Posted on 07/22/2006 10:43:33 PM PDT by numapompilius
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/
"It's vile. Don't make excuses."
You are attempting to compare an idiot "comedian" with a few other idiots to CAIR, Hezbollah, Hamas, the Muslim Brotherhood,..... They're vile. Stop making excuses.
BTW, if you somehow think that is at all common in the United States, then you don't live here.
"What do you mean by that?"
Look at the numbers.
None that you choose to pay attention to.
Shinto was the state religion of Imperial Japan. Bushido was an outgrowth of that.
I was right. Bushido, the code of military conduct and samurai ethics that was formalized during the Tokugawa Shogunate, had been in a period of steep decline since the 1868 Meiji Restoration.
My printed copy is Maulana Muhammad Ali's translation. I really don't care enough about this argument to quote from it.
You obviously don't care enough to see if prophetofdoom.net is even quoting what it claims to be quoting. Maulana Muhammad Ali's translation of 66:1 reads: "O Prophet, why dost thou forbid (thyself) that which Allah has made lawful for thee? Seekest thou to please thy wives? And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful."
Which is more or less the same as the Yusuf Ali translation (one of the "standards", alone with Shakir and Pickthal) I quoted above. It doesn't match your preconceived notions that all cultures are equal and 3rd world ones are more equal.
This from someone who believes that:
“Allah has already sanctioned for you the dissolution of your vows.” (prophetofdoom.net's translation of 66:1)
is the same as:
"O Prophet, why dost thou forbid (thyself) that which Allah has made lawful for thee? Seekest thou to please thy wives? And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful." (Maulana Muhammad Ali's translation of 66:1)
So when two sentences are "equal" to one sentence, questions are "equal" to declarative statements, the dissolution of one's vows is "equal" to keeping them, when sloppy cut-and-paste is "equal" to dedicated research, and a lie laid bare is "equal" to the cold hard facts ... then you can consider lecturing me about some cultures being more equal than others.
Orwell must be spinning in his grave after that Animal Farm reference.
Actually, I'm saying that the crowd's reaction is testament to an undercurrent of anti-Semitism that is a problem in America today. No, it's not Hizbullah rockets raining down on civilians, but is a real problem. Don't try to sweep it under the rug or dismiss it. It's not an Arizona bar and "a few other idiots" that think this way. It's groups like Hamas and their apologists (like you!) that make anti-Semitism commonplace.
BTW, if you somehow think that is at all common in the United States, then you don't live here.
Well, I do live here and I have been shocked by the number of anti-Semetic remarks hissed at me and my Jewish friends in the past five years.
Ignore if you want, but not at our country's peril.
"Ignore if you want, but not at our country's peril."
Ignoring the threat that Islam presents WOULD be at our country's peril.
"It's groups like Hamas and their apologists (like you!) that make anti-Semitism commonplace."
I'm an Hamas apologist? ROTFLMAO!
"Well, I do live here and I have been shocked by the number of anti-Semetic remarks hissed at me and my Jewish friends in the past five years."
Perhaps you should stop hanging around your Muslim friends.
KYAOTF! You seem to use their war against Jews in Israel to convince people to ignore the growing anti-Semitism here. When it becomes acceptable to publicly sing "Throw the Jew down the well/so my country can be free/you must grab him by his horns/then we have a big party," it will be easier to convince people that bombing Israeli villages is also acceptable.
Perhaps you should stop hanging around your Muslim friends.
I don't know what kind of friends you have, but mine aren't anit-Semites, no matter what their religion.
"You seem to use their war against Jews in Israel to convince people to ignore the growing anti-Semitism her"
Most of that I see is on college campuses. I never see it anywhere else in the country. What campus are you on?
"When it becomes acceptable to publicly sing "Throw the Jew down the well/so my country can be free/you must grab him by his horns/then we have a big party," it will be easier to convince people that bombing Israeli villages is also acceptable."
It isn't publically acceptable to do this.
"I don't know what kind of friends you have, but mine aren't anit-Semites, no matter what their religion."
So, they support Israel against Hezbollah?
Some Detroit papers might be a good start.
The Imperial Japanese Army practiced a variant of Bushido that was the called the "Spiritual Training" of the army. The office corps considered themselves modern samurai.
And that's what was behind the Japanese war effort for 15 years? Because some officers wanted to turn the clock back to the early 19th century?
I don't reference or use prophetofdoom.net. I don't recall ever even visiting it.
"I did not cut and paste from that website, prophetofdoom.net." Yeah, right. Your quotations are the same, in the same order, with the same translations, and the same mistakes.
So, you admit now that you aren't a Westerner?
WTF?
Oh, and the Ali translation lists 66:2 as "Allah has indeed sanctioned the expiation of your oaths; and Allah is your Patron, and He is the Knowing, the Wise."
Pretty much what you quoted from prophetofdoom.net.
Which means that prophetofdoom.net got the citation wrong, and you blindly copied it. Do you often sign your name to things that you don't verify?
Also, do you know the meaning of "expiate"?
You know, most prophets - particularly the Biblical ones that you deign to list along with Mohammad, tended to live ascetic lives. Allah seems to spend most of his time in the Koran making sure that Mohammad had enough treasure and all the women he wanted.... Puzzling, that.
I'm sure David and Solomon would be surprised to hear this.
It's almost like he made it up to have sanction to take his nephew's wife, to provide an example. In fact, quite often he saw something he wanted and the next day claimed Allah had given him a revelation.....
