My undercover evening at a Wesley Clark for President meetup.

Tonight was different than most of my evenings. I've spend many evenings involved in political discussions, but this one was at a (Wesley) Clark for President meetup. I was in the belly of the beast. One non-FReeper friend met me there, but soon left saying that to stay would just be 'too painful.' Perhaps I should have followed him out the door.

But, I didn't. And here, to the best of my recollection is what transpired over the next two hours.

I had heard about the meeting tonight from an announcement in the local paper and since it was close by, I decided that I wanted to see who supports Wesley Clark and why. There was lots of good news for the ABC (anyonebutclark) people. Ranging from poor planning to poor turnout, the meeting in my estimation was less than successful although they were thrilled with the turnout.

The meeting was in the middle of the restaurant - not in a private room - which didn't allow for them showing a video that they brought. They made reservations for 20 people and had 9 people show up including me. This was there 3rd meeting in this area (Pittsburgh Metropolitan) and they were happy to have 9 people. (Sidebar - at our 2 Toomey meetups thus far, we have had 20 & 22 people). The people themselves were very friendly. There was a teacher, 2 lawyers, an HR manager, a retired chemist, and 2 or 3 homemakers among them.

When we introduced ourselves, they all were ecstatic about being able to vote for Clark. I, in the interest of (almost) full disclosure, told them that I wasn't committed to any candidate yet and wanted to see why Clark was their choice. I didn't go into more detail at that point. They were happy to have an opportunity to try to 'convert' me. Little did they know they my agenda was to highjack the meeting and to see if it was possible to convert them.

One man who was pretty serious about the whole thing kept trying to get them to move into talking about the tactics, strategy, and logistics of campaigning. I kept asking questions and moving them away from anything substantial.

They all thought that Clark was extremely intelligent and getting better at his responses. D'uh. He's had a lifetime and two months. Thrilled at doing so well on the Letterman Show, I deflated that balloon by telling that Letterman never asks hard questions.

They talked of the last two debates and were pleased that the 9 dwarves are not attacking each other, but going after Bush. I countered that they haven't distinquished themselves yet either or shown enough difference between them to make a decision. That's why I had such a hard time trying to decide between them .

I was asked if I would vote for Bush if I couldn't find an acceptable democrat or if I would sit out. My reply was that if I found none of them acceptable, I might vote 3rd party. They cringed at that, remembering the 2000 Florida election where Nader cost algore the race. (Except when Bush stole it) When the serious guy told me that sitting out or voting 3rd party was ineffective and tandamount to voting for the incumbent, I replied that my vote was too important to cast for someone or something that I didn't believe in. That warmed the cockles of their heart even if the didn't get me to say that I'd vote for anyone to get rid of Bush.

That was their main focus. I asked who their 2nd choice would be if Clark was no longer in the race. Almost in unison, the answer was ANY ONE just to get rid of Bush. They really hate the man. Many of you know that I have not been his biggest fan, but their hatred is almost pathological in it's intensity.

When they started to attack Bush on Iraq and repeated all of the talking points of the DNC, I couldn't take it any longer. I raised my voice and told them that I voted reluctantly for Bush because I couldn't stand algore and although I wasn't pleased with a lot of Bush's policies, he was, and is right on Iraq and the overseas WoT.

The one lady lawyer started with Bush stealing the election. I stopped her immediately and told her to read up on the Electoral College and she would understand how our system works. Besides, none of the recounts showed algore won. I think that I really took them by surprise, because I was quite adamant.

They started on our soldiers dying for Bush and oil and Halliburton, yada, yada, yada. I responded that the war was just and it was the right thing to do. They shut up pretty quick when I told them (it's true) that my God-child's husband was just killed there last month.

My work was almost done. One couple got up to leave and then everyone did. They never showed the video that they brought. They gave it to me in the hopes of winning me over. I left without blowing my cover. I must be a better actor than I thought.

In conclusion, I doubt that, without lobotomies, there is any hope of converting any of these people. They really believe the democrat crap. I was treated courteously throughout and although I wasn't totally honest with them, I tried not to outright lie either. I am unsure of who gets my vote next November.

One bright spot, when I mentioned Hillary, there was almost a spontaneous expression of hope that she would just go away. As a candidate, they all thought that she had too many negatives and drew the most intense reactions and that she could sink the democrats chances of taking back the White House.

Good work.

Lately, we have had the good news on our side inspite of the left wing controlled media. The left is losing around the world and here.

Re: The Tipping Point(.."The Left Will Lose It's War On America..")

