British troops retiring their Hi-Powers, getting Glocks

guns.com ^ | 1/09/13 | Max Slowik

[Berlin_Freeper]

British troops serving in Afghanistan will soon be issued a new sidearm, the Glock 17. The Glocks will replace the L9A1s—Browning Hi-Powers with an ambidextrous safety—in service that have been standard-issue for about 50 years.

The decision follows more than two years of evaluating the Glock for service, and calls for 25,000 Glock 17s to fill the £8.5 ($13.6) million contract. Some troops have been issued SIG P226 pistols to replace their aging Hi-Powers as a stop-gap measure, but it’s the Austrian pistol that has won the hearts and minds at the British Ministry of Defense.

[JoeProBono]

[Gaffer]

I have a Browning Hi Power II Digital Camo....I absolutely love that little gun.....only thing is that it’s 9mm but an extremely well-built weapon.

[Terry L Smith]

So, Bond is going to have to go ‘plastic’, now, eh?

I have a MKII Belgian Browning, and a digicamo MKIII.

The late Browning Hi Power ‘guru’, former Texas law agency officer Stephen A. Camp said that the Hi Power was one of the best pistols in the world. It was his duty piece for many years, before he retired. his website still exists, “Hipowerandhandguns”.

The Canadians manufactured Hi Powers during WW2, under the ‘Inglis’ name, during a time when the Nazis overran Belgium, and took over the manufacturing plant.

Whether these pistols are ‘only’ 9mm or not, they are the last works/design that the venerable John Moses Browning was working on, at the time of his death. They are accurate enough and fit the hand well enough, for me.

[RC one]

Glocks rock.

[Nathaniel]

The Glock is a good weapon for people who do not train with weapons regularly. The P35 is a SUPERB weapon for people who know how to use it. The 9mm caliber is vastly inferior to the 45 ACP, but IS adaquate. Also, the military has always had the heebie-jeebies about “cocked and locked” (as John Moses Browning INTENDED). I have clear memories of junior officers pawing at my M9 in my issue shoulder holster trying to place MY safety on “safe” (empty weapon secured in MY issue rig - yes the M9 is a SA/DA weapon - different entirely from the P35, but 100% safe carried with one in the chamber, safety off, ready to fire in the DA mode). I often asked the commissioned junior officers if they routinely snatched empty M16s (on which the safety CANNOT be placed on “safe” with the hammer down with an empty [or loaded] chamber). I got the deer in the headlights look, followed by a condescending bunch of commissioned BS. As a 1SG, I’d laugh and return my weapon to the condition that I wanted it in and carry on about my business. Point is - just like at Fort Hood, the politically correct BS is the driving thing. I love the Hi-Power. The Glock? A servicable, somewhat non-durable plastic pistol for non-shooters.

[MasterGunner01]

Translation: Our supply of L9A1 9mm Browning HiPowers are insufficient, we don’t want to buy more from the Belgians (that are assembled in Portugal), so we go with Glocks made in Austria. [It should be noted that the UK does very little small arms manufacture of its own any more. That has been outsourced to “freer” nations.]

[Chainmail]

Agree with you:

Glock; plastic frame, stamped parts, welded slide - a nonpermanent, disposable weapon.

Browning P35; All milled steel quality, robust design, absolute reliability, designed to last centuries.

Never settle for cheap stuff when your life depends on it.

[edpc]

Bond went plastic in 2006 when he used the Walther P99 in Casino Royale.

[riverrunner]

I have own both for decades brought my first Hi power in the 70’s owned Glock from the time they were first imported.

Shot many thounsands of rounds through each. The browning is a good pistol. But the Glock will out last the browning for many reasons.

[bmwcyle]

The US Marines went the right way.

[real saxophonist]

hickok45 likes Glock.

