Posted on 09/29/2011 8:43:31 AM PDT by Politics4US
Mark Levin says Rubio is a natural born citizen, and threatens to ban birthers on his social sites.
“You claimed that Vattel is not important in defining US Citizenship & I just proved you wrong by using a current (within the last year) SCOTUS case wherein the US Govt uses Vattel to define US Citizenship.”
You damned idiot! If Vattel defined US citizenship, then the Mexican would have been found to be a US citizen by birth, since his father was a US citizen and, according to Vattel, blood determines citizenship.
So - according to you - why was the Mexican’s citizenship denied?
And as Squeeky points out, your link is to an amicus brief, not the decision, and it cites Daniel Defoe as one of its authorities. So, does Daniel Defoe determine citizenship?
“An amicus curiae (also spelled amicus curiæ; plural amici curiae) is someone, not a party to a case, who volunteers to offer information to assist a court in deciding a matter before it. The information provided may be a legal opinion in the form of a brief (which is called an amicus brief when offered by an amicus curiae), a testimony that has not been solicited by any of the parties, or a learned treatise on a matter that bears on the case.”
Oh golly! How authoritative! The Immigration Reform Law Institute filed this brief, not the US Government.
You Vattel worshipers need to learn to READ!
The Supreme Court binding precedent in Minor vs. Happersett (1874) provides the Constitutional definition of natural born citizenship. This holding still stands. Minor vs. Happersett has never been superseded.
The Court in Minor did make a direct holding that Mrs. Minor was, in fact, a US citizen. The Court established her citizenship by defining the “class” of “natural-born citizens” as those born in the US to parents who were citizens. The Court included Virginia Minor in that class, thereby deeming her to be a US citizen. They did this by specifically avoiding the 14th Amendment and by specifically construing Article II Section I, Clause 5.
When the Court held that Minor was a citizen under Article II Section I because she was born in the US of citizen parents, that definition became national law. Therefore, Minor supersedes all other sources on this point. It is a direct Constitutional interpretation and definition.
N.B.: The Court did not specify "a parent" but rather "parentS" meaning both necessary to be either naturalized before the birth or native born themselves.
Any claim that the 14th Amendment modified this in any way is invalid, as it had no bearing on the established status that Women had the same constitutional rights as Men from their birth.
This case was brought to allow Mrs. Minor the privilege of voting in the Missouri elections, AKA Suffrage. As Justice Waite noted:
He went on to note that there are no Federal positions which are voted on by US Citizens, only State positions. Therefore only the States, by virtue of the restrictions in the Constitution, can revise their voting privilege, absent a valid legislative edict from Congress.
And yes - I firmly believe that Vattel was the underlying legal treatise that established our Constitution, to over-ride those portions of Blackstone's Common Law Commentaries that bound us to the Crown.
“And I am not being sarcastic. Discussing the Constitutionality of anything done by Washington is pointless.”
+4.2 Trillion. More’s the pity.
brityank wrote: “The Court in Minor did make a direct holding that Mrs. Minor was, in fact, a US citizen. The Court established her citizenship by defining the “class” of “natural-born citizens” as those born in the US to parents who were citizens. The Court included Virginia Minor in that class [...]”
Ah, lifted from Leo Donofrio’s blog. Does it occur to you that lawyers who face-plant in court every single time might not be your best source of legal analysis?
cynwoody wrote: “But nobody trotted out the Vattel theory until after the election. The first thread I could find on FR was in December, 2008, discussing Leo Donofrio’s legal arguments (which have gone exactly nowhere). “
Donofrio’s legal arguments have recently done much, much worse than go nowhere. His latest eligibility-related case, the matter of Old Carco (related because Donofrio spun one of his twisted theories of an eventual quo warranto claim) was such a disaster for Donfrio and his partner, fellow birther attorney Stephen Pidgeon, that he vowed never again to go willingly to federal court. How much their self-administered fleecing will cost them remains to be seen; the firm that beat them summed it up as $128,762.50.
“Why can’t Mark Levin just say that since the issue is so ‘settled’ (because of this, this, and this...), SCOTUS should take up these cases and simply clarify the issue in a legally binding way so the people clamoring for the rule of law will be satisfied and we can move on?”
