Mosin Nagant Rifle Question

My Gun Case | June 04, 2010 | Humblegunner

[humblegunner]

I have a question for our resident Free Republic firearms experts.

Several years ago I purchased a Mosin Nagant M-44 Carbine at
a gun show. (Винтовка Мосина 7.62 x 54R) I like it.

I have never fired it. Why? I don't trust the ammunition. I have several
boxes (unmarked) of what the vendor at the gun show CLAIMED was
7.62 x 54R. Trouble is, the base of the casings are NOT stamped with
the caliber. What they have stamped there is 21 and 87. My camera is
not good enough to pick this up well, but you get the idea:

The rounds will chamber with no problem. But the lack of a stamped
caliber still bothered me. I stuck one of the rounds into the end of the
barrel to see what kind of fit there was. Turns out the projectile will
not fit more than a little past halfway into the barrel. I was not enthused by this.

By way of comparison, I tried the same trick with a Remington 30.06 and
the projectile fits almost all the way into the barrel. Big difference.

What I'd like to know is if anyone has a Mosin Nagant laying around that
they have safely fired with this type of ammo, let me know.
Maybe stick a round into the end of the barrel and see if that fit is normal for the rifle.

In a couple for weeks I'm going to the TexasCowboy 5th Annual Memorial Shoot
and I'd like to take the old Mosin. So far it's just been a neat addition to
the gun case but I'd rather put it into active service.. without blowing anybody up.

(I'm looking at Eaker here)

[SWAMPSNIPER]

I checked, the 7.62X54r uses .311 dia bullets, the bore is slightly larger than for a 30/06.

[TonyInOhio]

You're good to go. That's Hungarian 7.62x54R, and the fact that the bullet won't go farther into the muzzle end means it has a decent bore. Many of the M44s are counterbored or just plain shot out, but yours looks like a nice one.

Have any liberal shooting friends? You could also have them try it first. :)

P.S. I would recommend extending the bayonet while shooting - not only is it more accurate, but the bayonet itself will rattle if you leave it folded while shooting.

[humblegunner]

HG, that ammo you have in the photos is definitely 7.62x54R

I'm glad to hear it.

roach-spotted cardboard packets secured by ancient string spun by Russian witches under Ivan the Terrible

Those witches spun some awesome string, I'll tell ya what.

[mylife]

Ive got an old nagant model 91 made in 1897.
I just tried the bullet in the barrel thing, it went all the way in! WTF!! even the case! WTF!
It has strong rifling. WTF?!!!

[WayneS]

roach-spotted cardboard packets secured by ancient string spun by Russian witches under Ivan the Terrible

I have about 500 rounds from that exact same "lot".

[humblegunner]

I just tried the bullet in the barrel thing, it went all the way in! WTF!!

Stop dropping those .22 rimfires into your ammo box.

[Fido969]

The only problem I’ve run into with Mosins is headspace in some of the older ones.

Excess headspace shows up as failure to fire (because the firing pin can’t hit the primer hard enough), split cases and sometimes difficulty extracting, although Mosins can have difficulty extracting for other reasons, such as cosmoline traces in the chamber, burr in the chamber, etc.

[humblegunner]

Have any liberal shooting friends?

Alas, no. I may hire an illegal though.

P.S. I would recommend extending the bayonet while shooting

I'll give a shot. (Pun intended.)

[Syntyr]

Looks like you are ready to rock and roll to me.

[mylife]

LOL! I tried it in my new 1946 91/33 and it did like yours does.

Ive fired the old 91 and it shoots just as good as the other one.

It feels like the rifle ends like an inch before the end of the barrel.

[mylife]

rifling

[lentulusgracchus]

By the way, the 7.62x54R round and the .30-06 competed back in 1901 or 1903 at both Russian and U.S. government selection trials. We know how the trials came out, but ballistically the two rounds are almost identical. With .308, they make a ballistic triplet of sorts, hard to tell apart. Looking at a couple of charts, I've sometimes wondered why NATO bothered converting to .308. Politics, I would guess -- and the French. Who then took their marbles and went home.

[humblegunner]

Mosin nagant VS AK-47 Vs AR-15:

That's hilarious.

[Fido969]

Ive got an old nagant model 91 made in 1897. I just tried the bullet in the barrel thing, it went all the way in! WTF!! even the case! WTF! Is it a Finn rework or rechamber? (see "SA" stamped on the receiver)? Also some WWI Austrain captures (see marking: "AZF") were rebored and rechambered to take the Astro-Hungarian 8x50R. I'm sure a Mosin from 1897 has a lot of history attached to it. "For Collectors Only: The Mosin-Nagant Rifle" by Terence W. Lapin has a lot of information about Mosins.

[lentulusgracchus]

Sort of interesting how Ruskies weapons are idiot proof; reflecting a peasant illiterate army.

The Russians always did that. They fought Napoleon with the latest and greatest equipment left over from the Thirty Years' War.

And their marshals squandered their men in combat..... a famous 18th-century Austrian marshal was eventually tried for treason for throwing men away like that by his unamused Hapsburg employer. But the Russians have always done that, I'm sure you've read about their 1945 Berlin campaign.

[mylife]

Russian, Sestroyesk arsenal.

[Nakota]

“Ive got an old nagant model 91 made in 1897.
I just tried the bullet in the barrel thing, it went all the way in! WTF!! even the case! WTF!
It has strong rifling. WTF?!!!”

Probably counter bored at the muzzle.

[Neoliberalnot]

Send it to me and I will do the test fire. Neo

[mylife]

Thanks.

[Nakota]

That looks like the same ammo I use in my M/Ns. The ammo is probably corrosive so remember to swab out the barrel with very hot, soapy water before final cleaning.

Keep in mind that the m44 was sighted in with the bayonet extended.