Posted on 05/29/2019 12:37:41 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o
May 27, 2019 (LifeSiteNews) — Speaking with one of the best-known conservative Jews, Dennis Prager, at the PragerU summit last week, world-famous psychologist Jordan Peterson spoke of God and his views of faith. After speaking about his dislike for the question ‘Do you believe in God?’ Peterson said, “I think that Catholicism — that's as sane as people can get.”
Peterson has often been asked about his faith, if he believes in God, and he said the question has always troubled him. He promised a podcast on the matter since he has given his dislike for the question much thought.
He explained, “Who would have the audacity to claim that they believed in God if they examined the way they lived? Who would dare say that?”
“To believe, in a Christian sense,” he added, “means that you live it out fully and that's an that's an unbearable task in some sense.”
Then in one long drawn-out, rapid-fire thought, the type that has enthralled his millions of fans, he laid out extemporaneously the vision of a believer in God:
“To be able to accept the structure of existence, the suffering that goes along with it and the disappointment and the betrayal, and to nonetheless act properly; to aim at the good with all your heart; to dispense with the malevolence and your desire for destruction and revenge and all of that; and to face things courageously and to tell the truth to speak the truth and to act it out, that's what it means to believe -- that's what it means -- it doesn't mean to state it, it means to act it out. And, unless you act it out you should be very careful about claiming it. And so, I've never been comfortable saying anything other than I try to act as if God exists because God only knows what you'd be if you truly believed.”
See the full exchange of Peterson and Prager here.
What are you talking about...You have to torture the verse to get it to mean what you want it to mean...And then your meaning contradicts scripture...
What it means is that Jesus' sacrifice on the altar of the Cross,both as Lamb and as Priest, once and done, is also eternal,
Nope, it don't...
1Pe 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
Jesus was not a slain lamb...He is compared to a blemish free lamb ready for sacrifice...
1Pe 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Jesus was not slain before the foundation of the world...His sacrifice on the cross was foreordained to happen far into the future...
Rev_13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
The Lamb was not slain from the foundation of the world...It is the names not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world...Here's proof...
Rev_17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
So you and your Church want people to believe that Jesus is still on the Cross, dying and suffering in pain and not only will be there in the future but has always been there in the past...So whether you put Jesus on the Cross eternally or whether you stick him up there every time you have a mass makes no difference...The results are the same...Problem is you can't keep on sticking Jesus up there because the bible is clear you can't do that...
And why does the bible say that??? Because you would time after time after time inflict Jesus with unbearable pain...YET you have devised a fable where Jesus has been on the Cross since before Creation and suffers that pain continually and forever...
Heb_9:26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once (when?) in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
Think of the precious promises of Christ our Savior:
"In that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you." (John 14:20)
Eternal. High. Priest.
And what does an Eternal High Priest do?
He exercises His High Priesthood, eternally.
Assuming Melchizedek was actually Jesus, it was 2000 years before Jesus showed up that the High Priesthood was exercised and only then...So what does that have to do with Jesus hanging on the cross since Creation???
Take care. I admonish you not to make things up or distort what I wrote.
That isn't what I said and that's not what Scripture says. It does NOT say He was "hanging on the Cross since creation." Neither do Catholics say He is "hanging on the Cross" during the Mass.
He is offering Himself to the Father --- one and the same Sacrifice.
You again seem to be at odds with the "Doctors" of the RCC say on this issue.
I will repost this again to you.
********
The dignity of the priest is also estimated from the power that he has over the real and the mystic body of Jesus Christ.
With regard to the power of priests over the real body of Jesus Christ, it is of faith that when they pronounce the words of consecration the Incarnate Word has obliged himself to obey and to come into their hands under the sacramental species. We are struck with wonder when we hear that God obeyed the voice of Josue The Lord obeying the voice of man 1 and made the sun stand when he said move not, O su/i, towards Gabaon, . . . and the sun stood still? But our wonder should be far greater when we find that in obedience to the words of his priests Hoc EST CORPUS MEUM
God himself descends on the altar,
that he comes wherever they call him,
and as often as they call him,
and places himself in their hands, even though they should be his enemies.
And after having come, he remains, entirely at their disposal; they move him as they please, from one place to another; they may, if they wish, shut him up in the tabernacle, or expose him on the altar, or carry him outside the church; they may, if they choose, eat his flesh, and give him for the food of others.
THE COMPLETE WORKS OF SAINT ALPHONSUS DE LIGUORI, DOCTOR OF THE CHURCH, Bishop of Saint Agatha, and Founder of the Congregation of the Most Holy Redeemer.
*************
If there is no shed blood, then there is no sacrifice.
But that's the biggie that you're missing.....the offering was done, finished, completed, at the cross.
