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Terri's Fight - (Daily Thread/Updates) November 14-18
Various
| November 14, 2003
| sweetliberty
Posted on 11/14/2003 2:06:57 AM PST by sweetliberty
(Thread 8 - November 14-18) .
Link back to thread 7 (Nov. 11-14)
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Contained in Thread 7:
Radio interview with one of Michael's ex-girlfriends, transcript from CBS News Sunday Morning - Sunday 11-09-03 (Martha Teischner reports over a series of pre-recorded video clips in this news magazine's lead story...), possible link to collusion in the legal proceedings involving attorney George Felos (representing Michael Schiavo) and the neurologist Dr. Peter Bambakidis (court appointed, independent, examining physician), information on Judge Greer not being a judge, Tiger Bay Club Schiavo Debate Info, Michael Schiavo charged with perjured testimony, Michael Schiavo is this month's "black boot" award winner from conspiracyworld.com, Schiavo case timeline and 2 informative letters to Gov. Bush.
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Ckick on pic for Terri's website
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This thread serves as a place for posting all new general information and references, along with links following Terri's case, plus information on cable news and talk radio shows dealing with the issue, court cases and press releases. This is also the place to post contact information, prayers and general discussion.
If you have something that qualifies as BREAKING NEWS or FRONT PAGE NEWS, please post it on a separate thread in that category in order to give it maximum exposure and then post a link to the article/thread here so that it will be included in the next update of links. Also, if you post links to articles from original sources and there is also a thread on FR, please link to the FR thread. Many original links become corrupt over time and we want to be able to access the information at will.
ATTENTION friends of Terri! I have been asked by the folks in Florida to post the following message:
PLEASE HONOR THIS REQUEST FROM TAMPA BAY, FLORIDA: DO NOT PUT NAME AND TOWN or other personal info of TERRI VOLUNTEERS in public posts on the Terri threads. If in doubt, DELETE THEIR NAME OUT!!! Please do not post personal addresses and phone #s, towns re: Terri's volunteers and her family. PLEASE SEND PEOPLE TO terrisfight.org for the Foundation Address. Thanks.
Many thanks to all of you who are helping keep FReepers and others up to date with information and for all your efforts in making this thread work. All the research, transcripts, prayers and contact information are invaluable. Special thanks to Calpernia for the header graphic.
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Latest threads on Terri's Case:
Terri Schiavo, life insurance, and insurers duty to cancel if beneficiary is trying to kill insured
Governor Sidetracks Schiavo 's Lawsuit
Oregon Bishop Speaks Out in the Case of Terri Schiavo
A thousand words about the Terri Schiavo you never knew
Florida governor, lawmakers defend 'Terri's Law'
Schiavo's case is really about religious right
Roy Moore:Media 'will not print the truth' (While this article isn't only about Terri, Judge Moore does address the issue in this interview)
Remove Dennis Kucinich's Feeding Tube! (Terry Schiavo's Case By Ann Coulter!)
TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: attorneyfromhell; buttout; cultureofdeath; daily; euthanasia; florida; forcesofevil; georgefelos; guardianfromhell; hino; merchantsofdeath; michaelschiavo; righttolife; schiavo; schiavothread; schindler; terri; terrischiavo; terrischindler
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To: Saundra Duffy; Snykerz; nicmarlo; KDubRN; lonevoice; pickyourpoison; Theodore R.; pc93; ...
PLEASE NOTE!Schindler's are on Hannity and Colmes TONIGHT!
SHOW STARTS IN APPROXIMATELY TEN MINUTES!
PRAY FOR CLARITY AND TRUTH TO PREVAIL!
PRAY THAT HEARTS ARE TOUCHED!
PRAY THAT PEOPLE ARE MOTIVATED TO ACT!
Please pass this on!
To: Republic
See original as there are links in it:
Is Wife-icide Legal in Florida?
by Reason McLucus
originally published at Mediard.com
In most states a husband who killed his wife to inherit money and to be able to marry his new lover without the costs of divorce would be imprisoned for murder. A Florida man is attempting to avoid that fate by persuading a state judge to order his wifes death.
