To the Suckers of Freerepublic Who Have Paid Their Mortgages On-time

loansafe.org ^ | 2/22/2010 | Vanity

[rumrunner]

So, after waiting for more than five years to finally buy a house that I thought was fairly priced in socal, and having paid out about $150,000 in rent over that time period, I'm about to close on a short sale.

The banks/investors (BofA, Citi) are going to "lose" about $400,000 on the house. The guy that's selling the house never lived in it. He never put a dime of his own money it. He will still have his own house in a different part of the county. He will keep that house. He is out nothing.

I did a little digging about short sales and came upon this gem this month:

Guy buys a house in Florida. $290k mortgage. Takes out a Heloc of $140,000. Uses it for his S corp business. He asks that his loan be modified. Citi says "sure". He settles the entire Heloc for $15,000 and the Heloc is now extinguished. Yes, 10% on the dollar. He still has his business and other assets.

This was his reply in that forum:

"WOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I just got my letter!!!!! $15,000.00 or 10% whichever is greater!!! I just settled 140K for 15K!!!!

THANK YOU xxxx You guys are the best!!!! I'm sooo happy right now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was never behind on my 1st or 2nd. My credit is still good, the only remark will show paid in full but less than agreed on my credit file."

[parsifal]

LOL! Maybe the History Channel or NPR. Prairie Home Companion?

parsy, who has shored these remnants, or whatever Eliot said

[Mr. Jeeves]

Maybe what really has you mad, it that what you have been taking as a fair system, isn’t.

Well, that applies not only to banking, but also to employment, the judicial system, and voting.

[parsifal]

Then you guys might find this interesting. Usury in a historical setting. Its a hoot:

http://www.affil.org/consumer_rsc/usury.php

parsy, who figures he was doing the Lord’s work

[latina4dubya]

ping

[Viking2002]

That is what the wife and I are doing, to a degree. We're squirreling away money in places where most people don't have places. We lucked into taking over the mortgage on our current house from her brother (ain't families grand?), and we're less than two years from paying it off and burning the note. Kept the property taxes down by filing a homestead exemption. We've got our general area of relocation picked out, and are slowly ramping up to find the ideal piece of mountain land through tax auctions. Once we have that nailed down and we're ready to pull the trigger, we're willing to take an offer for significantly less than assessed value to utilize toward our down payment, and to hell with the banks and mortgage companies. If we own perc-tested land outright and put down at least 50%, someone will give us a fair shake. About ten years ago, we went through this, but with much less equity. After all the lion-taming and ass-kissing requisite to get the financing secured, the whole thing went into the crapper when we went to the county assessors office to get the plat for the land we were buying, and it was IN A FREAKIN' FLOOD ZONE!!!! LOL In hindsight, I think that was The Good Lord's way of making us hold out until we got a little more marital mileage under our belts with each other, and decided what we really wanted. For us, it's gonna be an open-rafter log home in the mountains with a walkaround fireplace in the great room, on at least five acres of land (with crappie pond or trout stream, thank you), or it's nothing. And I don't care how much longer it takes. I plan on being buried in the back yard, but I don't plan on going yet, so I ain't in no hurry. (But in lieu of my plans to live until I'm a little old Viking, I'll probably have my carcass interred at the veteran's cemetery back home, a short walk from Papa Viking. They can just throw a stone plaque on top of my hole, reading, 'PFC-For-Life Viking, U.S. Army. He never did get anything right.' LMAO)

[BunnySlippers]

Islam condemns usury. Comfy yet?

[mad_as_he$$]

That is what I expected to happen.

[Nervous Tick]

>> this is not an ethical issue. It is merely a contractual issue.

I disagree.

I have never undertaken a significant financial obligation that was not backed by what is called a “promissory note”.

The “promissory” verbage is (ethically) important. It is worded that way because the borrower is PROMISING to repay the money they borrowed as agreed.

It is extremely clear in any promissory note that the essence of entering this contract is that the borrower will pay it back as agreed.

Giving back the collateral because of non-payment is never viewed by EITHER party GOING INTO the contract as an acceptable option. It is a REMEDY in the event that the borrower does NOT uphold the agreement.

You know this as well as I do.

Your position is playing games with semantics and demanding that others see the world through your distorted glasses. Sorry, but I know better.

[mad_as_he$$]

Parsy, who is in fine form today!

