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Time To Engage God's (America's) Enemies
Ths Holy Spirit of God | October 16, Year of Our Lord 2003 | Gargantua

Posted on 10/16/2003 7:34:12 AM PDT by Gargantua

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To: biblewonk
What part of it is so astounding the existance of God or the idea of the United States being under Him?

It is astounding that you accuse me of being a non believer.

And the truth is, it is rather astounding that there is a God. The proof that he exists is overwhelming to me, but it's hard to imagine why he lets things get like they are. But that for another thread.

As to the United States having some special blessing from God which other countries don't have is rather un-biblical. But you should know that, being a wonk and all that.

41 posted on 10/16/2003 10:39:21 AM PDT by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: jimt
"While there certainly our [are] people who reject God, this claim of God being removed from people's lives is alarmist at best."

The greatest trick Satan ever performed was to convince the secular World that he didn't exist, and that they weren't in fact doing his bidding.

Choose this day whom you will serve.

;-/

42 posted on 10/16/2003 10:39:31 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: Gargantua
"whose Word provided the founding of America"

Actually, America's founding was more based on pilgrims escaping European religious theocracies than it was on God's word. I.E. People trying to get away from others like yourself who are hellbent on imposing/forcing your beliefs and morality onto them.

America's political system has more roots in the English parliamentary system and ancient Greek society than anything in the Bible (which doesn't seem to have many formulas for how to establish a gov't, but is better at telling people a good recipe on how to best live their lives), as well as our judicial system.

Every single civilized society makes the killing of, and stealing from, others a crime, regardless of whether their majority faiths hold the 10 Commandments in the same regard Christians/Jews do, so the "10 Commandments are our foundation" argument is straw-man. I mean, other than Murder and Stealing, there are no laws that I'm aware of that dealing with obeying parents, coveting thy neighor's ass or neighbor's wife's ass, etc. The Blue Laws of some states certainly force those citizens to keep Holy the Lord' Day, I guess.
43 posted on 10/16/2003 10:43:01 AM PDT by Blzbba
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To: exmarine
This nation is on a moral freefall like the world has never seen.

Nonsense. History check needed.

It's in a moral freefall and it's nothing new.

44 posted on 10/16/2003 10:43:04 AM PDT by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: Protagoras
"...it's hard to imagine why he [God] lets things get like they are."

Hmmm...

Might it be because he blesses those who obey Him, and lets those who wish to keep their backs turned to Him? Indeed, could "things being like they are" be the result of people living with their backs turned to God?

If someone asks me "Where was God when I lost my job, my home and my family!?", I'm tempted to reply, "Most likely right where you left Him..."

;-/

45 posted on 10/16/2003 10:44:36 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: Protagoras
As to the United States having some special blessing from God which other countries don't have is rather un-biblical. But you should know that, being a wonk and all that.

OHHHHH, so it is the definition of what "under God" that we may see differently. I only saw that as saying that God is over the United States, not that we were his favorites or anything.

46 posted on 10/16/2003 10:44:52 AM PDT by biblewonk (Spose to be a Chrisssssssstian)
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To: tm22721
You are too late.

Most Americans now think for themselves.

or: "Most Americans have already been brainwashed enough to be incapable of thinking for themselves"

47 posted on 10/16/2003 10:46:29 AM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus (if we're not going to act like a constitutional republic...lets be the best empire we can be...)
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To: Gargantua
Might it be because he blesses those who obey Him, and lets those who wish to keep their backs turned to Him?

You mean like we have a choice? He gives us a choice?

Hmmmmmm,,,,,,

48 posted on 10/16/2003 10:47:08 AM PDT by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: jimt
You, on the other hand, are asking America to pay for your refusal to accept Jesus Christ.

49 posted on 10/16/2003 10:47:22 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: Gargantua
I am not calling for Govenment support of Christianity in this post

That's exactly what you're doing and you know it. You want a "Christian government" in which non-Christians will be second-class minorities. If a theocracy is such a good thing, why not just come out and say so?

