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What of Freemasonry?
The "Net" | May 23, 2009 | logic 'n reason

Posted on 05/24/2009 10:20:53 AM PDT by Logic n' Reason

I have become very curious about the Freemasons and freemasonry in general.
How does it "fit in" with the group of Christian religions...how about islam? What are the views and opinions of those at this site?


TOPICS: Education; Miscellaneous; Science; Society
KEYWORDS: 2b1ask1; adamweishaupt; blazingstar; bringsoutthekooks; freemason; freemasonry; illuminati; lucifer; masonry; snakehandlers; society
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To: Elsie

> Thus Masonry is the centre of their union ...

In the same way that “Conservatism” is the center of OUR union on the FRee Republic. In the same way that the Chicago White Sox are the center of the Chicago White Sox Fan Club’s union.

You are looking for sinister intent where none exists.


301 posted on 05/30/2009 5:19:48 AM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (Is mise an ceann-cinnidh. Cha ghéill mi do dhuine. Fàg am bealach.)
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To: Elsie; mnehring
Would you be happier, Elsie, if it went more like this:

Freemasonry's singular purpose is to make good men betterinto servants of Satan and its bonds of friendship, compassion and brotherly loveHatred, Dam'nation and Enmity have survived even the most divisiveunifying political, military and religious conflicts efforts through the centuries.

I rather suspect you would.

302 posted on 05/30/2009 5:28:18 AM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (Is mise an ceann-cinnidh. Cha ghéill mi do dhuine. Fàg am bealach.)
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To: JoeProBono

Where/when is that letterhead/postage from?


303 posted on 05/30/2009 7:00:33 AM PDT by Robert A Cook PE (I can only donate monthly, but socialists' ABBCNNBCBS continue to lie every day!)
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To: Robert A. Cook, PE
"Where/when is that letterhead/postage from?"

I don't remember what I had for breakfast;-}

304 posted on 05/30/2009 7:04:41 AM PDT by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet)
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To: Elsie

***”The faithful who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion....”***

You are correct, Elsie, as you so often are.

***A number of Catholics became Freemasons assuming that the Church had softened its stance.***

Also correct. I attained the 32nd degree Scottish rite and made it halfway up the York Rite before a job move interrupted my advancement and then I was made aware of the proscription by talking to the Franciscan pastor of my new parish.

For a while, I was on a mailing list in Indiana of those who were both KofC and Master Masons. I declined at that point to further participate.


305 posted on 05/30/2009 7:11:38 AM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: narses; Logic n' Reason
The Church's teachings on Freemasonry have not changed since it was first condemned. The most current doctrinal releases on the subject come from the 1980s; but as they were written by Cardinal Ratzinger, I would be highly doubtful that anything would have changed:
CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH


DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS

 

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church’s decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.

This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance in due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic association remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who enrol in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February 1981 (cf. AAS 73 1981 pp. 240-241; English language edition of L’Osservatore Romano, 9 March 1981).

In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this Sacred Congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, 26 November 1983.

Joseph Card. RATZINGER
Prefect

+ Fr. Jerome Hamer, O.P.
Titular Archbishop of Lorium

Secretary


REFLECTIONS A YEAR AFTER DECLARATION
OF CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH

Irreconcilability between Christian faith and Freemasonry

 

On 26 November 1983 the S. Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (S.C.D.F.) published a declaration on Masonic associations (cf. AAS LXXVI [1984], 300). At a distance of little more than a year from its publication, it may be useful to outline briefly the significance of this document.

Since the Church began to declare her mind concerning Freemasonry, her negative judgment has been inspired by many reasons, both practical and doctrinal. She judged Freemasonry not merely responsible for subversive activity in her regard, but from the earliest pontifical documents on the subject and in particular in the Encyclical Humanum Genus by Leo XIII (20 April 1884), the Magisterium of the Church has denounced in Freemasonry philosophical ideas and moral conceptions opposed to Catholic doctrine. For Leo XIII, they essentially led back to a rationalistic naturalism, the inspiration of its plans and activities against the Church. In his Letter to the Italian people Custodi (8 December 1892), he wrote: «Let us remember that Christianity and Freemasonry are essentially irreconcilable, so that enrolment in one means separation from the other».

