Posted on 02/03/2011 3:34:10 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator
The seven hundred gallons of propane we pre-bought last summer is almost used up and this means buying more (at these prices!) to last the rest of the winter.
I've heard about these infrared heaters that allegedly pay for themselves in the money they save. Do any FReepers use them? Could anyone give me any advice on the advisability of buying an infrared heater instead of more propane?
Will a portable heater be sufficient? Is it better to get an electrical or a gas/propane heater? And what about all these "sales" one reads about so often in the papers and circulars? Can they be trusted, or is it better to pay full price?
I await your answers.
We ordered an infrared heater, tried it, and returned it pretty quick; like to have froze waiting for it to do something - it didn’t. Now, we have two cheap electric heaters from Walmart that do the job just fine.
Rather than use infrared space-heaters as supplements to our propane heaters, I was wondering if we could completely stop using our conventional heaters and save money by using infrared heaters in their place. To continue to buy propane on top of paying an electric heating bill (no matter how small the propane bill would be) just doesn't seem practical or economical.
Tell us
A: what you pay per pound or gallon for the propane.
and
B: What you pay per kwhr for electric (that is usally on the bill, if not then divide the bill by the usage and tell us that number)
There is no magic, it all comes down to comparing those numbers.
My father has one. He says it cut his fuel bill by 2/3rds. The electric bill goes up a bit, but it is more than offset by the fuel savings. He uses it during the day and evening, then uses the furnace at night. He lives alone and spends most of his time in the living room, so it works well for him. Might not be practical if you had a family and needed several.
Well, it all STARTS with comparing those numbers.
Hummmm.........interesting.
He'll save even more if he keeps the thermostat set down a bit at night too and uses an electric blanket. It's the ultimate in space heating. You're only heating up the space right by your body.
“Who Has the Big Knife Out for Meridith Whitney?”
I noticed you were looking for that story here it is
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2668236/posts
That's what I thought when I saw the title but I think he is talking about something else. I installed a tube (natural gas) a number of years ago and my heating bill went down to a fraction of what it was when I used electric & a wood stove. They are great, and heat up the area very quickly. And since they heat the objects in the room, they don't need to kick back on nearly as frequently to maintain the desired temp.
absolutely
we’ve had this discussion on FR many times
1500 watts is 1500 watts no matter what label you put on it, LOL
You're asking for facts. Then you're going to use math.
That takes all the fun out of it
/sarc
from what I read you could replace the propane furnace but
depending on the layout of your house you may need multiple
space heaters, I dont think the heat transfers through
doors well. The other thing to consider is a power outage
and the need for a generator. A propane pilot is needs alot
less wattage the any electrical heater. Have you considered
a pellet stove?
A few years ago, I tried one of the EdenPure heaters, because my landlord at the time was “sold” on it. It did not put out much heat, IMO.
That said, do you have the space, the climate (sun) and technical/building experience to build one of the following?
$1000 Solar Water Heater
http://www.builditsolar.com/Experimental/PEXColDHW/Overview.htm
The Solar Shed — Using Solar Collectors Mounted on an Outbuilding for House Heating
http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/SpaceHeating/SolarShed/solarshed.htm
Those will save you some money, if you have enough sun days in your area.
The following has saved me money on propane in RVs (travel trailers) used as construction dwellings. They use propane but a little more frugally than do conventional furnaces. Read the cautions on ventilation, though (24 sq. inches of ventilation for the following heater, IIRC). And my next house will not have one in it. We’re building a huge solar drainback system for that (modified version of the one behind the previous links that I posted, with a large collector and a much larger, 720-gallon, concrete, heavily insulated tank in a heavily insulated shed closer to the house).
Camco 57351 Olympian RV Wave-8 8000 BTU LP Gas Catalytic Heater
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-57351-Olympian-Wave-8-Catalytic/dp/B000EDQR8M
And that catalytic heater will only do for up to 200 sq. ft., BTW, if that. BTW, it’s the safest one that I could find. The others don’t have the needed safety features (like the automatic shutoff for lack of gas combustion).
The propane/natural gas heaters with the “bricks” that glow red on the front are real money savers.
http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-Natural-Radiant-VF30KRADNG/dp/B000UPSL74
I had one and it would heat my 1500 sq ft house up nice and toasty, with 99% efficiency. A propane tank would last two seasons, without running anything else. Plus, it’s awesome to back up to it and heat your buns when it gets really cold.
Electric radiant heaters don’t compare, but they do have some advantages, most especially portability. I actually use one in my living room. Remember, though, that the max they can put out is 1500 watts. Best not to get a fancy design, as you don’t get any more heat for the money. Got mine at the dollar store for less than $40. It is similar to this one:
http://www.amazon.com/Comfort-CZQTV8-Forced-Quartz-Beveled/dp/B000UO8CA6
But, I’d look around to see if you can find it cheaper. Keep in mind that electric heaters are more expensive to run to get the same amount of heat (in fact, it would take 6 or so of the average electric heater to get the same output as the heater in the link above. And that would be a total of 9000 watts running at once...that’d make quite a dent in your wallet.
“electric heaters are more expensive to run to get the same amount of heat “
That depends. 1 Gallon of Propane = 27 kWh (Kilowatt Hours) of electricity.
So if propane costs over 27 times as much as a kwhr- elect will be cheaper to run.
For me (@about 7 cents a kwhr) the breaking point is $1.90/gal. And that’s assuming 100% efficiency!
1 gallon of liquid propane = 34 cu feet of propane gas
1 cu foot of propane = 2516 BTU
A 100,000 BTU heater would use about 40 cu feet of propane in an hour, or slightly over a gallon. At $1.90 per gallon, that’d cost you about $2.23 to put out 100,000 BTU’s for one hour with propane.
The largest 120V electric radiant heater puts out 1500 watts.
1500 watts = about 5120 BTU’s
100,000 BTU’s needed, divided by 5120 BTU’s per heater, means that for the same amount of heat, you’d have to run 19 radiant electric heaters for one hour.
19 heaters x 1500 watts per heater = 28500 watts power consumed / 1000 = 28.5 kWh
28.5 kWh x $.07 per kWh = $1.96 per hour, +/- a few cents from what you said.
In your case, you’re right. Thanks. I don’t feel so bad about running my electric radiant heater now.
The only hurdle I see is the initial purchase of 19 radiant electric heaters. Even at a relatively cheap $35 a pop, you’d have almost $670 in initial outlay, plus taxes!
Plus, trips to the basement to reset breakers!
I hope my comment isn’t salt to a wound but we are firm believers in super-insulation, in the lower 48 many homes may only have R-11 in the walls, we have insulation at the very least 3 times higher, in my 2x6 walls I have a 2” layer of expanded polystyrene sheeting, ceiling rated fiberglass insulation in the wall between studs and then a another sheet of 1” foam on the inside.
And we use in floor heat, of course its put in when the floor is poured but it can be attached to the underside of wooden floors. And then we have a boiler, in my case I used a 50gallon water heater with an expansion tank, a closed loop system with a circulation pump.
I also have some electric baseboard heaters for backup, I also have a natural gas fireplace as a backup, AND I have a 12kw diesel generator as a backup.
And then there is a new still in the box large kerosene heater should all my other backups fail. I won’t mention my wood stove and 8 acres of trees...
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