50 posted on 10/16/2003 10:48:00 AM PDT by WackyKat
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To: jimt
You, on the other hand, are asking us to pay for advancing your viewpoint on Jesus Christ.

I don't care what the secular humanist anti-Christian liberals say about religious freedom. You and they need to argue with the founding fathers. Congress PAID for the printing of the first bible in 1782 and inside that bible it says, "For use of schools". They gave sermons at graduations, they paid for missionary trips to the indians, etc. etc. I don't care what your personal viewpoint is - history is on MY SIDE. The only people on YOUR SIDE are the revionists, the ACLU, and their ilk. And I will never be stopped from preaching the gospel IN PUBLIC.

So, history and you are at odds. Deal with it.

51 posted on 10/16/2003 10:49:39 AM PDT by exmarine
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To: Gargantua
"You, too, have chosen to attack the salad and ignore the steak."


Wow - I like this phrase! Mind if I use it elsewhere?
52 posted on 10/16/2003 10:50:44 AM PDT by Blzbba
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To: jimt
"You, on the other hand, are asking us to pay for advancing your viewpoint on Jesus Christ."

Really? Are you going to get a rebate on your taxes if the words "under God" are removed from the pledge? Of course not, and your argument is a silly little hissy-fit with nothing but hot air.

Conversely, do allAmericans pay a REAL price for societal and Government-enforced denial of God and Christ?

Take a look at the filth and scum around you. Need more proof? If you do, you are truly blind.

53 posted on 10/16/2003 10:51:56 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: biblewonk
I only saw that as saying that God is over the United States, not that we were his favorites or anything.

Oh, well better tell that to all the kids who are forced to recite it, they think it does. And it's not a bad assuption that it means that. They also take a lot of the other BS in it as the absolute truth.

Face it, it's a political propaganda piece. It has nothing whatsoever to do with God. In fact, his name being attached to it is probably sinful. Used to legitimize the other ideas there.

54 posted on 10/16/2003 10:52:26 AM PDT by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: Gargantua
You, on the other hand, are asking America to pay for your refusal to accept Jesus Christ.

That wins, hands-down, the presumptious, myopic statement of the day.

55 posted on 10/16/2003 10:52:34 AM PDT by Pahuanui (When a foolish man hears of the Tao, he laughs out loud)
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To: Protagoras
It's in a moral freefall and it's nothing new.

Do you like to quibble over crumbs? Okay, I'll bite. Moral freefalls are nothing new, but the USA was founded as a Christian nation, it was established by God Himself as attested by George Washington, the pilgrims, the puritans, Ben Franklin, and many others, and it is THE FIRST COUNTRY ever founded BY THE PEOPLE and FOR THE PEOPLE. So, in that sense, our freefall is unique as we have fallen the farthest of any nation in history (save for Israel).

56 posted on 10/16/2003 10:52:45 AM PDT by exmarine
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To: Gargantua
Do you live in Muslim Afghanistan? Or do you live in America, where it is "In God We Trust"?

I must say Gargantua...your enthusiasm, faith in God, and fevor for this country are genuine, noble, and a breath of fresh air.

But my friend...we live in a time where wrong is right, evil is good, selfish, cold, give-a-$hit kind of world that only God can change. I've said it before...either a Great Depression II or the WTC*10 will change this generation.

57 posted on 10/16/2003 10:55:40 AM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus (if we're not going to act like a constitutional republic...lets be the best empire we can be...)
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To: exmarine
From God's mouth to Washington's ears.
58 posted on 10/16/2003 10:56:53 AM PDT by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: WackyKat
I pray for the scales to be removed from your eyes... you see only what you want to see, and cannot see what is.

;-/

59 posted on 10/16/2003 10:57:40 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: Protagoras
So you think this is a nation under God?

I believe it was...but not anymore.

60 posted on 10/16/2003 10:57:40 AM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus (if we're not going to act like a constitutional republic...lets be the best empire we can be...)
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