One could not therefore omit to take into consideration the positions of Freemasonry from the doctrinal point of view, when, during the years from 1970‑1980, the Sacred Congregation was in correspondence with some Episcopal Conferences especially interested in this problem because of the dialogue undertaken by some Catholic personages with representatives of some Masonic lodges which declared that they were not hostile, but were even favourable, to the Church.

Now more thorough study has led the S.C.D.F. to confirm its conviction of the basic irreconcilability between the principles of Freemasonry and those of the Christian faith.

Prescinding therefore from consideration of the practical attitude of the various lodges, whether of hostility towards the Church or not, with its declaration of 26 November 1983 the S.C.D.F. intended to take a position on the most profound and, for that matter, the most essential part of the problem: that is, on the level of the irreconcilability of the principles, which means on the level of the faith, and its moral requirements.

Beginning from this doctrinal point of view, and in continuity, moreover, with the traditional position of the Church as the aforementioned documents of Leo XIII attest, there arise then the necessary practical consequences, which are valid for all those faithful who may possibly be members of Freemasonry.

Nevertheless, with regard to the affirmation of the irreconcilability between the principles of Freemasonry and the Catholic faith, from some parts are now heard the objection that essential to Freemasonry would be precisely the fact that it does not impose any «principles», in the sense of a philosophical or religious position which is binding for all of its members, but rather that it gathers together, beyond the limits of the various religions and world views, men of good will on the basis of humanistic values comprehensible and acceptable to everyone.

Freemasonry would constitute a cohesive element for all those who believe in the Architect of the Universe and who feel committed with regard to those fundamental moral orientations which are defined, for example, in the Decalogue; it would not separate anyone from his religion, but on the contrary, would constitute an incentive to embrace that religion more strongly.

The multiple historical and philosophical problems which are hidden in these affirmations cannot be discussed here. It is certainly not necessary to emphasize that following the Second Vatican Council the Catholic Church too is pressing in the direction of collaboration between all men of good will. Nevertheless, becoming a member of Freemasonry decidedly exceeds this legitimate collaboration and has a much more important and final significance than this.

Above all, it must be remembered that the community of «Freemasons» and its moral obligations are presented as a progressive system of symbols of an extremely binding nature. The rigid rule of secrecy which prevails there further strengthens the weight of the interaction of signs and ideas. For the members this climate of secrecy entails above all the risk of becoming an instrument of strategies unknown to them.

Even if it is stated that relativism is not assumed as dogma, nevertheless there is really proposed a relativistic symbolic concept and therefore the relativizing value of such a moral-ritual community, far from being eliminated, proves on the contrary to be decisive.

In this context the various religious communities to which the individual members of the lodges belong can be considered only as simple institutionalizations of a broader and elusive truth. The value of these institutionalizations therefore appears to be inevitably relative with respect to this broader truth, which instead is shown in the community of good will, that is, in the Masonic fraternity.

In any case, for a Catholic Christian, it is not possible to live his relation with God in a twofold mode, that is, dividing it into a supraconfessional humanitarian form and an interior Christian form. He cannot cultivate relations of two types with God, nor express his relation with the Creator through symbolic forms of two types. That would be something completely different from that collaboration, which to him is obvious, with all those who are committed to doing good, even if beginning from different principles. On the one hand, a Catholic Christian cannot at the same time share in the full communion of Christian brotherhood and, on the other, look upon his Christian brother, from the Masonic perspective, as an «outsider».

Even when, as stated earlier, there were no explicit obligation to profess relativism as doctrine, nevertheless the relativizing force of such a brotherhood, by its very intrinsic logic, has the capacity to transform the structure of the act of faith in such a radical way as to become unacceptable to a Christian, «to whom his faith is dear» (Leo XIII).

Moreover, this distortion of the fundamental structure of the act of faith is carried out for the most part in a gentle way and without being noticed: firm adherence to the truth of God, revealed in the Church, becomes simple membership, in an institution, considered as a particular expressive form alongside other expressive forms, more or less just as possible and valid, of man’s turning toward the eternal.

