We’ve seen the needle and the damage done: We understand that correlation is not causation; however, all these co-vax adjacent events do require serious consideration.

American Thinker ^ | 01/27/2022 | Anony Mee

[SeekAndFind]

Petulant Neil Young is trending in Memeville so it wasn’t a great leap to recall one of his best-known songs. Then other news I read today drove home the point.

Daniel Horowitz, tweeting as @RMConservative, wrote

I can share with you from attorney Thomas Renz that the number of cancer diagnoses in the military’s DMED system went from a 5-year average (2016-2020) of 38,700 per year to 114,645 in the first 11 months [later corrected to 10 months] of 2021. This is a predominately young population.

Unlike VAERS where the naysayers can suggest that anyone can submit, this is only by military doctors and quantifies every single ICD code in the military for tri care billing of Humana. This is the ultimate defined and finite population with excellent surveillance.

This represents a 355% increase over the most recent 5-year average. Appalling.

A short excerpt of Thomas Renz’s congressional testimony can be viewed here.

I’m not an anti-vaxxer. In fact, due to my years of travel I’ve been vaccinated against just about everything except anthrax and Japanese B encephalitis. Had the rabies series twice. I am an anti-co-vaxxer (not vetted well enough for my taste) and an anti-mandate-vaxxer (smaller government proponent) but to each his or her own.

Most of us are scientifically savvy enough to understand that correlation is not causation; however, all these co-vax adjacent events do require serious consideration.

Celeste McGovern wrote last month about data revealed in one of the first reports Pfizer released after losing its appeal to take 55 years to respond to a FOIA request. In it, there is information that 270 “unique pregnancies” were exposed to the vaccine. Out of the 32 pregnancies with a known outcome, 28 resulted in fetal death. She sought confirmation.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

Sometimes correlation signals causation.

[Boogieman]

“correlation is not causation”

Yet what is correlated may still be the causation, quite often is, and saying “correlation is not causation” doesn’t change that.

[TheDandyMan]

The two things that happened over the past couple years are — the vast majority of people were exposed to Covid, and, a fairly large majority of people got vaccinated. It seems impossible to me to necessarily blame one or the other in the short term. Many people seem to poohpooh the dangers of Covid while decrying the vaccines as the worst thing on earth — but if the spike proteins are to blame for the uptick in heart problems, who’s to say Covid doesn’t cause as much damage, or more, than the vaccines, considering that the spikes in the vaccines are “frozen” into a certain shape/configuration to make them less dangerous?

That’s my bottom line. In the short term, it’s impossible to know. It’s impossible to know if Covid causes heart damage in large numbers or not, it’s impossible to know whether the vaccines are safe long term or not. Well hopefully know in a decade.

If I weren’t morally opposed to the use of fetal cells, on balance, I think I’d risk taking the shot. Risk vs. reward. True, nobody can say for certain that vaccines don’t, say, cause an increased chance of cancer in 20 years. If someone is 21 and desperate to serve in the military, do they throw away that dream, or just cross their fingers and get on with it? I certainly wouldn’t fault the reasoning of a person in that position who, looking at the small pool of data that is available, decided to get vaccinated (risk) in order to serve in the military (reward).

[Worldtraveler once upon a time]

--- "We understand that correlation is not causation; however, all these co-vax adjacent events do require serious consideration."

It becomes an era in which slogans become truths, even when false.

Discussions with "correlation is not causation" should be countered with a legal notion, "preponderance of the evidence."

When few complaints in one year are followed with massive numbers of complaints in a next year, mouthing "correlation is not causation" is a meaningless exercise in word salad making.

Else, if "correlation is not causation" were always true, then no causes could be found, and certainly no search for causation could be mounted.

That is exactly how this phrase is being used, all too often.

The preponderance of the evidence is that "adverse reactions" far, far above previous years are being registered. To wave them away with a misused slogan is morally reprehensible.

[Bob434]

[[ it’s impossible to know whether the vaccines are safe long term or not ]]

Huh? When someone gets vaccinated and has never had covid, and suffers heart failure or damage, then it’s pretty obvious that the strong link to the heart damage is the vaccine, and not covid.

