Cold fusion reactor independently verified, has 10,000 times the energy density of gas

Intrade Gateway via Extreme Tech ^ | May 21, 2013 at 12:43 pm | Sebastian Anthony

[Kevmo]

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/1563 ... ity-of-gas

Cold fusion reactor independently verified, has 10,000 times the energy density of gas By Sebastian Anthony on May 21, 2013 at 12:43 pm 338 Comments

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Against all probability, a device that purports to use cold fusion to generate vast amounts of power has been verified by a panel of independent scientists. The research paper, which hasn’t yet undergone peer review, seems to confirm both the existence of cold fusion, and its potency: The cold fusion device being tested has roughly 10,000 times the energy density and 1,000 times the power density of gasoline. Even allowing for a massively conservative margin of error, the scientists say that the cold fusion device they tested is 10 times more powerful than gasoline — which is currently the best fuel readily available to mankind.

The device being tested, which is called the Energy Catalyzer (E-Cat for short), was created by Andrea Rossi. Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn’t allowed anyone to independently analyze the device — until now. While it sounds like the scientists had a fairly free rein while testing the E-Cat, we should stress that they still don’t know exactly what’s going on inside the sealed steel cylinder reactor. Still, the seven scientists, all from good European universities, obviously felt confident enough with their findings to publish the research paper.

As for what’s happening inside the cold fusion reactor, Andrea Rossi and his colleague Sergio Focardi have previously said their device works by infusing hydrogen into nickel, transmuting the nickel into copper and releasing a large amount of heat. While Rossi hasn’t provided much in the way of details — he’s a very secretive man, it seems — we can infer some knowledge from NASA’s own research into cold fusion. Basically, hydrogen ions (single protons) are sucked into a nickel lattice (pictured right); the nickel’s electrons are forced into the hydrogen to produce neutrons; the nickel nuclei absorb these neutrons; the neutrons are stripped of their electrons to become protons; and thus the nickel goes up in atomic number from 28 to 29, becoming copper.

This process, like the “conventional” fusion of hydrogen atoms into helium, produces a lot of heat. (See: 500MW from half a gram of hydrogen: The hunt for fusion power heats up.) The main difference, though, is that the cold fusion process (also known as LENR, or low energy nuclear reaction) produces very slow moving neutrons which don’t create ionizing radiation or radioactive waste. Real fusion, on the other hand, produces fast neutrons that decimate everything in their path. In short, LENR is fairly safe — safe enough that NASA dreams of one day putting a cold fusion reactor in every home, car, and plane. Nickel and hydrogen, incidentally, are much cheaper and cleaner fuels than gasoline.

As far as we can tell, the main barrier to cold fusion — as with normal fusion — is producing more energy than you put in. In NASA’s tests, it takes a lot more energy to fuse the nickel and hydrogen than is produced by the reaction. Rossi, it would seem, has discovered a secret sauce that significantly reduces the amount of energy required to start the reaction. As for what the secret sauce is, no one knows — in the research paper, the independent scientists simply refer to it as “unknown additives.” All told, the E-Cat seems to have a power density of 4.4×105 W/kg, and an energy density of 5.1×107 Wh/kg.

If Rossi and Focardi’s cold fusion technology turns out to be real — if the E-Cat really has 10,000 times the energy density and 1,000 times the power density of gasoline — then the world will change, very, very quickly. Stay tuned; we’ll let you know when — or if — the E-Cat passes peer review.

Now read: Nuclear power is our only hope, or, the greatest environmentalist hypocrisy of all time

Research paper: arXiv:1305.3913 - “Indication of anomalous heat energy production in a reactor device”

[Kevmo]

a guvmint conspiracy, I doubt it

Never attribute to malice that which can adequately be explained by fecklessness.

[Mr. K]

The bottom line (for me, at least) is this: If this is true then Rossi would be rich enough to hire Bill Gates to shine his shoes.

So... what is he waiting for?

