Posted on 01/29/2021 1:50:31 AM PST by nickcarraway
Experts are warning that over-the-counter pain relievers such as Aspirin, Tylenol or ibuprofen could dull the effectiveness of coronavirus vaccines.
As the US continues to roll out vaccines from both Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna to the general public, recipients have reported minor side-effects like temporary pain that have driven some to take preventative over-the-counter painkillers before inoculation.
But several experts who spoke with ABC News Wednesday warn that this practice may hinder the body’s ability to form the antibodies that protect against COVID-19.
(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...
You assume everything they tell us is absolute truth.
Must be nice to have a simple, uncluttered view in the midst of all the chaos.
This is a man-made virus for which there is no cure (unless the Chinese give us one). It will eventually kill us all.
It will eventually infect us all. It could kill us all or most of us. I don’t know that it has that ability in its current form. Give it a couple of years of natural selection and maybe. There’s no telling what kind of mutations it might develop.
I won't take the vaccine, anyway.
LIAR. 41 million weren’t going to die of this fake pandemic! I won’t take it! What will you do about it?
EVERYTHING you cite is a lie or comes from dubious authoritarian sources. You act like you know what you’re talking about, like some kind of elitist. Well, we don’t believe you, and we won’t take your vaccine.
There are 2 million dead... Not 41 million. The only thing we need to fear and loathe... Are fear and loathing.
Unnecessary.
"41 million weren’t going to die of this fake pandemic!"
I showed my work. Do you take issue with the population count? The R0? The HIT calculation? The IFR? The rest is just math. I'm assuming you're okay with math.
"I won’t take it! What will you do about it?"
Laugh, the same way I would someone standing in the snow freezing because they refuse to give in and wear a coat. You make your own choices and you live with the consequences. No skin off my back. Me? I put on a coat when it's cold.
2.2 million confirmed dead so far. We're in the middle of the pandemic; not after the end of it. The numbers I gave are all well supported and linked to sources. The population of the Earth is not generally disputed. The R0 could be questioned somewhat because that's challenging to pin down precisely, but that's a matter of degrees rather than orders of magnitude. The IFR has been well documented for many months. It's slightly higher in some places and slightly lower in others, but overall that - again - is pretty much what it is. The rest is mathematics.
"The only thing we need to fear"
I never said we needed to fear anything. Quite the opposite. I think this calls for reasoned, measured responses based on factual information. I think the panic-inspired kneejerk reactions from governments around the globe will likely cause more lives in the end than the disease itself. But the disease certain did deserve a reasonable response. President Trump understood that and did his best to make it happen. The governors screwed it up for the rest of us.
Actually... Historical precedent indicates that we are at the end, or at least closer to the end... With or without the vaccine.
There was no vaccine for the Hong Kong flu (1 or 2 million deaths), the Asian flu (1 or 2 million deaths) or the the Spanish flu (50 to 100 million deaths). All of those had variants, and all of those lasted about a year or two and after that, they disappeared into oblivion just like Covid-19 will.
We’re not going to get to close to 41 million deaths, or even 5 million. As I stated originally... In the history of sicknesses that have plagued humankind, Covid-19 isn’t even significant with one exception... Social media and Socialist media outlets have overblown this flu to proportions never seen in the history of humankind, causing fear and loathing that will lead to millions of deaths from non-Covid illnesses and mental illnesses.
The good news, we were lucky. If this truly were a virus as deadly as the Spanish flu, there would likely be a billion dead by now. Quarantining the sick wasn’t even considered and it should have been the standard for dealing with this nonsense. If it had been, there would be far less death.
The IFR bothers me. A poster familiar with India convinced me on another thread that the denominator in India is off by at least an order of magnitude, if one uses actual infections vs. (under)reported infections. The numerator may be low too, but I'd think not as drastically. A check would be excess deaths from all causes, but I've not found that, for India, for 2020. In Indonesia, I doubt the reported data is worth a plugged nickel. Ditto for many other countries.
In the US, despite some possible irregularities high and low, the numerator is likely in the ballpark. But for the denominator CDC is estimating over 83 million infections from Feb. 1 - Dec. 31, 2020. Looking at the "RCFR" (resolved case fatality rate) we swing the other way: The number globally and for the US has been sitting at 3% for some time now. Of note, the US alone has over 10 million known* UNresolved cases out there, as I type this. Many of these 10 million strong group represent huge lags in the data. Anecdotal / personal evidence suggests to me a very significant portion of this group are cases lasting over a month due to complications, slow recoveries, and so on. I do not think (again from experience, and not just with COVID) that the fatality numbers from this group will be cheerful. Especially in over 65 y/o patients, attempted extended "recoveries" with numerous setbacks tend to not end well.)
All this makes me think that the "41 million fatalities" that you project is a much looser number than you postulate. IMO, without vaccines it could be under 20 million, but it also could well be 60 million. That said, neither 20 million or 60 million is a cheerful number, either. Those are World War type figures.
Nonsense. That's EXACTLY what we tried to do, early on, and still do, to considerable extent, but:
1) We, the USA, thank God, do not have remotely the sort of Surveillance State necessary to pull that off. South Korea, for example, does, and has.
2) How do you define "sick"? IMO, in discussing limiting spread of a very contagious virus, the only definition that counts is "contagious", which is, basically, anyone mildly or worse symptomatic. What, we are going to find and isolate everyone with a sniffle or sneeze until we can get them tested (by imperfect means)? How do we find them (different than what we did)? See "1".
