Totalization Treaty With Mexico -- The Sellout of America Continues

U.S. BORDER CONTROL ^ | August/10/04

[TERMINATTOR]

A year ago, this organization warned that the Bush Administration was planning to do something unthinkable - they were seriously considering signing a pact with Mexico that would give any Mexican who had worked in the U.S., including illegal aliens, full U.S. Social Security benefits, paid out of your Social Security Trust Fund!

It seemed so far fetched, we had trouble convincing the Congress that it could happen. A White House spokesman denied our claim that it was on a fast track, stating the ongoing discussions for Totalization were just informal and preliminary.

But we knew better. We had obtained correspondence proving it was on a fast track and had seen plans for erecting a huge new building at the U.S. Embassy in Mexico City just to deal with the swarms of people anticipated to sign-up for this raid on our Social Security Trust Fund.

Well, it was on fast track, just as we said it was and a few weeks ago, the President signed the Totalization Treaty with Mexico and unless you and I can persuade the Congress to stop it, millions of Mexicans, including illegal aliens, will soon be living it up on your Social Security benefits!

The timing for repealing this outrageous treaty couldn't be worse. The few days we have to repeal this treaty are the same few days preceding the November election, when every Congressmen is campaigning hard for reelection and the Congress is seldom in session. In short, it was a very underhanded way to sneak a terrible treaty past the Congress.

So please click here to jump to our Congressional Action page and send an email to your representative TODAY!

[TERMINATTOR]

Work 18 months using a stolen SS number, then recieve monthly "retirement" checks, direct deposit into a Banamex account.

[gubamyster]

ping

[Southack]

That's not even close to being true about the treaty being valid for illegal aliens. It only applies to *legal* workers. Here's the first hit on Google that I got on the treaty:

http://www.ssa.gov/pressoffice/pr/USandMexico-pr.htm

SOCIAL SECURITY

News Release

United States and Mexico Sign Social Security Agreement

Agreement to Benefit U.S. Workers and Employers

(Printer friendly version)

Jo Anne Barnhart, Commissioner of Social Security, signed an agreement today with Dr. Santiago Levy Algazi, Director General, Mexican Social Security Institute, that will remove from U.S. citizens working for U.S. companies in Mexico the burden of paying social security taxes to both countries. The agreement also will remove the double taxation requirement for Mexican citizens working for Mexican companies in the United States. “This agreement eliminates a serious and unnecessary impediment to American and Mexican businesses and their employees,” Commissioner Barnhart stated. “Just as important, it promotes equity and fairness for workers who divide their careers between our two countries.”

Currently, U.S. companies that employ U.S. citizens in Mexico are required to contribute to both the U.S. and Mexican social security systems. When the agreement takes effect, U.S. and Mexican employers and their employees will contribute to either the U.S. or Mexican social security systems, but not both. This will result in approximately 3,000 U.S. workers and their employers sharing in tax savings of $140 million over the first five years of the agreement.

The agreement also will improve social security protection for people who work in both countries. At present, some workers who have divided their careers between the United States and Mexico fail to qualify for social security benefits from one or both countries because they do not meet minimum eligibility requirements. Under the agreement it will be possible for workers and their family members to qualify for pro-rated U.S. or Mexican benefits based on combined credits from both countries. This will result in approximately 50,000 U.S. and Mexican workers receiving benefits after the first five years of the agreement.

5 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

full U.S. Social Security benefits, paid out of your Social Security Trust Fund!

But but but, they worked hard in our country, so they deserve it. They're already paying into it, so the story goes. Never mind that the pitiance of money they accept as wages, when its NOT under the table, wouldn't pay for 18 months of SS, much less a damn lifetime retirement surfing in Baja!

No wonder SS is going broke. Where they hell are the Grey Panthers on this one?

Calling out the AARP!

[Dante3]

What an outrage. Even Democrats should be outraged about it.

[EagleUSA]

This situation is totally out of control. The baby boomers in this country, who have BEEN FORCED to pay obscene amounts of SS TAX, yes tax, into our system are getting the royal shaft. The Washington government is pandering to the Mexicans for what-- JUST THE MEXICAN VOTE??? -- WITH OUR HARD-EARNED MONEY. It's OUR money, not money for Mexican illegal aliens who have never paid a freakin' cent into our SS system.

Good God -- what is going on in Washington???

[Ol' Dan Tucker]

That's not even close to being true about the treaty being valid for illegal aliens. It only applies to *legal* workers.

They'll only be illegal until Jorge Arbusto grants them amnesty, then voila! they're legal and eligble for SSI.

I guess it all depends on what the meaning of the word, "legal" is, doesn't it?

[Hop A Long Cassidy]

Yup, need more illegal immigration, so we can have another amnesty, so they can claim Social Security that Americans won't claim.