[Kevmo]

So... what is he waiting for?
***Patent protection. Bill Gates went through this himself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Letter_to_Hobbyists

[djf]

That part makes me suspicious.

We are at the point where:

It doesn’t work, it’s a fraud, and Rossi is in SERIOUS trouble or
It does work, and he keeps it secret, in which case Rossi is in serious trouble or
He simply publishes the details on Facebook for the world to see, vindicates himself, and doesn’t need to go into hiding on some desert island in the south pacific... if he chooses this route, he will STILL become one of the richest, most famous men on the planet!

[Cold Heat]

Look Kev....I'd love to keep this up but we have beat all the knowns' to death. But as to your last comment which you keep falling back on understandably, I probably should address it as well.

***Then that makes Rossi the inventor of a chemical that generates 10X higher power density than any other known chemical. A masterful feat, in and of itself. Everyone has questions, but there is no reason for a guy with a $100Billion development to open his kimono without patent protection being available. Like you say, “So there we are and there is where we will remain until something changes”.

This test or actually two tests (according to the PDF) with a few differences between them and the control test with the empty capless dummy only tells us that the vessel attained a stable temperature in open air for a number of hours and then cooled. We can see that through the aid of electrical power that was modified by a device used commonly to modify wave forms of AC current this heat reaction continued to a point where it was either out of fuel or was shut down. (I am not clear on which)

From the thermal camera data and the current logs monitoring the input power we can comfortably assume that at least 500 degrees C in additional heat beyond that of the reported heating coils was apparently produced and sustained somehow for a period of time.

So from that we extrapolate the heat available to be released to be beyond that of a equal mass of gasoline and other compounds used for comparison. In short, that's all this test is telling us.

I am happy to accept that from the results of these tests. But the tests are way too limited and the withheld information that would answer many very basic questions is far too voluminous at this point in time.

Unfortunately for this device and experiments like it, this has been the case for years, just as it was for this little timeless gem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newman%27s_energy_machine

So like I said, until we see more clarity in the released information regarding the construction and contents of this device. I have no choice but to put it in the same category as Newmans perpetual motion generator...

I hope it proceeds to a much better review, but I am not going to hold my breath. If it does....great! If it does not, I won't be surprised and that too is great....because at this point all we have is something of interest and nothing more than that.

[count-your-change]

I knew it! Perhaps you should take the advice. But this thread is not about you, It’s about how these outlandish claims are falling apart under the latest scrutiny.

[Kevmo]

where it was either out of fuel or was shut down. (I am not clear on which)
***It was shut down.

heat available to be released to be beyond that of a equal mass of gasoline and other compounds used for comparison. In short, that’s all this test is telling us.
***Pretty much.

I am happy to accept that from the results of these tests. But the tests are way too limited and the withheld information that would answer many very basic questions is far too voluminous at this point in time.
***Most of those very basic questions are about the proprietary industrial secret, what’s-in-the-box. Since Rossi can’t get a patent for this device in the USA, it makes no sense for him to answer such questions at this time.

Unfortunately for this device and experiments like it, this has been the case for years,
***No,not really. The Anomalous Heat Effect was replicated more than 14,700 times before Rossi even came onto the scene. Many of those experiments were open-kimono. But the effect is still exceedingly difficult to attain, and that’s what Rossi has brought to bear. His development makes it far more likely to generate the effect, to the point that he’s going into production while other LENR experimenters are frustrated with their touchy setups. He’s doing it for the money, much like the Wright brothers. Do you fault them for seeking IP protection?

just as it was for this little timeless gem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newman%27s_energy_machine
***Was Newman’s finding replicated 14,700 times?

So like I said, until we see more clarity in the released information regarding the construction and contents of this device. I have no choice but to put it in the same category as Newmans perpetual motion generator...
***You acknowledge the power density measurements, and then put this device into the same category as perpetual motion? Newman’s device was tested and proven to be basically a lossy DC motor — his claim has been disproven. Rossi’s device was tested and even you accept the energy density claim. So how can those 2 be in the same category? One independently disproven, the other independently validated.