[GBA]

That’s an impressive jump in cancer cases.

If any other activity had such a “correlation”, no one would do it, eat it, drink it, smoke it and certainly not INJECT it into themselves again and again, right?!?

We’re still living with “safe and effective” now, but if or when that changes and “correlation” comes home to live with us, instead, someone’s gonna have some explaining to do.

[Seruzawa]

When looking for causation one first looks for correlations. It’s like the other canard used to silence people... anecdotal. All statistical data starts as anecdotal data. Enough anecdotes and enough correlations will lead one to the truth.

“All Soros prosecutors are enemies western civilization” stated as anecdotal data. And now one for one the anecdotes lead to correlation and eventually cause-effect. All Soros prosecutors are enemies. QED

[dead]

[Bob434]

[[Discussions with “correlation is not causation” should be countered with a legal notion, “preponderance of the evidence.”]]

Exactly- was just going to say similar. When there is enough anectdotal evidence suggesting that something may be caused by something else, then it becomes necessary to consider and investigate whether there is a correlation or not.

If 4 out of 40,000,000 people who chew bubbliscious gum get headaches, then likely the gum isn’t causing the issue. If however 4,000,000 get headaches only when they chew the gum, then it needs to be investigated as a possible source of the headaches, because there is a strong possibility that an ingredient in the gum is affecting people badly.

Question is, how many people have suffered heart issues due to the vax possibly? Is there a direct link? Given how serious an issue heart problems are, this should be investigated thoroughly to make sure- it can’t be written off by claiming correlation is not causation

[TheDandyMan]

The thing is, the vast majority of people have been exposed to Covid over the past couple years. It has been shown that many people are asymptomatic when they get it. There’s very few people can say for sure that they never had Covid.

If somebody gets vaccinated and drops dead of a heart attack 2 days later, even if they had Covid previously, it’s pretty difficult to suggest it’s just a coincidence — and that is definitely happening — but some apparently healthy people die from Covid as well. In both instances, it’s a small number, both definitely dying from Covid and definitely dying from vaccines, but it’s difficult to get a clear picture because everybody has an agenda at this point. All I can say is, there hasn’t been a mass die-off from any cause.

Again, if the spike proteins are to blame for organ damage, I can’t think of a reason why the spike proteins from catching Covid in the wild would be less damaging than those in the vaccines. If the organ damage is caused by some other aspect of the vaccines entirely, who knows — but the majority of concerns seem to be centered around the spike proteins clumping/collecting in organs and causing problems from there.

It’s entirely possible to my mind that Covid, and the vaccines, both cause problems due to the spike proteins, in which case essentially everyone is going to have to accept that we’ll all face a higher risk of cancer, organ failure, etc, than we did prior to Covid.

[ransomnote]

PING

[cuz1961]

“correlation is not causation”

/\

I’m so sick of this weasel phrase.

“correlation does not necessarily mean causation”

is the correct version.

Doesn’t mean it can’t.

To say a bullet fired by a moron named Baldwin ,

correlated to that women

(who was struck by said bullet)

dying ,

means that Baldwin didn’t kill that woman

cuz
“correlation is not causation”

is prima facie ABSURD.

.spit.

Don’t ever let ilk slide using this dodge and con.

Call them on it

EVERY time.

[Travis McGee]

[Boogieman]

True, if the spike proteins cause heart/circulatory damage, then the vaccines as well as the virus could both be causing the same issues. Indeed the data seems to suggest that.

However, for an increase in cancer rates, the spike protein would not seem to be a good fit for a culprit. We know the mechanism by which the spike protein can cause damage to blood vessels and tissues, and it’s simple mechanical damage, not likely to cause an increase in mutations or something like that where you would expect to see higher rates of cancer.

A much more likely culprit for increases in cancer rates would be immunological damage, specifically damage to the t-cells that naturally suppress cancers. And if you are looking for immunological damage, the common sense place to look first is at the medications whose stated intent is to interfere with the natural functioning of the immune system.