Conviction for murder normally requires the prosecution to prove means, motive and opportunity. Inheritance and dumping a spouse for a new lover without the costs of divorce are common motives for murdering a spouse.
Means refers to the method used. Normally a spouse must have access to a weapon capable of causing death. The weapon might be a gun, knife, poison, etc. In rare cases a would be killer may be able to take advantage of a victimss allergy or arrange what appears to be an accident for the victim..
Opportunity means being able to use the weapon, particularly using the weapon without the presence of witnesses. Opportunity can also mean being able to use the weapon in a way that doesnt arouse suspicion or appears to be legal, for example being able to claim self defense. In the latter case a prosecutor would have to prove the killing was really illegal, for example by disproving the self defense claim.
Michael Schiavos current effort to have the court order his wife Terri Schiavo killed could be described as legalized murder. A court order to have doctors kill his wife through starvation could exempt him from a murder charge even though he has motive(an inheritance and divorce without a property settlement or alimony), means(Terri cannot obtain food or fluids without assistance) and opportunity(a court order). Or, maybe not.
Michael Schiavo has a very capable attorney helping him get a court order to kill his wife. However, he should really consult with a good criminal defense attorney before continuing his efforts. The arguments that Terri is already essentially dead or brain dead could hurt him in a criminal murder case.
Michael could be vulnerable if a prosecutor could convince a court that he caused the condition that rendered her brain dead. The fact that a court ordered her feeding tube removed to completely end her life wouldnt help Michael if he were charged with murder. The question would be whether he caused the condition that resulted in her death.
An attempt by him to argue that she died as a result of the court order would automatically make him guilty of killing his wife by lying to the court about her condition.
There is no statute of limitations on murder. This fact could potentially be interpreted to also mean that there is no limitation on the amount of time elapsing between the act that causes a death and the actual issuance of a death certificate stating that the body is completely dead.
The farther back Michael placed Terris brain death the worse he would be as a defendant in a murder case. An early death only recently discovered by the prosecution would help explain to the jury why the case was being filed to long after the death.
Michaels attorneys in the suit against the hospital argued that a potassium deficiency caused Terri to have a heart attack that in turned caused brain damage. There was no evidence of any such deficiency. As often happens in malpractice suits, the plaintiff won because the hospital failed to use a test that could have indicated whether a specified condition existed or not.
Dr. Michael Baden, chief pathologist for the City of New York and director of the New York State Police Forensic Sciences Unit, questioned the claim of a potassium deficiency in an interview by Greta van Susteren. He said such a situation would be very unusual. He suggested a physical trauma such as a beating provided a more likely explanation. He cited a bone scan indicating a head injury and other bone injuries.
On a subsequent episode, Schindler(Terris family) family attorney Pat Anderson stated that a doctor who examined Terri when she arrived at the hospital stated she had rigidity of the neck consistent with strangulation. The Schindlers learned about the possible bone injuries and neck rigidity in a 1998 evidentiary hearing.
Anderson also mentioned that during the day before Terri ended up in the hospital she had told a friend that Michael had been upset with her because he claimed she spent too much at the beauty salon. Terri dismissed the friends offer to come over saying she would pretend to be asleep when Michael came home and that would prevent a problem.. Terri had discussed divorcing Michael with her friend even though Terri is Catholic.
Michael had an advantage in the malpractice suit against the hospital because of potential juror sentiment sympathetic to his wifes condition and turned off by the impersonal hospital. The fact that the money comes from the insurance company in a malpractice suit often works in the plaintiffs favor. The jury awarded him $300,000 for his loss due to her condition and $750,000 that was supposed to be put in trust for her rehabilitation.
In a criminal case any sentiment is with the victim. A criminal jury might see an attempt to claim a very unusual potassium deficiency as a desperation move by a guilty individual.
Michaels behavior after winning the malpractice award could increase the likelihood of a conviction. For example, he told a doctor not to attempt to treat a potentially fatal kidney infection.