The temptation to go in this direction is much stronger today, inasmuch as it corresponds fully to certain convictions prevalent in contemporary mentality. The opinion that truth cannot be known is a typical characteristic of our era and, at the same time, an essential element in its general crisis.

Precisely by considering all these elements, the Declaration of the Sacred Congregation affirms that membership in Masonic associations «remains forbidden by the Church», and the faithful who enrolls in them «are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion».

With this last statement, the Sacred Congregation points out to the faithful that this membership objectively constitutes a grave sin and by specifying that the members of a Masonic association may not receive Holy Communion, it intends to enlighten the conscience of the faithful about a grave consequence which must derive from their belonging to a Masonic lodge.

Finally, the Sacred Congregation declares that «it is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above». In this regard, the text also refers to the Declaration of 17 February 1981, which already reserved to the Apostolic See all pronouncements on the nature of these associations which may have implied derogations from the Canon Law then in force (Can. 2335). In the same way, the new document issued by the S.C.D.F. in November 1983 expresses identical intentions of reserve concerning pronouncements which would differ from the judgment expressed here on the irreconcilability of Masonic principles with the Catholic faith, on the gravity of the act of joining a lodge and on the consequences which arise from it for receiving Holy Communion. This disposition points out that, despite the diversity which may exist among Masonic obediences, in particular in their declared attitude towards the Church, the Apostolic See discerns some common principles in them which require the same evaluation by all ecclesiastical authorities.

In making this Declaration, the S.C.D.F. has not intended to disown the efforts made by those who, with the due authorization of this Congregation, have sought to establish a dialogue with representatives of Freemasonry. But since there was the possibility of spreading among the faithful the erroneous opinion that membership in a Masonic lodge was lawful, it felt that it was its duty to make known to them the authentic thought of the Church in this regard and to warn them about a membership incompatible with the Catholic faith.

Only Jesus Christ is, in fact, the Teacher of Truth, and only in him can Christians find the light and the strength to live according to God’s plan, working for the true good of their brethren.

 

[Article from L'Osservatore Romano dated March 11, 1985]

For more resources on the subject, please see the following papal writings (discussing Freemasonry specifically and secret societies in general):

And there's more, but you can see that the Church's position today is the Church's position back in the day on this issue.

306 posted on 05/30/2009 7:12:31 AM PDT by markomalley (Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus)
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To: swmobuffalo

The Declaration Against Freemasonry - By the Holy Synod of the Church of Greece

The Bishops of the Church of Greece in their session of October 12, 1933, concerned themselves with the study and examination of the secret international organization, Freemasonry. They heard with attention the introductory exposition of the Commission of four Bishops appointed by the Holy Synod at its last session; also the opinion of the Theological Faculty of the University of Athens, and the particular opinion of Prof. Panag Bratsiotis which was appended thereto. They also took into consideration publications on this question in Greece and abroad. After a discussion they arrived at the following conclusions, accepted unanimously by all the Bishops.

“Freemasonry is not simply a philanthropic union or a philosophical school, but constitutes a mystagogical system which reminds us of the ancient heathen mystery-religions and cults—from which it descends and is their continuation and regeneration. This is not only admitted by prominent teachers in the lodges, but they declare it with pride, affirming literally: “Freemasonry is the only survival of the ancient mysteries and can be called the guardian of them;” Freemasonry is a direct offspring of the Egyptian mysteries; “the humble workshop of the Masonic Lodge is nothing else than the caves and the darkness of the cedars of India and the unknown depths of the Pyramids and the crypts of the magnificent temples of Isis; in the Greek mysteries of Freemasonry, having passed along the luminous roads of knowledge under the mysteriarchs Prometheus, Dionysus and Orpheus, formulated the eternal laws of the Universe!