I hope it proceeds to a much better review, but I am not going to hold my breath. If it does....great! If it does not, I won’t be surprised and that too is great....because at this point all we have is something of interest and nothing more than that.
***okie dokie

[Kevmo]

It’s time to take the mod’s advice and ignore you.

Thanks 4 Bumping The Thread T4BTT.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/2965392/posts?page=19#19

[Cold Heat]

The Anomalous Heat Effect was replicated more than 14,700 times before Rossi even came onto the scene.

I'll do you one better on that "anomalous heat effect". How many nickel based batteries have gone critical, caused fires and numerous injuries....every one of those could be considered a "anomalous heat effect". So are all of those indications of cold fusion? One wonders if this is not where he got the idea to pursue this line of experimentation.

[Moonman62]

We’re at the point where Rossi sells distribution rights to suckers, but never produces a working Ecat to distribute.

[Kevmo]

So are all of those indications of cold fusion?
***Extremely doubtful.

[UCANSEE2]

Thanks for posting this thread, and sticking there the whole time dealing with questions, complaints, and attacks.

I know I have learned quite a bit more about the most recent testing of the E-CAT and E-CAT2 (now in HD), and I doubt I’m the only one.

Hopefully your next big thread will be about the revealing of a working model in use at an independent location.

Even if Rossi never works this out... somebody will.

[Kevmo]

Hopefully your next big thread will be about the revealing of a working model in use at an independent location.
***Something we definitely agree on.

[count-your-change]

Chief Scientist and degreed Engineer Rossi has said he's turning control of the business over to others, perhaps his new “partners”.

Yes, “Chief Scientist”, a self promotion it appears.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Your rationalizations are no better than Kevmo’s."

But both are better than yours. Ours, at least, are based on facts. Yours are based on speculation.

[Wonder Warthog]

"So here you have a inventor who has withheld certain knowledge as proprietary secrets, has had others who we don’t really know well to waive the magicians rod under and over the black box and proclaim the results are good! So now we are supposed to accept this????

Large numbers of inventors do precisely that, as do many companies. Completely not unusual. The qualifications and reputations of those doing the test are a matter of public record, and can be sourced in many places.

How many published research papers are written that you know the authors of well enough to "vouch" for them??? Probably very few, if not none. Yet you more than likely take the results of those articles as "good" based on no more than "their" published CV's.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Are there other ways to create that heat? Absolutely! Some sort of exothermic reaction."

Nope. 'Fraid not. Given the available volume in the device, the length of time the device was run, the temperatures reached, and the total power produced, there "is" no exothermic chemical reaction that will suffice

Many reactions will reach those kinds of temperatures, but they simply cannot last LONG ENOUGH. Think about a thermite demonstration...that lasts for a few seconds to maybe a few minutes....not hours on end.

[Wonder Warthog]

"The people who should be looking for holes in this demo are the Seven themselves, instead of accepting what they told by someone with an interest in the demos result."

Which they did. Read their testimonies. Everything they checked for is NOT written in the report, as that is written as a scientific paper. Perhaps in addition to that paper, Levi and Essen should have written a "James Randi expose document", which does lay out in detail all those other pieces of data.

But the fact remains that they did so check, and they are testifying to the fact that they did.

Your argument is bogus.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Like the 'earth ground' wire ?"

Checked for and eliminated.

[Wonder Warthog]

"If the pathway for fusion is converting Nickle to copper than measure with a Mass Spectrometer the copper present before the reactor is turned on and measure for the presence of copper produced after the reactor has been run for a specified time period. If there is no change in copper than it is a fraud if there is a change than the reactor is proven."

Nope. All that shows is that conversion of nickel to copper is not the source of heat production. There is still the heat. But the MS evidence will probably also give clues as to what the reaction is when Rossi eventually allows samples to be run. But that likely won't be until he has good patent protection.