/2004 9:35:10 AM PDT by xsysmgr

click here to read article


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To: Rutles4Ever
That was my point on another thread yesterday. We overrate the modern Russians. As a military power, the Communists could force production and military service that a free nation cannot. That said, it's better to have them on our side, especially if we must deal with China.

God, this sounds even more like Jeff Head's latest novel!!

21 posted on 09/07/2004 9:54:35 AM PDT by LS
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To: xsysmgr

I know it's early. but are there any indications of Russia and the USA working together? There troops in Iraq would be a welcome assist, IMHO.


22 posted on 09/07/2004 9:54:36 AM PDT by airborne (2/504 PIR - 'Devils In Baggy Pants')
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To: ken5050

Announced yesterday that Israel and Russia will join to work on the terror issues.


23 posted on 09/07/2004 9:55:10 AM PDT by OldFriend (GIVE EM ZELL)
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To: xsysmgr

Good thing I'm not President of Russia (or the U.S. for that matter) if I were after what just happaned there I would apply a little reverse-terrorism. I'd anounce that the next time any Islamists took a school hostage that Mecca would be carpet bombed...with special attention paid to the Dome of the Rock.... and after that every single terrorist incident would result in another Islamic shrine/city destroyed.


24 posted on 09/07/2004 9:56:57 AM PDT by cengel3
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To: tomahawk
Unfortunately, John F. Kerry will seek to negotiate with them, like he did in 1971 with our enemies.

Well so far this tragedy seems to have fallen below Kerry's radar screen. Not a peep out of him on the subject.

25 posted on 09/07/2004 9:57:53 AM PDT by InterceptPoint
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To: MizSterious; OldFriend

If as reported, it is very huge. Thatas becuase to share intelligence involves a high degree of trust at the operational level, and the Israelis won't be giving up data unless they get good stuff in return. Sound to em iek someone in Russia drew a cicrle on a map of the range of the Iranian missile, and noticed how much of Russia it encompassed.


26 posted on 09/07/2004 9:59:58 AM PDT by ken5050 (Bill Clinton has just signed to be the national spokesman for Hummer..)
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To: xsysmgr

Welcome to the fight, Russian friends.


27 posted on 09/07/2004 10:01:07 AM PDT by Ciexyz ("FR, best viewed with a budgie on hand")
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To: xsysmgr
"Already, Putin is getting the message.

Welcome to the war against (Islam) terrorists."

28 posted on 09/07/2004 10:01:46 AM PDT by jpsb (Nominated 1994 "Worst writer on the net")
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To: jpsb
"Already, Putin is getting the message.

It's only been going on for years, and Putin has already gotten the message.

29 posted on 09/07/2004 10:05:03 AM PDT by Preachin' (Democrats are liars...)
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To: All

Chronicle of the end times brainwash

April 1999 - as NATO was bombing maternities in Belgrade and everything that moved in Kosovo, mass media was telling people that the poor albanians were fleeing from being slaughtered by the Serbs.

September 2004 - as Russia liberates hundreds, after international terrorists slaughter hundreds of children, media media is telling people that Putin is responsible for the deaths of those hundreds of children while portraying the terrorist leaders as fighters against the oppression of Putin.


30 posted on 09/07/2004 10:08:37 AM PDT by Truth666
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To: Preachin'

I disagree, while Russa has been fighting terrorists for years, it is just now realizing that the war is in fact global , and the enemy is in fact Islam. I think Russia, before Sept1, didn't really understand this. Now she does.


31 posted on 09/07/2004 10:10:57 AM PDT by jpsb (Nominated 1994 "Worst writer on the net")
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To: cengel3

The Dome of the Rock is in Jerusalem. You mean the Kabbah - that cube-like place in the middle of Mecca.


32 posted on 09/07/2004 10:18:36 AM PDT by Little Ray (John Ffing sKerry: Just a gigolo!)
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To: bobjam

Until Ivan, most of Russia had to pay tribute to muslim Tatars. Payback for Beslan will be Ivanesque.


