Andrea Rossi on Defkalion [Says its a Scam - LOL]

Ecatnews.com ^ | 12/1/11 | Admin

[Liberty1970]

It seems that Dr Rossi and Defkalion agree about something. The Greek company is at pains to say that Hyperion is absolutely their technology and nothing to do with the eCat. While some may find this an Alice-in-Wonderland statement, the Italian inventor does not. He accuses them – without naming – of operating a scam.

Andrea Rossi December 1st, 2011 at 12:44 AM WARNING: SOMEBODY IS ON THE ROAD SAYING THEY HAVE SUCCEEDED IN STEALING OUR TECHNOLOGY ( WHOSE PATENT HAS BEEN GRANTED IN ITALY AND IS PENDING IN THE WORLD) AND ARE TRYING TO SELL A MOCK UP SAYING IT IS AN UPGRADED COPY OF THE E-CAT. ATTENTION: NOBODY HAS EVER COPIED OUR TECHNOLOGY. PROBABLY THIS IS A STUNT AIMED TO COLLECT MONEY FROM UNCAUTIOUS BUYERS. WE JUST WANT TO MAKE EVERYBODY WELL CONSCIOUS OF THE FACT THAT WE ARE TOTALLY UNRELATED TO ANY PRODUCT THAT HAS NOT BEEN SPECIFICALLY MARKED BY US AND THAT HAS NOT OUR CERTIFICATION. AT THE MOMENT OUR E-CATS ARE FOR SALE ONLY FOR WHAT CONCERNS 1 THERMAL MW PLANTS, BECAUSE THE 10 KW E-CATS ARE NOT YET CERTIFIED. WARM REGARDS, A.R.

[Liberty1970]

Rossi's note above doesn't say Defkalion by name, but E-catworld.com agrees with Ecatnews.com that this is directed at Defkalion, as would seem obvious.

Here's an ironic turn of events. Now we have Rossi, of all people, screaming 'Scam' at Defkalion. It rather dramatically undermines my recent speculation that Rossi and Defkalion are secretly working together on a scam. ;-)

[Liberty1970]

*Ping*

Here’s another bit of an update: “Defkalion has now clarified that the spectroscopy was performed at the University of Padua (not Siena), where this analysis actually was performed, commisioned by Rossi.”

[Liberty1970]

Here's an article from Ny Technik on yesterday's Defkalion announcement, with some new details such as a claim to have 27 scientists on staff:

http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3358483.ece

[Lx]

He’s the expert.
On scamming that is. Not fusion.

[Liberty1970]

And finally, many of you will recall that physicist and former Greek ambassador to Italy, Dr. Stremmenos, has been associated with both Defkalion and Rossi. He seems to be siding with Rossi lately, as per this recent email:

http://www.nyteknik.se/incoming/article3358406.ece/BINARY/Letter+from+Stremmenos+Nov2011+%28pdf%29

Defkalion claims to have 12 Hyperions running. Now if SOMEBODY would just start offering some independent evidence for Ecat/Hyperion operation... the gig is up on both of them if they don't start opening the doors wider to public verification.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

He would certainly know.

[Liberty1970]

Here's a bit more from the Ny Technik article:

Interested companies will pay 500,000 Euros in an escrow account before testing a final product. Half of the license fee of 40.5 million Euros should be be paid at delivery of know-how, and the remaining part after ten days of operation of a factory producing Hyperion products.

So Defkalion intends to make money by signing up companies to build Hyperions to their designs. They put $$ in an escrow account, at which point they can test 'a final product.' Then the big $$ is paid, 1/2 up front, the other half at SOP+10 days.

That sounds safe enough - IF the 'final product' testing refers to Defkalion providing a Hyperion sample to the interested party for them to test according to their own protocols and to their own complete satisfaction. If the testing is done on site at Defkalion or they place restrictions on the testing, then obviously something is fishy.