“Such a link between Freemasonry and the ancient idolatrous mysteries is also manifested by all that is enacted and performed at the initiations. As in the rites of the ancient idolatrous mysteries the drama of the labors and death of the mystery god was repeated, and in the imitative repetition of this drama the initiate dies together with the patron of the mystery religion, who was always a mythical person symbolizing the Sun of nature which dies in winter and is regenerated in spring, so it is also, in the initiation of the third degree, of the patron of Freemasonry Hiram and a kind of repetition of his death, in which the initiate suffers with him, struck by the same instruments and on the same parts of the body as Hiram. According to the confession of a prominent teacher of Freemasonry Hiram is “as Osiris, as Mithra, and as Bacchus, one of the personifications of the Sun.”

“Thus Freemasonry is, as granted, a mystery-religion, quite different, separate, and alien to the Christian faith. This is shown without any doubt by the fact that it possesses its own temples with altars, which are characterized by prominent teachers as “workshops which cannot have less history and holiness than the Church” and as temples of virtue and wisdom where the Supreme Being is worshipped and the truth is taught. It possesses its own religious ceremonies, such as the ceremony of adoption or the masonic baptism, the ceremony of conjugal acknowledgement or the masonic marriage, the masonic memorial service, the consecration of the masonic temple, and so on. It possesses its own initiations, its own ceremonial ritual, its own hierarchical order and a definite discipline. As may be concluded from the masonic agapes and from the feasting of the winter and summer solstices with religious meals and general rejoicings, it is a physiolatric religion.

“It is true that it may seem at first that Freemasonry can be reconciled with every other religion, because it is not interested directly in the religion to which its initiates belong. This is, however, explained by its syncretistic character and proves that in this point also it is an offspring and a continuation of ancient idolatrous mysteries which accepted for initiation worshippers of all gods. But as the mystery religions, in spite of the apparent spirit of tolerance and acceptance of foreign gods, lead to a syncretism which undermined and gradually shook confidence in other religions, thus Freemasonry today, which seeks to embrace in itself gradually all mankind and which promises to give moral perfection and knowledge of truth, is lifting itself to the position of a kind of super-religion, looking on all religions (without excepting Christianity) as inferior to itself. Thus it develops in its initiates the idea that only in masonic lodges is performed the shaping and the smoothing of the unsmoothed and unhewn stone. And the fact alone that Freemasonry creates a brotherhood excluding all other brotherhoods outside it (which are considered by Freemasonry as “uninstructed”, even when they are Christian) proves clearly its pretensions to be a super-religion. This means that by masonic initiation, a Christian becomes a brother of the Muslim, the Buddhist, or any kind of rationalist, while the Christian not initiated in Freemasonry becomes to him an outsider.

“On the other hand, Freemasonry in prominently exalting knowledge and in helping free research as “putting no limit in the search of truth” (according to its rituals and constitution), and more than this by adopting the so-called natural ethic, shows itself in this sense to be in sharp contradiction with the Christian religion. For the Christian religion exalts faith above all, confining human reason to the limits traced by Divine Revelation and leading to holiness through the supernatural action of grace. In other words, which Christianity, as a religion of Revelation, possessing its rational and superrational dogmas and truths, asks for faith first, and grounds its moral structure on the super-natural Divine Grace, Freemasonry has only natural truth and brings to the knowledge of its initiates free thinking and investigation through reason only. It bases its moral structure only on the natural forces of man, and has only natural aims.

“Thus, the incompatible contradiction between Christianity and Freemasonry is quite clear. It is natural that various Churches of other denominations have taken a stand against Freemasonry. Not only has the Western Church branded for its own reasons the masonic movement by numerous Papal encyclicals, but Lutheran, Methodist and Presbyterian communities have also declared it to be incompatible with Christianity. Much more has the Orthodox Catholic Church, maintaining in its integrity the treasure of Christian faith proclaimed against it every time that the question of Freemasonry has been raised. Recently, the Inter-Orthodox Commission which met on Mount Athos and in which the representatives of all the Autocephalous Orthodox Churches took part, has characterized Freemasonry as a “false and anti-Christian system.”