Note that tens of millions of people HAVE been quarantined due to having symptoms and / or testing positive for COVID-19. My wife, daughter and I all were, until cleared by negative PCR test results for all of us. Sports teams, businesses, even schools in regions not heavily locked down have had to close down and effectively "quarantine". The disruptions have been incredible. Look up a typical college basketball team's schedule: Most will show a number of COVID cancellations of opponents, and many will have a chunk taken out of their own schedule and activities (practices, etc.) for a week or two at a time due to cases in their own team, coaches, etc.
the Hong Kong flu (1 or 2 million deaths), the Asian flu (1 or 2 million deaths) or the Spanish flu (50 to 100 million deaths). All of those had variants, and all of those lasted about a year or two and after that, they disappeared into oblivion just like Covid-19 will.
Again, totally incorrect. Take the worst, Spanish Flu. It did not "disappear into oblivion", it mutated into a more survivable variant, puttered around for a while, and eventually popped back up as Swine Flu. In some ways it developed... In the direction of COVID-19. While unlikely, there is nothing absolute to prevent the next mutation from being far more deadly.
Back to COVID-19 though: It is basically a cold virus that has an extra punch for some people, but probably not for enough of those hosts to forcefully push it toward a less contagious variant. Can you cite an cold virus that has disappeared into oblivion? What force or reason would even cause a cold virus to permanently "disappear" instead of recurring periodically?
West VA has done quite well. CA is 2nd to worst, last I checked. As a group, though, I agree. I wonder what West VA did right?
I have.
Aside from many friends of mine and my wife's (more my wife's) working in health care, or FReepers who are health care workers, a larger sample comes from the prayers requested by my church's and my wife's church's congregation members for their family members, friends, co-workers, and so on. (Prayers request portion of service, in the case of my congregation.) This gives a "picture" of how COVID-19 is affecting both congregations, their members, and those their members know. Comparisons can be made to past flu outbreaks, particularly the 2009 Swine flu outbreak, which was significant enough in this area to cause some school shutdowns and such. The above gives me much more "input" than communicating only with friends I normally communicate with, observing only people I know, and so on.
From that input, I can assess in a general way what is going on with what counts: Hospitalizations, serious or worse cases, and fatalities. My assessment is that A) I've never observed in my lifetime anything like this, and; B) While mine is not a rigorous / controlled study, I see nothing to make me doubt the numbers published regularly by our local Health Departments. Nor can I find any serious conflict with the numbers when I drill down to my local level on sites like the CDC, Worldometers, or Johns Hopkins. I conclude they might be off by a factor of two, either way, but no way are they off by, say, an order of magnitude.
This is not a statement on what I think we should have or have not done. I've posted those critiques voluminously elsewhere on FR. This post is simply a level-headed and hopefully minimally biased alternate look at the validity of the data.
I suggest you do similar exercises. But, please, don't do the "Nomad" bit when you find out your above statements are in error. (Star Trek reference.)
Sending somebody home and telling (and relying on them) not to go out for 2 weeks in NOT quarantining.
Australia actually and truly quarantined people in isolation for 2 weeks... The result. About 1,000 deaths in a population of 25.36 million people.
In Canada with a population of 37.59 million, they went the ‘stay at home for two weeks’, non-quarantine. The result... 19,801 deaths to date... About 150 more every day.
As I have stated... If this truly were a ‘deadly’ virus, with the non-quarantine stay at home nonsense that took place throughout the world, there would be a billion dead by now. Thankfully, it’s a pimple in comparison to other diseases that have ravaged humankind.
Let’s extrapolate... With Australia’s actual quarantine method as a comparison.
1,000 per 25 million... 4,000 per 100 million... 40,000 per billion... 304,000 deaths out of a word population of 7.6 billion... And of course, that doesn’t factor in the amount of people who wouldn’t be infected because the disease would be contained. That number could be even lower.
BTW - During the 1968 Hong Kong flu with a world population 3.5 billion (1+ million dead worldwide with 100,000+ in the US) and the 1957 Asian flu with a world population of 2.87 billion (1.1 million dead worldwide with 116,000+ in the US), they typically hospitalized people in greater numbers. I.E. They didn’t send people with the Hong Kong flu and Asian flu home and tell them to ‘self-isolate’. They kept them at the hospital until they were better. That’s the only reason why those outbreaks weren’t as deadly as they could have been. Today, they kick you out of the hospital much faster and much sooner than they should.
The scientist and world leaders in charge of dealing with this virus have failed miserably. Hopefully lessons will be learned, otherwise... When a truly deadly virus does come our way (and it eventually will, because they always do) the numbers from Covid will be laughable in comparison.
The official numbers are ALL bullcrap, off by at least an order of magnitude, because of the financial, pecuniary interest of hospitals to report “died with covid” vs “died FROM covid”. Even the CDC admits this.
As an engineer, I know that you can have the right equation, but if you input data is bullcrap, then your results will be bullcrap. The R0 number is WRONG WRONG WRONG, and you are propagating LIES.
This myth really needs to end. Looking at the total number of deaths from 2020 vs 2019 and 2018, there were over 470,000 extra deaths in 2020. That's a 17% jump year over year. Normal increases are in the 0.3 - 0.7% range.
Deaths happened. Many of them because of people like Cuomo and Newsom who forced nursing homes to accept known-infected patients. Playing make-believe in Fairytaleland that the deaths didn't happen only helps Cuomo and Newsom escape justice from their crimes. They should be indicted; not protected.
"Even the CDC admits this."
No, they don't. The people who think they admitted something think that because they don't understand how a US Standard Certificate of Death is filled out.
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