He explained that — did you listen to the YouTube recording? He set up his site for rational people. There is no debate. You can “take that birther crap somewhere else.”
“He seems to be saying that ‘by blood’ is irrelevant, and ‘by soil’ is all that matters.”
No, that’s an error in basic logic. Levin implies that Rubio’s birth in Miami Florida is sufficient to make him a natural-born citizen, but that does not mean all else is irrelevant.
Levin was not a fan of John S. McCain III, but Levin accepted that McCain was eligible for the presidency. McCain was born to two U.S. citizens at Coco Solo Naval Air Station in Panama.
It’s the Democrat assigned Obot! How’s Weazie? Still planting disinformation over at Wikipedia, or is that really you wearing a different name?
The Chrysler case isn’t over yet.
And gloating over someone else getting screwed by a corrupt judge accepting a promotion from Obama in exchange for throwing a case through fraud ought to scare the bejesus out of anyone.
There is a reason your hero, Obama, has NEVER claimed to be a natural born citizen. He knows the definition. It is found in Minor vs. Happersett and he isn’t eligible to be in the White House.
The time is coming, and soon, when the Democrat Party lies in ruins and people like you will be literally running for your lives. Yes, very soon.
Yes, it is an absurd example, but true. We have opened the presidency to foreign nationals, raised to destroy us. How many times did Barack swear allegiance to Indonesia as a child? Every day for five years. When we were in Kindergarden learning of George Washington, god only knows what Islamic Indonesian centric crap that SOB was learning.
I see the problem right off the bat. I read the entire speech without the words that you inserted about ties of the parents. Had I discarded everything Madison had said and invented meanings that fit your agenda then I would no doubt have come to the same conclusion as you did. My bad.
What court case did he cite after Minor v Happersett - at which point the court clearly stated that the issue was NOT settled? Since it wasn’t settled at that point, when does he claim it was settled after that? In what case has the Supreme Court clearly ruled on the meaning of “natural born citizen” as a qualification for Presidential eligibility?
And what reason does he give for saying that none of this is anybody’s business, as the courts have claimed even in instances where a KNOWN INELIGIBLE CANDIDATE (Roger Calero) was placed on the ballot?
I read the transcript of what Levin said and it translates into, “Who are you to question what I say? Just go away, you little peons.” Very disappointing. I’d expect that from somebody like Nancy Pelosi but coming from Mark Levin it just saddens and sickens me.
Denying what it is known to be has become nothing more than a work of self deception.
They believe when Obama was inaugurated, we the people spoke and affirmed that our interpretation is born on US soil. The Photo shopped BC is the cornerstone of our collective legal decision.
The forged smiley face on Alvin Onakas signature is a modern day in-your-face “John Hancock”.
“We the People” settled the law, qualifying Barack Obama with forged documents
,,,,, more spin than facts . Try Again ,,,,, Rubio’s parents are citizens of the USA they were welcomed here from cuba during the boat lift ,,, Rubio was born in the USA ,,, that puts him way ahead of our current prez and the mex drug cartel too .
Rubio Schlubio
what freepers will salivate for ...here’s yer bone kids?
fetch!
Mark Levin is probably right....Rubio was born in Florida. But Levin, supposedly a Lawyer, seems to be unaware that a natural born citizen is born of citizen parents...which Rubio was not. There is case law, Minor vs. Hastett (spelling?), which defines natural born in that way. This issue has not been visited recently by any level of Federal Courts. Congress critters and 99.9 percent of the citizens of the U.S. are either unaware of this issue or are completely confused about it. I am shocked that Mark Levin is apparently unaware of Minor vs. Hastett....I am re-thinking by view of Mark Levin...maybe he isn’t nearly as smart and clear thinking as I once thought.
This kind of unquestioning hero worship is sad, dangerous, silly, illogical and changes people into sheeple.
Don’t really give a crap what you think.
Upthread it was stated that his parents were naturalized after he was born, not before. So, if he was born to non-citizens, he is not a NBC. It’s quite simple, experts fluster and bluster notwithstanding.
Since you joined FR what, besides eligibility issues, have you posted about?
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