The assembly of the Bishops of the Church of Greece in the above mentioned session heard with relief and accepted the following conclusions which were drawn from the investigations and discussions by its President His Grace Archbishop Chrysostom of Athens:

“Freemasonry cannot be at all compatible with Christianity as far as it is a secret organization, acting and teaching in mystery and secret and deifying rationalism. Freemasonry accepts as its members not only Christians, but also Jews and Muslims. Consequently clergymen cannot be permitted to take part in this association. I consider as worthy of degradation every clergyman who does so. It is necessary to urge upon all who entered it without due thought and without examining what Freemasonry is, to sever all connections with it, for Christianity alone is the religion which teaches absolute truth and fulfills the religious and moral needs of men. Unanimously and with one voice all the Bishops of the Church of Greece have approved what was said, and we declare that all the faithful children of the Church must stand apart from Freemasonry. With unshaken faith in Our Lord Jesus Christ “in whom we have our redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our sins, according to the riches of His Grace, whereby He abounds to us in all wisdom and prudence” (Ephes. 1, 7-9) possessing the truth revealed by Him and preached by the Apostles, “not in persuasive words of wisdom, but in the partaking in the Divine Sacraments through which we are sanctified and saved by eternal life, we must not fall from the grace of Christ by becoming partakers of other mysteries. It is not lawful to belong at the same time to Christ and to search for redemption and mora1 perfection outside Him. For these reasons true Christianity is incompatible with Freemasonry.

“Therefore, all who have become involved in the initiations of masonic mysteries must from this moment sever all relations with masonic lodges and activities, being sure that they are thereby of a certainty renewing their links with our one Lord and Savior which were weakened by ignorance and by a wrong sense of values. The Assembly of the Bishops of the Church of Greece expects this particularly and with love from the initiates of the lodges, being convinced that most of them have received masonic initiation not realizing that by it they were passing into another religion, but on the contrary from ignorance, thinking that they had done nothing contrary to the faith of their fathers. Recommending them to the sympathy, and in no wise to the hostility or hatred of the faithful children of the Church, the Assembly of the Bishops calls them to pray with her from the heart in Christian love, that the one Lord Jesus Christ “the way, the truth and the life” may illumine and return to the truth who in ignorance have gone astray.”


307 posted on 05/30/2009 7:25:17 AM PDT by SQUID
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To: narses
Here is a good read on the matter.

My take on this is to not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. Yes we all have jobs that cause us to come into contact with unbelievers but the bond that Freemasons share is a much stronger bond.

From this passage (2 Corinthians 6:14-18):
Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness? 15What accord has Christ with Belial? Or what portion does a believer share with an unbeliever? 16What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said,

    "I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them,
   and I will be their God,
   and they shall be my people.
17Therefore go out from their midst,
   and be separate from them, says the Lord,
and touch no unclean thing;
   then I will welcome you,
18 and I will be a father to you,
   and you shall be sons and daughters to me,
says the Lord Almighty."



As people mentioned earlier, Freemasonry is universalism where all people who believe in a deity are joined together.

308 posted on 05/30/2009 7:29:24 AM PDT by LuxMaker (The Constitution is a mere thing of wax in the hands of the judiciary, Thomas J 1819)
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To: LuxMaker
Further expounding on the above scripture.
309 posted on 05/30/2009 7:33:09 AM PDT by LuxMaker (The Constitution is a mere thing of wax in the hands of the judiciary, Thomas J 1819)
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To: DieHard the Hunter
Moreover, Religion (along with Politics) is a forbidden topic in Lodge.

Not according to what I posted...

No private piques nor quarrels about nations, families, religions or politics ...

310 posted on 05/30/2009 7:36:05 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: DieHard the Hunter
I rather suspect you would.

Then you suspect wrongly.

I merely am posting stuff from PRO Masonic sites; am I not?

And things from the Bible that shed a different light on them...


Surely there is nothing wrong with showing a subject from differing viewpoints; is there?

311 posted on 05/30/2009 7:39:30 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: MarkBsnr
I declined at that point to further participate.

Isn't CHOOSING one of the greatest gifts we have?!

312 posted on 05/30/2009 7:41:10 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie

***Isn’t CHOOSING one of the greatest gifts we have?!***

I was shown the error of my ways and I repented. It is a stain on my soul that I will take to my grave and I expect to be called out on it by Him at my Judgement because I did not make the right decision based upon information which was available that I declined to consider.