[spetznaz]

I have to respectfully disagree. The Glock purchase makes a lot of sense, and not just from a financial perspective. The Glock is a good pistol, and for both shooters and non-shooters (to use the dichotomy brought up by Nathaniel). And, to be very honest, I'd say the average soldier - when it comes to pistols - is a non-shooter. Most of the shooting is focused on his main weapon, which for virtually every soldier (apart from tank crews, who in some nations carry personal defense weapons ranging from MP-5s to FN P90s) is a rifle of some sort. Most of the firearms training is rifle based, with not that much time spent on pistols (compared to rifles) for most 'ordinary' soldiers. Thus, if the Glock is the perfect handgun for the 'non-shooter,' then it is perfect for the British troops when it comes to handguns.

It is somewhat similar to unarmed combat training. Most soldiers will not spent most of their time in hand to hand combat, and thus the training is not necessarily the best available. It is just the best available for someone not expected to spend most of their time in H2H combat. Thus, the perfect style for the non-H2H combatant. Hence the likes of MCMAP for the US Marines, and the basic levels of Krav Maga for normal Israeli infantry. Special operations forces definitely get better H2H training (e.g. DEVGRU and CAG do get instructors who teach some rather interesting things ranging from Apache knife fighting, Sayoc Kali, and some rather eclectic stuff like P.F.S and S.P.E.A.R; while the Israelis teach harder types of Krav Maga and KAPAP) ...but still ...these guys will spend most of their time practicing on their main weapons.

For the average soldier (read: not part of special operations) the time spent working on their side arm is less than that done by the average police officer, and the Glock is absolutely perfect for the average soldier. A member of DEVGRU or Sayeret can make a case for a different handgun, but the average soldier ...not really (apart from personal taste). The average soldier is a 'non-shooter' when it comes to handguns as compared to i) the amount of time spent on the handgun vs the primary weapon, and ii) compared to even civilian shooters who have decided to put serious time into handgun practice. Consequently, if the Glock is the perfect gun for a non-shooter, the British chose wisely.

[real saxophonist]

Glock 1000 Round Torture Test Part 1

Glock 1000 Round Torture Test Part 2

[Dusty Road]

If there is a bigger fan of the Hi-Power than me I’ve yet to find them. I’ve got a couple of dozen with all but two being made pre 1983. Calibers range from 40, 357 Sig, 9mm and 7.65x21. Now before anybody says Browning didn’t make one in 357 Sig which is true, this one started life as a 40 and was converted. NOVAK! I sure would like to pick a few of these up.

[riverrunner]

Thats all nice but why does that make a Browning better then a Glock.

What I see is a lot of reasons to chose a Glock over a Browning.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

Chuck Taylor, owner of the Cottontail Lounge in Urbandale, IA., carried a Hi-Power everyday his little diner and bar was open for business. He always said he hoped he'd never have to pull it and he never did where a customer was involved.
So it was a surprise a week before Christmas, just at closing time when Chuck spotted a young man approaching the front door while rolling down a ski mask over his face.
Chuck said he quickly exited out the kitchen back door and came around to the front of the building, hammer back, to confront the holdup man.
Mr. Skimask was startled to see Chuck in his waiter's apron, pointing the Hi-Power in his direction. At about the same time, Chuck spotted the .38 snubby and hesitating a half second, let lose with two rounds into the front door of the Cottontail. Mr. Skimask dropped his revolver and ran toward an older Impala, idling nearby. The Impala made for a better target and received the remainder from the 9 MM magazine, in the trunk, back window and driver's door.
A passing Urbandale cop happened on to the crime scene moments later and made the arrest of the erstwhile holdup man who was removed from the car, whimpering.
The next day, an Urbandale detective invited Chuck down to the police range for a tune-up session for the Hi-Power...

[central_va]

There is only one handgun in my book, M1911 .45 ACP. everything else is second rate.

[Elderberry]

I sure hope we see them on the surplus market!

[Berlin_Freeper]

With the growing green on blue attacks, soldiers will need more training with sidearms.