Oil Experts/Scientists Opinions Wanted (Vanity)

via e-mail

[Mama Shawna]

Got this in an email, don't know what to think of it. Would appreciate comments. Did a search, couldn't find anything on it.

[Mama Shawna]

My first reaction was definitely ‘tin foil’ that’s for sure, but thought I’d get some freeper input, both good and bad, ‘cause the greatest minds seem to gather here, and also some of the ‘rudest’. ;)

Time will tell.

[unkus]

I do know I’ve worked with these types before, so anything bad could happen, that’s what they do...........

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It sounds like only time will tell....and a lot of luck.

[Hacklehead]

It should be easy to measure the pipe thickness near the break. If it has not been eroded it should be possible to hydraulically clamp the pipe closed (like you would a bleeding artery). Alternatively, it should be possible to place a section of pipe containing a valve over the broken end. Weld the valve containing pipe to the broken one. Close the valve.

[Publius6961]

Before we start -- let us ask why BP and our government and our news media conspired to hide the truth -- why they did not call on every nation to supply its engineers and scientintists to work on the problem -- why they seem to think saving the human population sustaining capacity of the ocean not to be worthwhile. It has been estimated by experts that the pressure which blows the oil into the Gulf waters is estimated to be between 20,000 and 70,000 PSI (Pounds per square inch). Impossible to control.

Just this introductory paragraph pegs my ignorant BS meter... A few calculations may confirm that. First of all one must calculate the pressure on the ocean bottom due entirely to the mile of eater above it. Does the above statement suggest 20 to 70k psi above the hydrostatic pressure?

If that were the case nothing could get near that well outlet, specially if memory serves me right, it is a 21-inch pipe.

[Publius6961]

This is the "Scientist" in question; probably among the 5 most useless "doctorates" possible; right up there with "Womens' Studies."

Doofus Phony 'Scientist'"

[Publius6961]

Let's see... assuming the scenario as presented is true (which I totally reject) the rushing oil will erode the pipe walls and "eventually" after gazillions of gallons of oil are spilled, and the oil reservoir "emptied," then the sea water will rush in, convert to steam and blow half the gulf to kingdom come.

This fellow is a total science ignoramus, and never heard of equilibrium. When the internal pressure equals the sea bottom pressure would not the flow stop in either direction?

Have I forgotten all of my high school and college physics?

[Robert A Cook PE]

Er, uhm, no.

Based on shear strength of 70,000 psi of the two pipes, and their combined cross section area, it would take over 8,500,000 pounds of force to crimp the pipe that way. With no assurance at all that the flow would stop, or be even reduced significantly.

If you could crush both pipes that is: The outer one (21 inch diameter, 1 thick walls) is going to protect the inner one as it deforms and prevent the inner pipe (9 inch diameter, also 1 inch walls) from deforming and closing completely at both sides. At the extreme cold of that deep, the pipes, rather than bending into tight 180 degree “bends” are more likely to crack at the tight kinked corners where the crushing force is concentrated and break axially - down the pipe thus releasing more oil from the cracks.

[Robert A Cook PE]

Yes, backpressure from the ocean’s weight reduces flow.

Reservoir pressure from below (about 25,000 psi at the reservoir, about 15,000 psi at the sediment/ocean bottom/wellhead) is enough to keep the oil flowing.

Lots of new food for bacteria to eat. 8<)

They are drilling relief wells to relieve off the pressure from the oil and natural gas under there - that’s probably the most effective solution, near term and long range.

[Hacklehead]

Thanks. I’m no engineer but I can monday morning quarterback with the best of them. How about the “weld a valve over the break” proposal?

[SunkenCiv]

Just a quick read of that last paragraph shows that this is total B.S.

[Robert A Cook PE]

Watch that old (corny) John Wayne movie modelled on Red Adair and see how it looks on low pressure small pipes wells and open-air access with tractors and good visibility.

[proud_yank]

That is not nearly as bad as the post-Sept 11 'inside job' e-mails quoting temps reaching 11,000 deg C, but it's still pretty bad.

It has been estimated by experts that the pressure which blows the oil into the Gulf waters is estimated to be between 20,000 and 70,000 PSI (Pounds per square inch). Impossible to control

That is a huge range and way too high. The pressure at the wellhead was around 15,000 psi, IIRC.

rocks and sand which causes the flow to create a sandblasting effect on the remaining well head device currently somewhat restricting the flow, as well as the drilled hole itself.

This is partially true, and is called erosion. Sands and solids in a fluid stream can deteriorate well tubing and well heads, usually worse anywhere you have a bend or radius in the pipe. However, the well head in place doesn't seem to be restricting much flow. The catastrophic chain reacion described in the note is unlikely.

The oil along with the gasses, including benzene and many other toxins, is deleting the oxygen in the water. This is killing all life in the ocean.

Rather misleading. You can have some nasty stuff coming out of a production stream- benzene, toluene, H2S, etc. It all depends on the reservoir, and what the concentrations are. To say that it will kill everything in the ocean is absurd. The Mexican state oil co., Pemex, had a similar event happen in 1979 that flowed an excess of 30,000BPD for 9 months. The Gulf and the ocean did not die.

Of all chemicals associated with an oilfield, raw crude is probably the cleanest to spill. There are bacteria that will decompose it, and it is far easier to clean. Please note, that I am not advocating oil spills.

The final paragraph is not written in reality. Relief wells (new wells that will be drilled, and tie into the existing well below the sea bed surface) are being drilled, and will be used to pump cement into the well bore and seal it off. This will be able to stop flow from the well, the down side to it is that it takes time.

[Mama Shawna]

To all who have replied (even the snarky ones) THANK YOU! I knew I could count on Freepers to set this straight. I don’t post my own threads a lot, and am not into reading all the technical stuff that goes on in a lot of these oil spill threads, but appreciate everyone’s time in replying, and setting my mind at ease.

[1COUNTER-MORTER-68]

As I've posted on other threads they need to drill more

wells around the blowout and lay another undersea pipeline

to Port Fourchon,,,

It mite take 4 wells or 6,,,or,,,?,,,

The last I read Thunder Horse is near there,,,

The Cajun Express should be brought in too,,,

They could do this if they wanted to,,,

Eazzy!!!

The more rigs drilling near that blowout the faster the

field can be sucked down so it can be capped,,,

Why won't they do it???,,,

Because the price of oil will drop like a stone if that

much oil was dumped on the market all at once...