If you don't approve of Muhammad's life, then by all means, don't follow his religion. In the meantime, understand that some Americans think your views are strange, heretical and violent ... but, if you are an American citizen in good standing with ICE, you won't get deported.
I have a suspicion that you look for it among Muslim students and professors on college campuses. As for the rest of the country, well, you just saw a clip from Arizona.
It isn't publically acceptable to do this.
Did you watch the clip? Because an open-mic night is a fairly public event. Or are you saying that anti-Semetism is vetter expressed privately?
So, they support Israel against Hezbollah?
Of course.
As I have been saying for years, Islam is a socio-political despotism masquerading as a religion. It represents a tyranny so evil and vile that it would warm the heart of Orwell's Big Brother.
"I have a suspicion that you look for it among Muslim students and professors on college campuses. As for the rest of the country, well, you just saw a clip from Arizona."
I've never seen anything like that in a public venue that wasn't a pro-Palestinian rally or some other nutty group.
"Did you watch the clip? Because an open-mic night is a fairly public event. Or are you saying that anti-Semetism is vetter expressed privately?"
For all we know, it was a put-on-job by this comedian to make Americans look bad.
"Of course."
I can't say I believe you.
"Some Detroit papers might be a good start."
Detroit Free Press ran a poll a few years ago that said that 80% of the Muslim respondents wanted Shariah in the United States.
"And that's what was behind the Japanese war effort for 15 years? Because some officers wanted to turn the clock back to the early 19th century"
That and their belief that they were superior and should, at least, rule the Co-Prosperity Sphere.
"WTF?"
Sounds like it, from your arguments.
"Which means that prophetofdoom.net got the citation wrong, and you blindly copied it. Do you often sign your name to things that you don't verify?"
I don't believe that there is a codified reference system enforced across all translations of the Koran.
"Also, do you know the meaning of "expiate"?"
Yes, I do. "Excuse" works just as well. So does "abolish" and "absolve".
"I'm sure David and Solomon would be surprised to hear this."
David and Solomon were kings, not prophets.
"If you don't approve of Muhammad's life, then by all means, don't follow his religion. In the meantime, understand that some Americans think your views are strange, heretical and violent ... but, if you are an American citizen in good standing with ICE, you won't get deported."
Oh, that's funny. Most Americans agree with me, if polls are any indicator. In fact, most Americans would consider Mohammad to be "strange, heretical and violent". As to being deported, revocations of naturalization have recently been applied to quite a few Muslims of late... Something to do with all those Muslim "charities" that fund terrorist groups.
Well, you have now. And it's not pretty.
For all we know, it was a put-on-job by this comedian to make Americans look bad.
Well, those Americans did look bad. They looked like anti-Semites.
I can't say I believe you.
Wouldn't fit your view of what Muslims are like, would it?
""Did you watch the clip? Because an open-mic night is a fairly public event. Or are you saying that anti-Semetism is vetter expressed privately?""
Oh, one thing. Considering where he claimed he was from, "Borat" was portraying a 3rd world Muslim Kazakh.
"Well, you have now. And it's not pretty."
Neither are those pro-Pali rallies.
"Well, those Americans did look bad. They looked like anti-Semites."
Just like at those pro-Pali rallies.
"Wouldn't fit your view of what Muslims are like, would it?"
It would fit within your propaganda, though.
The thing of it is, "Borat" had to (and obviously did) hunt for people like that for his show. Or he could've just visted Harvard.
Must have been a strike year... Nevertheless, I would need to see a citation to believe you.
That and their belief that they were superior and should, at least, rule the Co-Prosperity Sphere.
Far more the latter than the former. Bushido, which valued honesty and reserve, does not fit with an imperialistic push. What the officers saw when they looked in the mirror did not shape Japanese foreign policy like the fruits of industrialism and imperialism realized in the Russo-Japanese War.
Sounds like it, from your arguments.
When you tried to say that 66:1 = 66:2 and then accused me of moral relativity, I called it doubleplusungood. That makes me a "non-Westerner"? What does that mean, anyway?
I don't believe that there is a codified reference system enforced across all translations of the Koran.
I believe if you want to quote something, it's your responsibility to quote it correctly. If not, the consequences are upon you.
Yes, I do. "Excuse" works just as well. So does "abolish" and "absolve".
A better defintion is, from dictionary.com:
To make amends for; to atone for.
Expiate comes from Latin expiare, from ex-, here used intensively, + piare, to seek to appease by an offering, to make good, to atone for, from pius, dutiful.
In other words, to excuse by making amends.
David and Solomon were kings, not prophets.
Fair enough, but they are also considered to be divinely-inspired authors of Biblical books.
Oh, that's funny. Most Americans agree with me, if polls are any indicator."
Sometimes they are, but when dealing with hypotheticals ("Do you support the expulsion of your fellow-citizens based on religious preference?") they are not as reliable as when dealing with concrete issues.
As to being deported, revocations of naturalization have recently been applied to quite a few Muslims of late... Something to do with all those Muslim "charities" that fund terrorist groups.
If a naturalized citizen breaks the law in such a way that naturalization can be revoked, that's ICE's job. It's also very different that expelling law-abiding citizens (native and naturalized) because you don't like their religion.
It's a semantic quibble, but IIRC, "Borat" is actually described as "Kazakhstani". The term refers to any citizen of Kazakhstan, regardless of religion or ethnic background.
Also, as a former Soviet republic, it's technically the 2nd world.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.