33 posted on 09/07/2004 10:19:02 AM PDT by sheik yerbouty
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To: Rutles4Ever
One big difference: in Afganistan, the Soviets were facing US armed Islamists. This time the USA will be on the Russian side against the Islamists.

You are right though that the Soviet/Russian military is overrated, but with the right modivation and help they may still be better than you think. Ultimately, it is better to have them in the fight on our side than on the sidelines cheering for the other side.
34 posted on 09/07/2004 10:20:41 AM PDT by Flying Circus
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To: bobjam

Russia is not what Russia was. We will see if they are a paper tiger.


35 posted on 09/07/2004 10:21:41 AM PDT by wtc911 (I have half a Snickers...it was given to me by a CIA guy as we went into Cambodia)
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To: jpsb
I disagree, while Russia has been fighting terrorists for years, it is just now realizing that the war is in fact global

And I disagree with examples that don't need a lot of explanation:

Israel

New York

Spain

Beirut

Pennsylvania

Pentagon

Munich-1972

USS Cole

Achille Lauro

It goes on and on. Terrorism on the world scale is not new. The Russians, French and Germans have chosen to ignore it, and not come to our aid.

There is simply a world wide jealousy/hatred for the US, and Russia had to get hit hard to admit we were right.

36 posted on 09/07/2004 10:21:48 AM PDT by Preachin' (Democrats are liars...)
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To: LS
As a military power, the Communists could force production and military service that a free nation cannot.

Never underestimate the tenacity of the Russian people when the survival of the Rodina is at stake. And believe me, it is. These monsters care nothing about Chechnya. They want an Islamic superstate in Central Asia with nuclear capabilities. Chechnya is just their cover.

37 posted on 09/07/2004 10:23:50 AM PDT by dfwgator (It's sad that the news media treats Michael Jackson better than our military.)
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To: dfwgator

Yes, certainly this is different than Afghanistan. But the Russkies could use a few weeks training with our Special Forces guys. They are good with the hammer, not so good with the surgical knife (dare I say, sickle?)


38 posted on 09/07/2004 10:25:08 AM PDT by LS
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To: WashingtonSource
Amazing article, but terribly flawed. We all know the N word, and the L word. Very few know there is a Y word.

or safely sicced on others;

Like Clintons and his bunch sicced them on Yugoslavia and as far as I know we are defacto supporting Albania Islamist in their purges in the Balkans.

the French-led Euro-Arab axis and its corrupt international court

What the hell is Colin and Condi doing? They should be pushing W to right this terrible fiasco. Especially the kangaroo court persecuting Milosevic.

Barbara Lerner And any other main streamer should put this back on the table.

It was a major blunder siding the Islamist in Kosovo and Chechnya. With Russia we have common cause and they were aleiniated because our role in the trashing of Yugoslavia.

If we had stayed out of Kosovo, we would have a strong friend in the crucial Balkans, worth more than France and Germany combined.

All the propaganda fed us then, is being proven wrong at the Hague by Milosevic. We better stop funding that kangaroo court and jump off that sinking ship.

39 posted on 09/07/2004 10:25:56 AM PDT by duckln
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To: Flying Circus
You are right though that the Soviet/Russian military is overrated.....

Not by our DoD. I've seen up close for myself the lack of cohesion and discipline in areas where the two of us have served side by side, like Kosovo. Russian soldiers getting high and welcoming a Benz full of hookers while on duty, then sharing their weapons with the next tour.

Russia's economy is akin to Brazil's and the demographics are tilting toward a population that lacks the young masses necessary for large scale militarism. I don't know that the full fury of Russian power could even decisively defeat Chechnya.

40 posted on 09/07/2004 10:26:54 AM PDT by wtc911 (I have half a Snickers...it was given to me by a CIA guy as we went into Cambodia)
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