[Boogieman]

Yes, and by the same principle, when some normally healthy individual gets COVID and is never vaccinated, and suffers the same kind of heart damage (and this has happened quite a bit), then it would suggest the COVID is the culprit.

Both of those statements are true, and both of those situations have been happening. That’s why a lot of people are thinking the one common element to the vaccines and the virus, the spike protein, is the real culprit.

[Boogieman]

“I can’t think of a reason why the spike proteins from catching Covid in the wild would be less damaging than those in the vaccines.”

Well, I can think of at least one. The COVID spikes are attached to a virus, and so they go where the virus goes, instead of floating willy nilly around the bloodstream to end up who knows where. The virus has a goal, to infect specific tissues in the respiratory system so it can replicate and spread to others. The untethered spikes in the vaccine have no such goal or direction, and so they will go places the vaccine spikes will not tend to go.

[Bob434]

Agreed.

[BEJ]

Joe : You’re a blubbering idiot.

Neil: Okay so I am, maan. But the vax is good. Like Cowgirl in the Sand good.

Joe: Hey Hey, My My... the vax can make you die. (whispers, You blubbering idiot)

Neil: No Joe! I wrote 12,000 songs about the vax, so it’s gotta be good. It’s up there with down by the river I shot my baby...

Joe: You shot your brains out years ago. Look Neil, you don’t want people to have freedom and choice... You want your sugar mountain of drugs and the vax is just you licking Biden’s behind. And, NO, he’s not going to buy your catalog. Jill listens to Tommy James and Shondells... she worships them.

Neil: I was there with them on the harvest moon album. And Jack Nietzsche, my producer, said it’s the will to power... and that’s what I’ve been doing ever since. You can’t let the people go for a minute. And I have to dress up like an Indian to make them feel sorry and guilty and ashamed, so they buy my album. I’m a hoodlum. Look at my fedora hat... like Muggsy Malone... you dirty brother you shot my rat...

Joe: You talk gibberish way too much. So you and Biden believe white men are racists. What happened to peace, love, dove?

Neil: David Crosby destroyed that because he is so egotistical. Like I’m a Buddhist, so I keep my EGO in check.

Joe: Doesn’t mean SH!T. You’re denying freedom and going along with that fruitcake Biden. You’re going along with the MAAN! You are a dirty needle.

Neil : Thank you for that... but I still have manners... when I’m not berating my staff. Because I feel helpless, helpless, helpless...

Joe: Yeah, you and Biden are helpless alright. Helpless and hapless wanks.

Neil: I can teach you how to write a song. First, you have to become an emotional exhibitionist... sing like a whining snake making love to a pole cat or a cougar... do a pow wow dance so everybody feels Injun and real (whispers, except white men)... and then jump into a volcano. That’s how I do it, Joe.

Joe: How! Like, “HOW, white man!” (raises his hand) You are Chief snotty nose brat and Joe Biden is a phony Pony Soldier and you can lie to each other all you want... I’m done, you forked tongue Moccasin mouth.

Neil: Did you know my initials NY is like New York, like New York City? Did you know snotify took off my music, and OAC imitates Cortez the Killer because she come riding across the waters with her galleons and guns.

Joe: This is gibberish, Neil. How much drugs did you do in the 70s?

Neil: Did you know Trumped want me to play a song in his office? He wanted me to play Keep on Rockin in the Free World. And then Nancy Pelosi came out from under his desk and wanted to hear Powder Finger. And then I saw God in the heel of my shoe... and Trump rolled back the stone in his office and Jesus was in the tomb smoking a cigarette.

JOE: yeah, yeah yeah... freak!

[Svartalfiar]

Again, if the spike proteins are to blame for organ damage, I can’t think of a reason why the spike proteins from catching Covid in the wild would be less damaging than those in the vaccines.

For one thing, loose spike proteins / "vaccine" particles can get into places a full virus can't, causing issues there. Also, your cells expressing spike proteins means your immune system is being trained to attack and destroy your own cells. Not good. Sure, a wild virus isn't a good thing, but in the long term, playing with your body's software is probably worse.