The prosecution could call various of the nurses who treated Terri to testify that Michael wanted her dead and talked about becoming rich if Terri died. Jeff Johnson quotes various nurses in the following article discussing Michaels efforts to prevent his wife from receiving therapy. The nurses also claim that he ignored progress Terri was making and kept their observations from becoming part of her medical record.
In a subsequent article Johnson quotes Carla Sauer Iyer, a Licensed Practical Nurse(LPN) saying that on at least five occasions Michael had gone in to visit his wife alone and after he left Iyer would discover that Terris sugar level was so dangerously low that Iyer would have to administer dextrose to Terri to bring the level back up.
Michaels efforts to discourage any therapy after the malpractice award could be particularly damaging to his case because he was willing to pursue therapy before the lawsuit when health insurance was paying for the therapy. The size of the award was due in part to his statements that he expected Terri to live for many more years. The prosecution could argue that the settlement provided him with a motive for wanting her dead.
Michael probably doesnt have to worry about being prosecuted for assault or anything else so long as Terri is alive. The length of time since Terri arrived at the hospital probably precludes prosecution for assault even if Terri eventually can tell the police he attacked her. Claims that he might have attempted to poison her would be difficult to prove because of a lack of evidence.
Her death would provide the opportunity for the prosecution to place all of these allegations in a framework suggesting a pattern of behavior consistent with domestic abuse and murder.
Prosecutors wouldnt need to charge Michael with murder immediately after Terris death. Prosecutors could take advantage of the lack of a statute of limitations on murder to wait to see if his second wife accused him of abuse.
Abusers seldom stop on their own. A man who abuses one wife will likely abuse another.
An allegation of abuse by a second wife would provide evidence of a pattern that prosecutors could use to strengthen a charge of murdering his first wive.
Michael Schiavos attempt to end the life of his wife Terri could be the worst thing he could do. He has very little to gain from her death. Most of her money has been spent on attorneys. He could probably get her family to support a divorce without making a claim for alimony or anything else on her behalf. The Schindlers would be glad to insure that she wouldnt be killed.
He has little risk of prosecution for anything as long as Terri is alive. If she recovers he is off the hook because her death at some point in the future would likely be from some other cause.
Terris death potentially opens Michael to a murder charge. Prosecution might occur immediately after her death or it could occur at some indefinite time in the future. Why is he taking the risk of trying to end his wifes life?
Florida needs to change its procedures in cases of potential abuse if it hasnt done so since Terri Schiavo arrived at the hospital. The observation of the rigidity of her neck should have caused the hospital to immediately notify the police. Hospital personnel dont have the training to investigate potential abuse. The police do. The police can only do their job if they are notified in a timely manner.
Florida should also change court procedures so that money awarded in civil cases for treatment can only be used for that purpose. If the patient dies before the money is spent it should return to the defendant or go to an organization to treat others like the patient.
email:
reasonmclucus@netscape.net I have no objections to someone posting this essay on another web site provided by name is included as the author and there is a notation that it was originally published at Mediard.com.
942
posted on
11/17/2003 5:51:26 PM PST
by
pc93
(Please visit http://bellsouthpwp.net/p/c/pc93/terri_schindler_life_ribbon_campaign.htm)
To: sweetliberty
"fractured ribs from CPR"
I know the paramedics gave her an IV, but I was wondering if we know for sure that she received CPR. Was she already breathing on her own when the paramedics arrived, did they administer CPR, or did they administer oxygen only?
To: floriduh voter
Of course day-late is on the 'other team'. That is very obvious.
He/she is probably a young attorney on Felso's team.
Maybe if no one answered his post....he'd go away.
944
posted on
11/17/2003 5:52:18 PM PST
by
mickie
To: FR_addict
I don't know if CPR was administered. I was just looking for possible alternative explantions for any of the injuries.
945
posted on
11/17/2003 5:54:28 PM PST
by
sweetliberty
("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
To: Theodore R.
