The Future Break Up of the United States of America

Post Scripts ^ | 5/7/09 | Don Koenig

[matt1234]

In response to your question at post #42, "why isn't the secessionist movement father along?": lack of leadership. I think a great leader could rally millions.

I can't say whether or not seccession will occur. I hope it doesn't. I'd much rather see sanity restored peacefully. However, I have my doubts as to whether the two dominant political wings are reconcilable. My approach is: pray for the best, prepare for the worst.

[OneVike]

Yeah I don't much like that first map. I posted another map that a Russian Prof drew up, but even his is off. As I said in post #27 Alaska would probably become a separate state, they have the resources and they are far enough away from the continental states to get away with it much easier then Texas will actually

i may mess around in photo shop and come up with my own idea of what i think will happen. It might be fun to see what i end up with any way. Maybe I'll do a vanity post to see what everyone come up with. We can get 40,000 different maps from all the Freeper who care about this. That might a fun excursion in a what-if-scenario.

[GonzoGOP]

why isn't the secessionist movement father along

Remember that in 1860 most people in the south thought secession wouldn't happen either. But once the first shots had been fired, and they were forced to take sides, they opted out. Arkansas and Virginia went out on very thin margins.

If it happens the cause will be something small and stupid. If it was big and important Obama and his cronies would be ready for the event and crush it before it gained momentum. But if, like the tea parties that started with a business reporter loosing his cool on the air, it comes out of no place and goes viral we could have a new Fort Sumpter on our hands before anybody realizes it. Then people will have to take sides. There is no way to stay on the fence when someone sets fire to the boards.

[El Gato]

Besides, when the bastich starts to smell you can always fire up a tree.

good point. Still, plenty of gasoline around for the cremation. Although that's a bit volatile and one might want to use diesel, JetA or kerosene instead.

[humblegunner]

Got six gallons of diesel reserved, it lights quite calmly.

[KrisKrinkle]

“California will just join Mexico”

As might some parts of New Mexico, Arizona, and Texas given that scenario

[magooey]

If the economy tanks big time (depression type stuff, 30% decline in GDP, 25% unemployment), then people will be in a daze and will be in no mood for the sacrifice a revolution will take.

I just do not see it, sorry.

An what happened in Germany in the 1930's? They found a solution, alright.

[Travis McGee]

That sounds vaguely familiar.

[magooey]

A breakup of our democracy would be civil war, and that would require a complete failure of our democratic system....there would be nothing but ashes. If it comes to that, I imagine all civilization will be reduced along with us...there is no post-democratic-American civilization...it's lights out for us all.

The threat of nuclear Civil War may strangely keep matters from taking the worst turns. Just like during the Cold War, MAD kept the major players in line, with most of the bloodshed on the periphery.

We are assuming rational actors too, not Mohammedan fanatics. Obama becomes a wild card if he is willing to use nukes to preserve his rule.

[BooBoo1000]

Yes but you have to raise up a leader,that has some Ba**s. Hitler knew how to get people enthused. He blamed all of German’s problems on the Jews, and promised the people full employment, ( which he did) ie AutoBahn, Was effort, everyone had a job. We don't have have leaders of his ability to empower people, all we have is a bunch of crooks just interested in lining their own pockets.

[sport]

They will find the same solution that they did in Germany.

In fact, it is being implemented while we are on the internet. They just have not executed it yet. Pay attention to events in Octorber, November, and December.

[KrisKrinkle]

“But since much of these things are already in progress or done, why isn't the secessionist movement father along?”

Maybe because so far it has a preponderance of big talkers. They'll need people who are willing to use the words “we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor” or people who have none of that to lose. They may get enough of those people with some sort of catalyst or incident. They'll also need people who know how to actually run things. They may have more trouble with that.

[magooey]

... We don't have have leaders of his ability to empower people, all we have is a bunch of crooks just interested in lining their own pockets.

Man, is that giving the Devil his due! Never thought of Obummer as a pale version of the fascist tyrant type. :)

[KrisKrinkle]

“What about the military?”

In the War Between the States many Southerners were allowed to leave the US Military and subsequently fought for the Confederacy.

“OK, each state now has its National Guard. Can’t the president call them to national service and put down any rebellion by a state government?”

Sure, the president can call them. If you mean can he have the National Guard put down a rebellion by a state government when it is the home state of those Guardsmen, that’s problematical. Many or all of them might fight on the side of their home state. If you mean can he send in the National Guard from another state, that could be problematical too. If we’d had the National Guard at the beginning of the Civil War, before North Carolina seceded, would the North Carolina Guard have helped put down the rebellion by the State of South Carolina? I kind of doubt they would have followed those orders.

“Then too, what about the national military already stationed in the states. Couldn’t the federal government use them to prevent states from splitting off (Civil War?).”

I don’t think there are enough of them in any one State if the people of the State get involved, and I doubt the State Government would take action if it didn’t have a substantial number of the people behind it.

During the War Between the States the national military in terms of the Regular Army wasn’t large enough to do the job either. Volunteers from the Northern states bore the brunt as opposed to the Regular Army.

[matt1234]

Yes but you have to raise up a leader,that has some Ba**s.

Exactly right. Today most of our "leaders" are opportunists, chameleons, and cowards. They run away from decision making and kick the can down the road (e.g., SS, budget deficit, etc.). They refuse to take a controversial position. They bow before political correctness. They are more interested in themselves than their constituents or their country.

Now, if there was a movement with a real leader who had traditional values, integrity and bravery, that would different altogether. People could get behind that kind of leader.

[SharpRightTurn]

I read today that Maine is one more northeastern state that is in the process of legalizing homosexual marriage.

I am ready for a separation of the states. I live within the very red section of the country. I do not want to be in a country where the majority is blue and gives us the likes of Zero, Kennedy, Sanders, Leahy, Franken, et al.

Let us part peacefully. Any state that wants to leave has the inherent right to do so, otherwise it is tyranny.

[SkyDancer]

OK so what about Fort Bragg? Or say Parris Island, military training bases have lots of troops ... So what if North Carolina wants to leave the Union? Same thing all over again?

[BobL]

“It only happens when states start refusing orders from Washington. But theoretically, all that does is return us to a 10th Ammendment America, which is to say, America as it is supposed to work.”

True...but what makes you think that Washington will roll over when their laws are ignored? I mean, why would they respect the 10th Amendment while ignoring the other 9?

[BobL]

“I agree that we are near hopelessly divided. But since much of these things are already in progress or done, why isn’t the secessionist movement father along?”

Because we have our Plasmas. That simple. Take away the Plasmas and turn this country into Third World status, you will have revolt...it is assured.

[unkus]

Thanks OneVike