[parsifal]

You’re on a slippery slope.

parsy, who slipped and busted his. . .

[MurrietaMadman]

Congratulations!

I think. /head scratching smile.

[Shimmer1]

read this ping

[parsifal]

I was thinking like Dante putting them on a lower rung of Hell than murderers. Or the Romans, those well known bunch of Liberals, penalizing usurers twice as much as robbers and thieves.

parsy, who note the Romans were pretty practical

[moehoward]

"And here is his follow up:

“Guys I may have just been duped by Citi Mortgage, I sent in the 15K as the letter states, now I’m getting calls from collections asking where is our 125K? Now that I’m readin this letter it states they are accepting a short payoff of 15K OR the net proceeds from settlement, whichever is greater. WHat the hell does “net proceeds from settlement” mean? Could I have been swindled here? The letter also goes on to say the money I send in is theirs to keep. If they try to say they never agreed on 15K I guess they can right?”

Now who is the sucka?"

Now that is a far more common post over at loansafe.org. Nearly all of the posts are from folks that are just trying to get the banks to modify their loans. In most cases they get told they qualify for a modification, make payments of X amount until the final docs come.

Problem is the foreclosure clock continues to tick in the background, the final docs rarely come, and sometimes even when those are signed the banks renege.

There's plenty of reason to be pissed off alright.

[Nervous Tick]

>> I hate deadbeats.

That’s not very politically correct. :-)

The funny thing is, those who think they “outsmarted the system” aren’t bright enough to realize that in the long run, they are making what used to be a very workable system completely dysfunctional.

That ain’t good.

The repercussions of “deadbeats are cool ‘cause Barney Fwank said so!” will be bad for business. And what’s bad for business is bad for employees. And what’s bad for employees is bad for those who depend on them for food on the table. And so on.

No Rhodes scholars, this bunch of deadbeats here.

[Paradox]

I recently bought a foreclosure in Florida. I did a TON of research, and I'll tell you what, each time I hear that those being foreclosed on are victims, I want to puke. Sure, some of the people are, maybe most of them, but ALOT of them played the system, and some of them "lost", like the gentleman you were talking about.

I know several people in the area who have stopped paying on their mortgages now for 2 years, living rent free in a nearly new home. Then, before they finally get kicked out, they will sell off all the appliances, water heater, A/C unit, fans, lights, interior doors, cabinets, faucets.. and then the real a-holes will deliberately trash the house, by putting holes in the walls and breaking the windows.

I feel bad for people who really are victims of circumstance, but at least in these parts, I'd say those are the minority.

[FreedomPoster]

I agree with all of that.

The problem starts when the gov’t starts bailing out the banks using my tax dollars, or worse, with fiat dollars that devalue the dollars I have saved. Then you have a truly immoral situation.

[Hot Tabasco]

A man’s word should be good. Period.

I recently saw an interview of a multi-billionaire by the name of Jon M. Huntsman, founder and benefactor of the Huntsman Cancer Institute in Utah.

During the interview he was talking about honor, integrity and promises kept. He related the story of meeting the CEO of an oil company prior to the sale of one of his many chemical companies and agreeing to a sale price of approx. $250 Million and finalized it with a hand shake.

During the following 6 months to a year that it took the attorneys to do the paperwork, the value of the company rose to around $500 million. On the day that the sale was to be finalized, the oil company was prepared to pay him the current value of his company but Mr. Huntsman refused the offer and would only accept the original price offered.

His explanation was that a man's handshake is as good as his word and if his word doesn't mean anything then the man is worthless.........

Mr. Huntsman is a remarkable person and both he and his wife have battled cancer thus his cancer institute. He has already made arrangements to dispurse his entire fortune before he dies...........

[parsifal]

Here’s some more fun stuff off that link:

Old Testament

The Prophet Ezekiel includes usury in a list of “abominable things,” along with rape, murder, robbery and idolatry. Ezekiel 18:19-13.

800-600 B.C.

Both Plato and Aristotle believed usury was immoral and unjust. The Greeks at first regulate interest, and then deregulate it. After deregulation, there was so much unregulated debt that Athenians were sold into slavery and threatened revolt.

If you interested in something really fascinating, look up Solon and the Great Shaking Off.

parsy, who says being a deadbeat is a lot more fun if you put it into an historical context

[who_would_fardels_bear]

"parsy, who has shored these remnants, or whatever Eliot said"

See my tagline.