Most of the Masons that I have been privileged to know have been good men and well intentioned. It is the institution that is not right. I regret having joined it. Yet, it has provided me with insight as to the rituals of the LDS and has provided much mirth when we discuss Temple rituals.


313 posted on 05/30/2009 7:54:15 AM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: Kansas58
For a historical context of the Church's stand against Freemasonry, I would recommend that you review some of the earlier documents I cited in post #306.

The belief was (whether justified or not, I don't have enough information to say or not) that the Freemasons were, in large part, the French Revolution, Italian Revolution, and many of the anti-clerical movements around the world that plagued the late 18th and 19th Centuries.

But I think the largest part of the dispute is a Utopian belief that I have seen underscore a lot of Masonic thought. Basically that the Grand Architect gave us the earth and that it is up to us to use his tools to build the New Jerusalem: paradise on earth. Thus, there is a connection to some of the socialist theory developed in the 19th Century.

The theme of this year’s conference, ‘Visions of Utopia: masonic, religious and esoteric’, explored a variety of themes which either underpin, compliment, or run in parallel to, themes contained in the many of the degrees of Freemasonry. The word utopia in Greek means ‘no place’, and as such, the word has traditionally been used to allude to a perfect place or state, which is somewhat analogous to the masonic concept of an idealised temple or a well-ordered society.

The term was made famous by a statesman and humanist of the English Renaissance, Sir Thomas More (1478–1535), who in 1516, wrote of a fictional island called Utopia just off the Atlantic coast. As Dr. Chloe Houston, a lecturer in early modern literature at the University of Reading explained, More himself referred to Utopia as ‘Noland’ or a place that does not exist. More modelled his imaginary island state on Plato’s Republic and described it as having the perfect social, legal and political system, where everyone was equal, where everyone shunned war, where poverty had been completely eradicated, and where all religions were tolerated.

Another well-known thinker who wrote on utopianism was the Dominican, Tommaso Campanella (1568-1639), who was the focus of a presentation by Dr. Peter Forshaw, a lecturer at Birkbeck College, London University. Campanella, who lived a century after More, famously rejected the orthodox philosophy of Aristotle and championed various unorthodox beliefs. For his literary defence of Galileo and the Copernican system, he spent much of his life in gaol courtesy of the Inquisition.

While he was incarcerated that Campanella wrote one of the most important utopian works of the era –– The City of the Sun. The work took the form of a dialogue between a Genoese sailor, who had sailed with Columbus to the New World, and a knight Hospitaller.

In the work, he described his imaginary city as being of a philosophical hue, a communistic republic where all things were governed according to nature; even the city’s concentric walls were related the seven planets of traditional astrology, which as Dr. Forshaw explained, reflected Campanella’s interest in natural magic, common to many intellectuals of the time.

Dr. Guido Giglioni of the Warburg Institute presented a paper on Francis Bacon’s New Atlantis, in which he spoke of an ideal state called Bensalem where both the temporal and religious establishments promoted the advancement of learning in all its forms, in an attempt to understand the ‘secret motion of things’.

Professor Tony Lentin, of Clare College, Cambridge, gave a fascinating address on an eighteenth-century utopian vision, Journey to the land of Ophir, by Russian Prince Mikhail Mikhailovich Scherbatov in 1784.

Prince Scherbatov was Imperial Historiographer to Catherine the Great and is widely recognised as one of the most important commentators on her reign. However, his path to political advancement was personally blocked by Catherine as she was aware that he had secretly written critiques of her absolutist rule. Consequently, many scholars now believe that Scherbatov, when writing of his utopian land, may have couched his politically-charged beliefs in a literary narrative, and thereby proffered a subtle blueprint for potential social reforms. Intriguingly, Prince Scherbatov was also a Freemason, and in the 1770s he was a member of the Lodge of Equality as well as a Royal Arch Chapter.

Continuing in this political vein, Pierre Mollier, Director of the Library and Museum of the Grand Orient of France, gave a fascinating paper on several social utopians of the nineteenth-century. Concentrating predominantly on the social theorist, Charles Fourier (1772-1837), Mollier explained that Fourier believed French society should be reorganised into self-sufficient units which would be scientifically designed so as to offer the maximum amount of co-operation and self-fulfilment.

