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Medical Experts Contend Schiavo Won't `Feel A Thing'
Tampa Bay Online News ^ | 10-16-03 | DAVID SOMMER

Posted on 10/16/2003 4:51:52 PM PDT by MarMema

PINELLAS PARK - Even if Terri Schiavo does experience hunger, medical protocol calls for pain medication to keep her comfortable during her last days, experts said Wednesday.

As with every other issue surrounding the more than 5- year-old legal fight over the 39- year-old woman's fate, the two sides disagree on what will happen now that her feeding tube has been removed.

Bob and Mary Schindler contend their daughter is in for a protracted and agonizing death. Their attorney, Pat Anderson, has repeatedly referred to it as starvation, execution and state-sanctioned murder in court arguments.

Schiavo's husband, Michael, contends his wife has felt no sensation since January 1990, when sudden and still-unexplained heart failure cut off blood flow to her brain.

A majority of doctors who have examined Schiavo have concluded that most of her brain has died, leaving her in what is known as a persistent vegetative state. She feels, sees and hears nothing and what appear to be responsive facial expressions and vocalizations are reflexive behavior and not communication, most doctors say.

Peggy Guin, a nursing instructor at Shands Hospital at the University of Florida, said her experience with patients taken off feeding tubes shows that even those who can feel pain do not, because of preventive medication.

Studies have shown that as people get closer to death, they lose any sense of hunger, Guin said. Still, she said, the one- to two-week process can be tough on loved ones.

Family members get very disturbed when their dying relatives do not want to eat,'' she said.

Because it is impossible to be sure a dying patient does not feel hunger pangs, pain medicine is provided to people who have been taken off feeding tubes, Guin said.

Removal of feeding tubes is a common practice that became accepted after thorough debate by medical ethicists, said Kenneth Goodman, director of bioethics at the University of Miami School of Medicine and a co-director of the Florida Bioethics Network.

Soon after nourishment is denied to the brain, it begins producing chemicals that act as a natural anesthetic, the professor said.

She is not going to feel a thing,'' Goodman said. The artificial pain medication that Schiavo will receive ``is to make sure that if there is [pain] it is adequately handled,'' he said.

There is nothing unusual about terminating hydration and nutrition,'' Goodman said. ``The reason why Florida law allows it, and the other 49 states allow it, is obviously that this can be done in a way that is pain-free and dignified. That is why it is legal.''

Guin said Schiavo's caregivers have an obligation to take steps to keep her comfortable as she is dying.

At first, Schiavo will display a decrease in activities such as yawning or swallowing, Guin said. Then, her kidneys will gradually shut down and her breathing and heartbeat may become irregular.

She will likely lose weight and her lips and mouth will become dry while her skin becomes taut, Guin said.

To counter that, caregivers should coat Schiavo's lips with balm and change her position frequently to prevent bedsores, Guin said.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; euthanasia; schiavo; terrischiavo
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To: HuntsvilleTxVeteran
Good suggestions!

Terri would have brain waves since she tries to communicate!
41 posted on 10/16/2003 5:30:00 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: EggsAckley
We've become a nation of "health" elitists. If we can't jog or ride a bike, or climb a cliff, or pump iron, then we just aren't worthy

I don't know. I was thinking of revenue-producers. God help those who cannot work and pay taxes. Especially if they have a working liver.

42 posted on 10/16/2003 5:31:25 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
Annulments can only be sought by the parties who are married.

So far, the church has not spoken on this.........so it will be interesting to see what is said.

43 posted on 10/16/2003 5:31:39 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: friendly
These are the same "medical experts" who claim that in utero children experience no pain or other sensations, especially when they are being brutally murdered by the abortionists.

Exactly right. Remember the "experts" recently who denied that babies can smile in the womb -- even when confronted with ultrasound pictures showing precisely the contrary?

44 posted on 10/16/2003 5:32:19 PM PDT by shhrubbery!
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To: shhrubbery!
Marcia Gray and I think Tony Bland, made it the entire two weeks, though. As I recall.
45 posted on 10/16/2003 5:32:33 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
**Why didn't Terri's parents seek an annullment from the church, then they could be her legal guardians?**

You have a good idea, however, because Michael is a husband in name only.

God will not judge him lightly.
46 posted on 10/16/2003 5:32:45 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: EggsAckley
They refer to her as if she was some aging cat or dog that is being "put to sleep."

Actually, what we can do for our beloved pets is vastly more humane than what the above article describes. I am someone who potentially could be persuaded that euthanasia should be made legal. However, if one really believes in euthanasia, removing food and water, and allowing a person to just waste away is the coward's way to do it. It also seems extremely cruel, if not to the patient, then certainly to the family. If you let the patient just waste away, no single individual has to give the lethal injection. As I said, that's the coward's way out.

