Posted on 06/18/2004 9:55:45 AM PDT by xsysmgr
And if you read Henry Kamen, you will see that he disagrees with you. A lot were falsely accused but Jewish Christians were, by and large, NOT secret Jews.
Interesting article.
Finally, some true history on the subject.
Historians have known this for years, but the popular culture has so embraced the Inquisition myth that the facts are of no relevence.
And this means? Taken from an actual photo, I assume?
Right, and a scholar and lawyer I know, who is Jewish, but studied in Catholic Universities, credits the Spanish Inquisition, and not Old Testament Law with the lack of modern Jewish evangelism. Second, the Church of Rome has, historically, discouraged Catholics from owning Bibles and printed or wrote those Bibles in a language the populace (those who could read in their own language) couldn't understand. This effectively made church officials the exclusive source of religious information. Can't we say that the Roman Catholic Church has come along way, and stop saying the the Church is wholly immutable?
Mel Brooks History of the World Part 2 I believe... it's very very funny
Thank God for Martin Luther.
Oh, horsepuckey! There were Inquisitions centuries before the invention of printing; read the article.
The Church has never had a problem with people reading the Bible; it's unauthorized versions of the Bible she objected to.
Incidentally, the man who invented printing was Johann Gutenberg. He was a Catholic. The first book he printed was the Vulgate Bible.
The Catholic bashers, along with those who hate Christianity in general, don't give a rat's rear for the facts.
They have their minds made up. Facts only infuriate them.
Regardless of the historical truth, they will remain, as ever, with their fingers in their ears, spewing their hate in between Gollum-like gasps of "We hates it! We hates it forever!"
That was the point that I was trying to express.
We see that same thing happening today, with today's liberal controlled media. How dare Fox News Network and the Internet question what they are telling the people!
By the way, I honor and respect today's Catholic Church. In many ways, we share similar beliefs and I have always enjoyed spending a Sunday with them.
The only time or place where this has happened was in southern France in the 13th Century, where there was an active and anti-Christian heresy called Albigensianism. The Albigenses read a corrupted version of the Bible in the local language. The prohibition was local, not universal, and lasted for about 50 years.
and printed or wrote those Bibles in a language the populace (those who could read in their own language) couldn't understand.
First off, prior to the 19th Century, anyone who was educated at all was educated in Latin, so that wasn't a language the educated populace "couldn't understand".
And both John Foxe and the foreword to the 1611 KJV admit that there were numerous translations of the Bible into English before the English Reformation. Other European languages were similar.
Its from the production number "The Inquisition" from Mel Brooks' "History of the World Part 1." 18 of the funniest minutes of film ever.
The only question I have is why there have to be multiple inquisition posts - a new one arising everytime someone reminds us that Rome tells it's side, then history provides us with another picture. Rome can't seem to tell the truth - and it's understandable. The truth paints them into a bad corner doctrinally. Thus as noted on the other threads, the history shows that Rome pushed, poked and prodded the civil authorities to give heresy the death penalty, and then strongarmed it's enforcement under threat of excommunication and heresy thereafter. Now Rome says, 'we didn't kill nobody, it was the fault of the civil authorities'. That's the stance in your postings time after time and it's in the Catholic encyclopedia, etc. It's a lie on it's face. Has nothing to do with whether anyone likes you or not, likes catholicism or not. Some of us are just sick of being lied to.
Any religious views which were not authorized by the official church of Rome, was harshly dealt with in Europe.
The world that we live in today, is vastly different from the world of Middle Ages.
This simple fact must always be remembered. You must never judge the people who lived in a different place and time, by using your values today.
They did the best that they could, according to their concepts of right and wrong.
This is a lie on it's face as attested to by Lateran IV and the prodding of the Pope that led to the Constitution of Lombardy.
I'll repost here:
We excommunicate and anathematize every heresy that raises against the holy, orthodox and Catholic faith which we have above explained; condemning all heretics under whatever names they may be known, for while they have different faces they are nevertheless bound to each other by their tails, since in all of them vanity is a common element. Those condemned, being handed over to the secular rulers of their bailiffs, let them be abandoned, to be punished with due justice, clerics being first degraded from their orders. As to the property of the condemned, if they are laymen, let it be confiscated; if clerics, let it be applied to the churches from which they received revenues. But those who are only suspected, due consideration being given to the nature of the suspicion and the character of the person, unless they prove their innocence by a proper defense, let them be anathematized and avoided by all 1-intil they have made suitable satisfaction; but if they have been under excommunication for one year, then let them be condemned as heretics. Secular authorities, whatever office they may hold, shall be admonished and induced and if necessary compelled by ecclesiastical censure, that as they wish to be esteemed and numbered among the faithful, so for the defense of the faith they ought publicly to take an oath that they will strive in good faith and to the best of their ability to exterminate in the territories subject to their jurisdiction all heretics pointed out by the Church; so that whenever anyone shall have assumed authority, whether spiritual or temporal, let him be bound to confirm this decree by oath. But if a temporal ruler, after having been requested and admonished by the Church, should neglect to cleanse his territory of this heretical foulness, let him be excommunicated by the metropolitan and the other bishops of the province. If he refuses to make satisfaction within a year, let the matter be made known to the supreme pontiff, that he may declare the ruler's vassals absolved from their allegiance and may offer the territory to be ruled lay Catholics, who on the extermination of the heretics may possess it without hindrance and preserve it in the purity of faith; the right, however, of the chief ruler is to be respected as long as he offers no obstacle in this matter and permits freedom of action. The same law is to be observed in regard to those who have no chief rulers (that is, are independent). Catholics who have girded themselves with the cross for the extermination of the heretics, shall enjoy the indulgences and privileges granted to those who go in defense of the Holy Land. 4th Lateran Council, Canon 3
This followed the stance of Lateran 3 and the arm twisting of the Pope to get the kings to declare heresy a capitol offense. It wasn't the idea of the kings; but, of the church. The Constitution of Lombardy was the answer of Germany to the Vatican's constant harping on the issue. Yet you guys sit there and act as though it were the other way around when your own documents belie it. And let us not forget, the church was putting people to death for their beliefs long before the office of inquisition opened for business. It wasn't exactly a new idea.
I believe the reference is to the mid-16th century war in the Netherlands, where the protestant Dutch revolted against the rule of Catholic Spain.
Thanks, you have supported what I was trying to say.
The historical myopia of some who post on the Freeper boards is dumbfounding. English and German Catholics were slaughtered in the MILLIONS by radical Protestants, who used the secular authorities to cover their crimes. Look it up!
English and German Catholics are STILL waiting for the Anglicans and Lutherans to return the churchs, relics, artwork, and real estate that they STOLE from the Catholic Church. And its been CENTURIES since these things were stolen. A truer example of "history is written by the victors" is hard to find.
We are one people. The slaughtering was a two way street & as was pointed out earlier, one must put actions into context of their historic times.
What gave the Catholic Church a rightful claim to ownership of the properties "stolen" by those who chose to remove themselves from the power of Rome? Did they not have any claim to the property, as it had been their ancestors who had "donated" it?
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