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1031955/posts

The Tipping Point(.."The Left Will Lose It's War On America..")
Mens News Daily ^ | Dec 2, 2003 | Bruce Walker

Posted on 12/01/2003 5:31 PM PST by faludeh_shirazi

The Tipping Point
December 02, 2003 MND Bruce Walker

Free Iran at ActivistChat.com
Wars have a tipping point when one side realizes that it will, inevitably, lose. In 1918, the unbeaten German Army in France and Belgian saw that the flow of fresh troops from America made ultimate defeat certain. In 1990, when the Berlin Wall was torn down, the ultimate collapse of the Soviet Empire was inevitable.

Leftism has reached the same tipping point: the Left will lose its war on America and ordered liberty. There is no specific event - no Battle of Midway or Siege of Yorktown - which precisely defines the coming collapse of Leftism, but a cluster of trends all point in the same direction.

Leftists pined for another Great Depression in America, which, they hoped, would bring back the good old days of soup lines and socialist rabble rousers. But the economy is growing at the fastest rate in two decades. This insures the reelection of President Bush, but it causes Leftists other problems as well.

Sanctimonious whining about the federal deficit, which never once concerned Leftists when the welfare state was being created, look increasingly silly as the engine of economic recovery produces much greater federal tax revenues. In the 2004 campaign, honest economic analysts will be able to project surpluses during the second term of President Bush.

Leftists invented the politics of personal destruction. They have used this tactic not only against politicians but against anyone who stands in their way, but it no longer works - and everyone sees that it no longer works.

Rush Limbaugh, hit with a double whammy in a single week, is back on the air and very popular. The risible concern expressed about Mel Gibson’s production of a film which simply reflects the honest beliefs of Christians about the death of Jesus failed to concern serious people and will insure a bigger audience for The Passion.

Katherine Harris is now Congresswoman Harris and a member of the leadership of the majority party in Congress. Newt Gingrich is a frequent and respected commentator on conservative news programs. Senator Carnahan, by contrast, is now citizen Carnahan. Governor Davis is now citizen Davis.

Most important, the shrill hatred of President Bush, whose personal popularity has been higher than any president in the history of modern polling, shows the Lilliputian size of the Left. Conservatives and other normal people look at Leftist whining about President Bush’s surprise Thanksgiving visit to our troops in combat zones with a combination of bafflement and contempt.

Leftists attackers now find themselves the attacked. The LA Times-Democrat and the New York Times-Democrat double teamed Governor Schwarzenegger several days before the recall election. Their sneaky slanders did not hurt him, but the LA Times-Democrat lost subscribers it could ill afford to lose and the New York Times-Democrat added its lies about a pro-Nazi Schwarzenegger to its ghastly incompetence in the Jason Blair fiasco.

CBS was forced to scratch The Reagans because the network grossly underestimated the intensity and organization of a very broad, connected and informed conservative majority in America. Books like Bias show Leftism is bankrupt and dishonest.

Academia is facing increasing scrutiny and ridicule as its absurd, surreal hatred of all things good about America becomes more and more commonly understood. The salient fact in this area: students are much more conservative than their faculty and much less willing to be cowed into submission.

The political landscape has changed as well. The Republican Party is now, unquestionably, the majority party in America. Men who once were listened to in the Democrat Party - Ed Koch, Zell Miller, and Andrew Cuomo - now throw up their hands in frustration at a political party that weighs the political consequences of fighting terrorism.

The picture around the world looks even bleaker for Leftists. When President Bush is reelected, the evolution of Iraq into a tolerant nation of ordered liberty is assured. The mullahs of Iran will lose power and be replaced, inevitably, by secular and pro-American leaders. The changes in these two nations will not just transform the Middle East, but Islam itself.

Castro will die soon, and Cuba will live again. Germany will soon have a political party sympathetic, rather than unsympathetic, to our goals. Revelations that the ruling Social Democrat Party was infested with Stasi spies and the sleazy way in which Schroeder won his last election will mean that the next Chancellor of Germany will want to mend relations with America quickly.

Everything points in the same direction: the outcome of the war between Leftism and ordered liberty is certain. Conservatives and other normal people will win this war. Marxists, Fascists, Socialists, Nazis, Islamic totalitarians and other Leftists will lose. As that fact becomes clearer, the orderly retreat of the Left will become a rout.

Dane, you need to study the AWB more. It's not about automatic machine guns. In the name of incrementalism, you are being lured into standing on the opposition's ground and using their selling points.

There are principles so deeply woven into the fabric of liberty that you cannot violate them without ripping the entire pattern. For me, the 2nd amendment and abortion are the two lines in the sand. I will not vote for any candidate that waivers on either issue.

It's not about beating chests, any more than what Patrick Henry said and did was about beating chests. The basic issues and similarities in principle between then and now are remarkably similar. The continued assault upon those principles is already shredding our way of life and our freedom, its just being done in a way that most people will notrecognize it until it all falls apart IMHO.

I'm 100% with Ray on this.

Best Fregards.

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