/outragious/

Hoppy

[FITZ]

One of Bush's campaign promises in the first election was that he was going to privatize Social Security. How is merging our program with a foreign country's own bankrupt plan going to privatize it? Was that just some sort of joke? Mexicans are shutting down their capitol over their own failed plan. They have plans to do that tomorrow --- have a big protest and shut down some streets and highways.

[TERMINATTOR]

Help stop plan to give Social Security to illegal aliens

What will the agreement cost? No one really knows. A GAO report from September of 2003 says that the SSA is wildly underestimating the costs of the Mexico agreement because its estimate does not factor in the more than 5 million Mexicans already living here illegally, and it assumes there will be no increase in illegal immigration after the agreement takes affect (though you can be sure that President Fox will be touting the deal from the mountaintops!) Joel Mowbray, a freelance writer who broke the story of the agreement last year in National Review, uses an estimate that the GAO says may be too high. Unfortunately, no one, including the GAO, has come up with a reliable estimate.

SSA's cost estimate: $78 million in 1st year, rising to $138 million in 5th year, and to $650 million in 2050.

Mobray's cost estimate: $345 BILLION over the next 20 years.

Here's an example Mowbray provided at the hearing to illustrate how the costs could add up:

"If a 24-year-old Mexican national who has worked illegally in the U.S. for 3 years is able to present documents from a doctor or a friendly doctor, as the case may be, and needed a W-2 or pay stubs indicating $12,000 in annual earnings, this individual would be eligible for the following: Nearly $8,000 per year in disability income adjusted for inflation until age 65 at which point he would receive the same amount as retirement pay. If he does manage to get a job under the table in the U.S. Or Mexico, he would be able to double dip for a second income stream, and if he is survived by his wife or dependents, his family would be able to receive up to $12,000 annually. If he dies at age 60 and his widow lives to age 85, U.S. Taxpayers would be on the hook for a total of a half million dollars. That is for one worker brought into the Social Security system under the totalization agreement after working in view in the United States illegally for 3 years."

Perhaps most telling though, is that the other 20 totalization agreements we have (the list of countries is on page 5 of the GAO report) produce a combined net gain to the U.S. of $600 million each year, according to SSA. There is a clear consensus that the Mexico agreement would result in an annual net loss to the U.S. The only question is how much of a loss. At a hearing on the issue before the House immigration subcommittee last fall, Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee stated that there were 3,000 U.S. citizens working in Mexico who would benefit under the agreement. The Census Bureau says that there were almost 8 million Mexican citizens (non-US citizens) living in the United States in 2002 and most of them were employed here. Obviously, the United States would get the raw end of the deal.

[ravingnutter]

Maybe you should contact the moderators and have them pull the thread, based on your information that this is a false claim.

[FITZ]

Such poor timing of all this --- Mexicans protesting their Social Security ---- they can retire now in their 50's --- but Americans are being told by Greenspan that retirement age should go up to 75? Too much disparity in the plans --- we'll have Mexicans retiring in their early 50's while Americans go on working and working to pay them what they want.

[Southack]

"Help stop plan to give Social Security to illegal aliens"

Read the last paragraph of Post #3. The new treaty applies to 50,000 legal workers...not to 8 million illegal aliens.

5 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[dennisw]

btttttttt

[StoneColdGOP]

It only applies to *legal* workers.

You might have missed the memo, but that nasty, ugly word "illegal" doesn't mean crap anymore. Ask Bush, Rove & Co.

[Logical me]

I would encourage you to read the Treaty before comments. If I read it correctly, it means that American workers that work for an American company in Mexico will not have to pay both American SSI and Mexican SSI at the same time. Now they will pay into only one or the other and if the total meets the SSI requirements can get credit for SSI benefits. AND the same benefit is extended to Mexican workers that work in the US legally. Did anyone get a different take?

[Southack]

"You might have missed the memo, but that nasty, ugly word "illegal" doesn't mean crap anymore. Ask Bush, Rove & Co."

What an odd thing to say. The U.S. catches and deports 2,600 illegal aliens per day.

5 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[FITZ]

Pension reform moves ahead despite protests

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/pls/impreso/noticia.html?id_nota=6102&tabla=miami

Mexicans have an over 70% unionization rate --- and the unions are threatening to shut things down because the last thing they want is Social Security reform --- why are our leaders discussing a merging of their plans with ours when these people don't want reforms made to their Socialist system? I guess by merging, they'll be able to do whatever protests against any reforms here too.

[Mikey_1962]

It will not and CANNOT HAPPEN!!!

My wife is Mexicana... went through hell to get her here legally... and she has TWO college degrees.

I think these guys are looking at the numbers to bail us out... really!!

[Joe Hadenuf]

They'll only be illegal until Jorge Arbusto grants them amnesty, then voila! they're legal and eligble for SSI. I guess it all depends on what the meaning of the word, "legal" is, doesn't it?

Bingo!