[count-your-change]

Ah...the plot thickens! Or is it the pot chickens?
anywho, see this from Oilprice.com
“Is Rossi’s E-Cat Yesterday's News? Australian Company Claims to have a Working Fusion Reactor”

All in all I'd say Defkalion has proceeded in a much more believable and professional way than Rossi.
Perhaps they're just a bit slicker than he but they do seem to be proceeding at a more slow and deliberate pace which would argue they are not just copying Rossi.

[Liberty1970]

One other comment:

Xanthoulis gave no further information on verification of the core technology, except that it will be made by third parties later this year.

If "this year" means 2011, then all well and good, and we await the results. I hope they deliver, and in a fully satisfactory manner. Sounds like Defkalion is moving robustly to counter Rossi, at least.

[dinodino]

He’s probably right...and it takes one to know one.

[Liberty1970]

Yeah, I just saw the article about the Australian fusion claim. Crazy. I’ll just take a wait-and-see approach on one-off claims like that until I start hearing more though. Lots of smoke, but is there any fire in LENR?

[Johnny B.]

Why does itundermine the theory that they’re working together?
Transfer
It fits perfectly with my scenario about them setting up a public battle that will give them an excuse to withhold the actual delivery of devices.

Expect lawsuits and restraining orders soon.

[Liberty1970]

I thought your scenario involved them claiming patent infringement, etc., in which each side tacitly acted as if the other had a _real_ working Ecat, but with stolen technology.

What we see here is Rossi calling Defkalion a fraud, saying that they _don't_ have a working Ecat. At least that's how I understand it. It's a strange way to run a scam, if you are shouting 'scam' as part of it and then trying to get investors for the side that is accused of doing the scamming by the other side. That's just too weird for me.

[count-your-change]

Right now it looks like they’re all in hot water.

[Johnny B.]

I thought your scenario involved them claiming patent infringement, etc., in which each side tacitly acted as if the other had a _real_ working Ecat, but with stolen technology.

All I'm really saying is that if it's an investor scam (as I think it is), they need to find a way to collect investor's money without actually delivering gadgets to real customers. Using a faked legal battle would do this quite nicely.

Each side could claim to have working devices, but claim they can't actually release them to the public due to legal actions by the other side.

I don't know the inner workings of these companies, but I would expect Rossi to announce that he's suspending the release of any E-Cats for fear that Defkalion will just steal his secret catalyst. He could also get a court order to prevent Defkalion from selling any of their devices.

At that point, the greedy and gullible investors (a con man's best friend) will continue to invest in either company, to "get in on the ground floor", while no one actually gets a working device.

They could tie things up for years working a scam like this.

Of course, as soon as a legitimate customer (i.e. not a Rossi shill) comes forward to say that their gadget works (from either company), my theory would be proven wrong.

[Liberty1970]

George Hants posted some more interesting details in the comments at Ecatnews.com (I'm not sure if he works for Defkalion or what, but he seems to have some good access).

georgehants December 1, 2011 - 4:46 pm | Permalink

Data of our extensive tests on every section or component of Hyperion pre-industrial products, as well as the overall system test data, are in compliance with the released specs. Specs have been released to be used also as a basis of independent third party tests that have been scheduled already.

Measurements needs test protocols and protocols require specs. So, this is what is expected to be tested by third parties. We encourage and support the public announcement of their tests.

We are sure that third party independent testing results will convince the most sceptical on LENR and on the first safe and stable product utilizing energy produced by such reactions.

Thank you

Here is another one:

georgehants December 1, 2011 - 4:52 pm | Permalink From Defkalion

Note: All multi-reactor systems will have the same selling price, regardless if they are of let us say 20 or 35 or 45 kW nominal power. In all cases, 9 reactors are in the kernel. Up to 4, 7 or 9 respectively in this examble, are allowed to operate concurrently by their setup. So the recharge period varies, as far as all 9 reactors may service the system following a balancing algorithm. So, recharging period is not always 6 months. It can be more as stated in specs.

Thank you