It is not a continual offering.
Hence, Τετέλεσται....it has been finished.
It is a one-time offering in the sense that Jesus, one dead, and risen from the dead, can never die again. Death has no dominion over Him.
The bleeding is over--- but the offering is eternal, because Jesus is the Eternal High Priest. He is an eternal Person with an eternal Nature: His acts are necessarily eternal.
Ecclesiastes 3:11
He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the human heart; yet no one can fathom what God has done from beginning to end.
Then there is no sacrifice as shed blood is required as far as forgiveness of sins.
....but the offering is eternal, because Jesus is the Eternal High Priest. He is an eternal Person with an eternal Nature: His acts are necessarily eternal.
Your metaphysical approach is messing you up on this issue.
I beg your pardon.
It is being repeated or it isn't.
It's that cut and dry.
IF He is then it's in contradiction of Scripture.
You're saying one thing, but RC writers/priests are saying something different.
I've already posted the quotes from two Roman Catholic priests and a "Doctor of the Church" that are in conflict with you opinion on this topic.
He is.
"He is being represented as a sacrifice or not in Roman Catholicism."
He is.
"It is being repeated or it isn't."
It's not. It is happening eternally in Heaven. And we are praying with Heaven in the Divine Liturgy.
Use your concordance and check out the use of the word "altar" in Revelation. And what does an Eternal High Priest do on an Eternal Altar? An Eternal Sacrifice.
Once in time; and eternally when you are beyond time...
It's that cut and dry.
If He's on the altar it goes against Scripture.
If He's on the altar it's happening....on the altar...again and again and again as a RC priest acknowledges.
The whole thing is against what is described in Hebrews.
This particular error is not something rampant in the Ancient Churches, all of which have, for nearly 2 millennia, believed in the heavenly Altar, the heavenly Priest, the Lamb "slain before the foundation of the world," and thus realize we must worship in Eternity, in unity with the Angels; and we do.
Of course you can't fathom it. Nobody can, this side of Eternity. That's a given.
Tagline.
Oh? If anything else is on the altar, it's blasphemy.
You mean this??
"[Marx, Freud, and Nietzsche] share a commitment to unmasking 'the lies and illusions of consciousness';
they are the architects of a distinctively modern style of interpretation that circumvents obvious or self-evident meanings in order to draw out less visible and less flattering truths ... Ricoeur's term has sustained an energetic after-life within religious studies, as well as in philosophy, intellectual history, and related field
********
I do believe you've described yourself.
This particular error is not something rampant in the Ancient Churches, all of which have, for nearly 2 millennia, believed in the heavenly Altar, the heavenly Priest, the Lamb "slain before the foundation of the world," and thus realize we must worship in Eternity, in unity with the Angels; and we do.
With regards to the "error"...it wasn't in the NT church.
I will concede it is a later development as witnessed in Roman Catholicism, but not Christianity.
The author of Hebrews, and Paul.
Marx, Freud and Nietzche have nothing to do with it.
Tagline.
Yes....I, and others, have appealed to Hebrews extensively in this debate.
You have appealed to metaphysics and "tradition".
If you continue to read Hebrews you will notice the chapter where it talks about faith...by faith, by faith, etc, etc. There is no mention of eating/drinking flesh or blood.
As Jesus told the unbelieving Jews at the beginning of the Bread of Life Discourse:
40“For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.”
It is the consistent theme of both the OT and NT...we come to Him through faith.
St. Ignatius of Antioch: A Martyr's Love for the Eucharist
Go ahead, it won't bite you. :o)
A few sample paragaphs:
"I had always believed early Christianity was probably a lot like my Evangelical Christianity and that Catholic beliefs in Church authority and transubstantiation were later inventions."But, very quickly, I saw that St. Ignatius not only accepted these two points of doctrine but that he believed passionately in their essential role in the life of the Christian.
"Growing up Baptist, we’d always spoken of communion as “the Lord’s Supper,” simply a memorial where we remembered Jesus’ death, burial, and resurrection. Communion was, at most, a symbol. Yet St. Ignatius, in his Letter to the Ephesians, describes the Eucharist as “the medicine of immortality, the antidote against death, and everlasting life in Jesus Christ.”<
"At first, I guessed that Ignatius was speaking metaphorically and that something was being lost in translation. But, in his Letter to the Romans, he emphasizes the point again, declaring, “Bread of God is what I desire; that is, the Flesh of Jesus Christ, who was of the seed of David; and for my drink I desire His Blood, that is; incorruptible love.”
"I know these passages aren’t proof enough to convince all Protestants of the truth of Transubstantiation. And I certainly wasn’t convinced yet either. However, the description caught me so off guard that I found myself reevaluating what communion might mean..."
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