47 posted on 10/16/2003 5:32:58 PM PDT by Wolfstar (NO SECURITY = NO ECONOMY)
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To: shhrubbery!
There are some good expert stories here.
48 posted on 10/16/2003 5:33:44 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: MarMema
ok im gonna sound like the insensitive idiot here but this whole terri situation i know nothing about..whats goin on?
49 posted on 10/16/2003 5:35:04 PM PDT by MetalHeadConservative35 (DeathscytheX was old...i needed a change and so here i am)
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To: shhrubbery!
These are the same "medical experts" who claim that in utero children experience no pain or other sensations, especially when they are being brutally murdered by the abortionists. Exactly right. Remember the "experts" recently who denied that babies can smile in the womb -- even when confronted with ultrasound pictures showing precisely the contrary?

There is nothing more beautiful than the new 3D technology that permits us to see children in the uterus smiling, laughing, sobbing, and playing!!

50 posted on 10/16/2003 5:36:10 PM PDT by friendly (Man is so made that whenever anything fires his soul, impossibilities vanish.)
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To: MetalHeadConservative35
The right to die movement has made it legal to euthanize people who are brain damaged, not in a coma, by allowing a surrogate to stand in and state on their behalf that they would not want to live "like that".

So we have gone from taking comatose people from ventilators to removing feeding tubes from brain-damamged but responsive and even speaking people, who often could eat on their own or were never allowed to try.

You can learn more on my FR page. Try The Starving of Hugh Finn for an opening story.

51 posted on 10/16/2003 5:38:39 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: MarMema
Thanks for the link!

I was trying to remember the case of Nancy Klein -- I remembered the case, actually, but couldn't remember her name.

Sadly, Nancy's husband Martin went to court to force an abortion of her unborn child -- all in the name of helping her get 'better.'

Whether the abortion helped or not is questionable; but her "concerned husband" Martin Klein divorced Nancy almost immediately after his court victory forcing the abortion.

I wonder how she is doing today.

52 posted on 10/16/2003 5:40:36 PM PDT by shhrubbery!
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To: MetalHeadConservative35
A good historical study-overview is here.
53 posted on 10/16/2003 5:41:28 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: Wolfstar
What we can do for our beloved pets is vastly more humane than what the above article describes. I am someone who potentially could be persuaded that euthanasia should be made legal. However, if one really believes in euthanasia, removing food and water, and allowing a person to just waste away is the coward's way to do it. It also seems extremely cruel, if not to the patient, then certainly to the family. If you let the patient just waste away, no single individual has to give the lethal injection. As I said, that's the coward's way out.

It is against the law to treat animals this way!!!

A vet would lose his/her licence if they treated a dog with intentional slow starvation.

There would also be far more more media attention if this young woman were a chicken or a cow, with PETA screaming how inhumane this brutal murder was.

54 posted on 10/16/2003 5:42:43 PM PDT by friendly (Man is so made that whenever anything fires his soul, impossibilities vanish.)
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To: syriacus; trustandobey; nickcarraway; iowamomforfreedom; Pegita; katnip; FormerLib; Libertina
ping
55 posted on 10/16/2003 5:45:24 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: MagnoliaMS
Maybe I don't know enough, sorry. I made that reasonable assumption because of the numerous "experts" who said she was. Did they not do a EEG on her?

As for my loved ones...that's exactly why I have a "do not recusitate" document...to alleviate them from the continueing sorrow and yes, COSTS, to keep my vegetative cells functioning. I would prefer them to grieve shortly than perpetually, and get on their lives.

BTW, what organ does the soul reside in?

56 posted on 10/16/2003 5:51:50 PM PDT by A Navy Vet (government is the problem, not the solution!)
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To: ItisaReligionofPeace
It reminds me of a recent ruling by the British Medical Authorities, to require anesthetic for in utero babies being killed because 'they may feel pain'. The shuckin' and jivin' is getting deep, folks. The death cult seeks to rule.
57 posted on 10/16/2003 5:54:01 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: MHGinTN
to require anesthetic for in utero babies being killed

Now there is another inconsistency to beat the band.

58 posted on 10/16/2003 5:55:07 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: A Navy Vet
what organ does the soul reside in?

The heart if you are Eastern Orthodox.

59 posted on 10/16/2003 5:55:41 PM PDT by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: MarMema
On another website, I was chastised for pointing out that in Florida and all across this nation, currently--but that may be changing soon--it is homicide to starve a crib-bound infant to death. One poster even quoted with approval the euthansia related assertions of Peter Sanger. Sadly, there is a growing body of cold, heartless/soulless citizens ready to embrace the putting down of fellow human beings, especially if someone else can gain from the behavior!
60 posted on 10/16/2003 5:59:31 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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