This ‘utopian’ society would radically alter the concepts of marriage, private property and the way people lived. Mollier also pointed out that Fourier’s theories emerged at a time when French Freemasonry was changing, when the lodges were moving away from philanthropy and esotericism, and were beginning to develop an interest in social issues and new religious concepts.

Consequently, many French Freemasons began to adopt Fourier’s theories. In 1836 one lodge in Brest, Les Elus de Sully, even advocated that the Grand Orient of France should change its name to ‘The Disciples of Fourier’, a move no doubt assisted by the fact that Fourier was himself a mason.

But as Professor Wouter Hanegraaff (holder of the Chair of History of Hermetic philosophy and related currents at the University of Amsterdam) pointed out in a paper, ‘Utopias of the Mind’, utopias need not necessarily be understood as ideal societies in a three-dimensional sense. On the contrary, if we look again at the original meaning of utopia, he argued, it is essentially ‘no place’, that is, it does not physically exist.

Instead, such places belong to the realm of the imagination. Such places can and have been visited during altered states of consciousness, which for the sojourner, it may be argued, are just as real. And such places have been known to mystics in all cultures throughout the ages, right down to the practitioners of the so-called ‘new age’ movements of today.

Indeed, perhaps it is to such places that every mason must travel if they want to quarry material for the construction of the true Masonic temple.

From Freemasonry Today, winter 2007/2008

At least in my opinion, those types of views represent more of a Deist worldview than a Catholic one.

Hopefully of interest. And hopefully written without an excessive amount of tinfoil.

314 posted on 05/30/2009 7:57:35 AM PDT by markomalley (Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus)
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To: swmobuffalo

So George Washington was not a Christian?

The founders of Baylor Baptist university?

There are so many lies about masons it is hard to know where to start.

I am a Mason. I am also a follow of Jesus Christ, the only son of the God of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob.


315 posted on 05/30/2009 8:13:38 AM PDT by TheThirdRuffian (Defend America from the Communist.)
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To: tessalu

Nonsense. Never heard of any of that.


316 posted on 05/30/2009 8:15:26 AM PDT by TheThirdRuffian (Defend America from the Communist.)
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To: dangus

The Templars were Roman Catholic until the corrupt pope (really the French king, the pope was just a wimp) betrayed them.

The largest intact branch went to Scotland and became protestant.


317 posted on 05/30/2009 8:18:20 AM PDT by TheThirdRuffian (Defend America from the Communist.)
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To: Kansas58; narses

Well, I would have to disagree with your statement that Popes or the Church have reversed themselves on doctrine. There has been development or unfolding of doctrine, but not reversal.

Also, no intelligent Catholic believes that all popes go to Heaven. Dante depicts numerous popes and bishops in hell, and it was an early saying that “the floor of Hell is paved with the skulls of bishops.”

The distinction is that although some popes were sinners, had illegitimate children, and so forth, they never officially promulgated false doctrine.

Two times in history they came close: when Arian bishop was made pope at the urging of the Emperor—but he then reversed himself and never promulgated Arian doctrine. And when the Spiritual Franciscans argued against the immortality of the soul (as distinguished from the resurrection of the body), and the pope was about to promulgate their heresy when a mission from the University of Paris dissuaded him from doing it.

Sure, the popes often are mistaken on prudential matters and in their personal lives. But not on the basic teachings of the faith, as Jesus promised to Peter.


318 posted on 05/30/2009 8:35:02 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Elsie

> Surely there is nothing wrong with showing a subject from differing viewpoints; is there?

There certainly is, if by doing so you cast unfair aspersions on innocent parties. You know precisely what you are doing, and you know why, and quite frankly it is shameful.


319 posted on 05/30/2009 8:40:12 AM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (Is mise an ceann-cinnidh. Cha ghéill mi do dhuine. Fàg am bealach.)
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To: Cicero
Actually, if you look at the various Councils of the Church, we have had some Councils which have completely reversed the PREVIOUS Council.

That, I am afraid, is an historical fact.

320 posted on 05/30/2009 8:43:12 AM PDT by Kansas58
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