None of them act like republican's. They need to get out of those positions and put a real Republican in their spots. Seems McCabe won't even cross them.
The sherriff thinks Greer's Mr. Wonderful,
The voters need to bounce the whole bunch of em.
To: Republic
I hope it's coming up next hour because it's been on an hour here and nothing about Terri.
In the meantime I found this older article which I hadn't seen here:
Link to article with excerpt below
"Terri's parents first claimed Michael wanted control over the remainder of Terri's $700,000 medical fund, won in a malpractice lawsuit. They said he wanted to get rid of his wife so he could marry his girlfriend. He has been with her for eight years and they have one child and another on the way.
"But now there is no money left in that fund and Schiavo has rejected their offers to pay him to go away.
"The Schindlers' latest allegations are much darker. But the Florida courts and law enforcement have found no truth to their claims that Terri's brain damage was the result of Michael trying to kill her."
With a picture to caption:
"Michael Schiavo, husband of Terri Schiavo, left, and his attorney George Felos, right, leave the federal courthouse Friday in Tampa, Fla., after U.S. District Judge Richard A. Lazzara declined to block the removal of a feeding tube keeping his severley brain-damaged wife alive. Lazzara said he had no jurisdiction in the case."
Dated October 12, 2003
947
posted on
11/17/2003 6:00:20 PM PST
by
Aliska
To: Republic
bttt
To: nicmarlo
Have the parents already been on H/C? All they are talking about is guess who?
To: Aliska
The Hannity and Colmes show is making us sit through Scott Petersen's case first. I'm sorry about Laci and the baby, but the media is going way overboard on the coverage. We can't help Laci, but we can help determine what happens to Terri. Terri is a much more important story and may affect future legislation on the disabled.
To: Aliska; Budge; Pegita; cyn; Ladysmith; Calpernia; Babalu; floriduh voter; dandelion; ...
951
posted on
11/17/2003 6:17:25 PM PST
by
sweetliberty
("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
To: Aliska
At the begining of the Hannity and Colmes show-they ran thru the segments that would be on-Peterson,Rush,Hillary and then the Schindlers.
I am guessing they consider this story (Terri's fight) important because they gave long teasers about it in the past couple of hours and are apparently putting the segment on last.
How I hope we can discuss this later-our input might help the Schindlers as they begin to open up more and more to the public. Hopefully-they are losing their fear of that vampire, MS and his mentor-dracula himself.
To: FR_addict
Was she already breathing on her own when the paramedics arrived, did they administer CPR, or did they administer oxygen only?
She was gurgling
953
posted on
11/17/2003 6:20:53 PM PST
by
KDubRN
To: CindyDawg
Not yet........coming up.
To: CindyDawg
I don't know who asked, but MS went to St. petersburg Junior College for RN license
955
posted on
11/17/2003 6:22:49 PM PST
by
KDubRN
To: X-FID
Are you here??
956
posted on
11/17/2003 6:23:23 PM PST
by
Lovergirl
(Her name is Terri Schindler and she's alive. www.terrisfight.org)
To: pc93
Your post #492----WHAT AN ARTICLE! Just wish I could send it on to Michael the vampire Schiavo! The author provides an angle I had never considered. What a chilling statement this entire essay is upon MS....and he deserves every word.
To: KDubRN
Not me. I just asked a few days ago if you and DL were nurse.
To: nicmarlo; Republic
If any of you can tell us what's being said on H&C, those of us who don't own TV's would appreciate it. :-)
959
posted on
11/17/2003 6:31:57 PM PST
by
lonevoice
(Legal disclaimer: The above is MY OPINION)
To: CindyDawg; pc93; cyn; sweetliberty; floriduh voter; pollywog; FR_addict
Oooops....I meant above to inform all to NOT MISS post
#942It is an amazing article-a very severe take on MS and his pathetic motives and consequences thereof.
Dont' miss this one! Pass it on!
Appears the Schindlers will be on Hannity and Colmes in the last segment(s). Hated having to listen to the crap about hillary-she is a vampire, too!
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